Nah. They'll get Ekblad next year and be just good enough to miss out on Mcdavid.

I strongly suspect Mcdavid winds up being a Coyote somehow. Just a hunch.
- TheTaoOfSemenko

Just prior to the coyotes winning the 2015 draft lottery, Gary announces that an ownership group in southern ontario is prepared to buy the coyotes and pay the city of Glendale renumeration for losing all that money over the past 20 years. They move the franchise to a shiny new rink in the Toronto suburbs.

With the first pick in the the 2015 draft, the Ontario Lakers select from the, Erie otters, Connor mcdavid.

Book it.

Or how about this: Let's not assume that simple stat production over different years by different players at different ages on different teams isn't that effectively compared.

draw your own conclusions

Yeah, that makes sense considering that's an entire list of bottom pairing dmen that don't spend much time on the ice.

Example: Jonathan Blum gets 10 shifts. His goalie only sees 1 shot per shift. On the tenth shift, the shot goes in. His SV% is .900
- mochoson

so
why are Mcquaid, and Redden's on-ice SV%s lower than Chara's?
why are scuderi and greene's lower than Doughty's?
why is Ian cole's lower than Pietrangelo's?
why is stralman's lower than Mcdonagh's?
why are klein and Ellis' lower than Weber's?
why is bouillon's lower than Subban's?

Just prior to the coyotes winning the 2015 draft lottery, Gary announces that an ownership group in southern ontario is prepared to buy the coyotes and pay the city of Glendale renumeration for losing all that money over the past 20 years. They move the franchise to a shiny new rink in the Toronto suburbs.

With the first pick in the the 2015 draft, the Ontario Lakers select from the, Erie otters, Connor mcdavid.

Book it.
- unkydav

if ontario gets another team than Red deer gets a team

so
why are Mcquaid, and Redden's on-ice SV%s lower than Chara's?
why are scuderi and greene's lower than Doughty's?
why is Ian cole's lower than Pietrangelo's?
why is stralman's lower than Mcdonagh's?
why are klein, josi, and Ellis' lower than Weber's?
why is bouillon's lower than Subban's?
- TheNugeIsHuge

There is more to hockey than stats man.

There is more to hockey than stats man.
- Marshalle

we're talking about on-ice SV% bud. Go play in the flyers thread.

And thank you. I watch about 120 games a year and it takes a sh*t load of time. I don't see how mochoson can watch 450 games a year while still employed

Just prior to the coyotes winning the 2015 draft lottery, Gary announces that an ownership group in southern ontario is prepared to buy the coyotes and pay the city of Glendale renumeration for losing all that money over the past 20 years. They move the franchise to a shiny new rink in the Toronto suburbs.

With the first pick in the the 2015 draft, the Ontario Lakers select from the, Erie otters, Connor mcdavid.

Book it.
- unkydav

Why do you think the coyotes will win the lottery? - they won't be that bad. They probably won't be top 3 in their division, but they will be battling for the wildcard, every year.

so
why are Mcquaid, and Redden's on-ice SV%s lower than Chara's?
why are scuderi and greene's lower than Doughty's?
why is Ian cole's lower than Pietrangelo's?
why is stralman's lower than Mcdonagh's?
why are klein and Ellis' lower than Weber's?
why is bouillon's lower than Subban's?
- TheNugeIsHuge

Are you 18 years old?

There is more to hockey than stats man.
- Marshalle

Don't even bother

Based on what? Your guess?
And you really should know that Hall is 21...
- BoBBeR56

Based on common sense. Pretty simple. If you dont believe me go and poll in other threads Very few will agree with you. Its not that Kessel isnt good. Its just that Hall is already almost as good and will likely continue to get better.

Based on common sense. Pretty simple. If you dont believe me go and poll in other threads Very few will agree with you. Its not that Kessel isnt good. Its just that Hall is already almost as good and will likely continue to get better.
- TheTaoOfSemenko

It's as much the age as the extra dimensions to his game that puts him ahead imo.

If we had to pick one of the three to start a team around, i dont think there's much question most would take hall first

Are you 18 years old?
- mochoson

?
Good rebuttal bud. I prove your point to be wrong n you have nothing

It's as much the age as the extra dimensions to his game that puts him ahead imo.

If we had to pick one of the three to start a team around, i dont think there's much question most would take hall first
- hugefemale dog77

I think the fact of the matter is that him saying "Kessel > any Oilers forward" is admitting defeat, because the lack of specificity implies that there are a couple Oilers forwards that are in the running. Even if Kessel were better, I'd rather have 4 forwards that are "almost" as good as Kessel and better than any other TO forward.

I think the fact of the matter is that him saying "Kessel > any Oilers forward" is admitting defeat, because the lack of specificity implies that there are a couple Oilers forwards that are in the running. Even if Kessel were better, I'd rather have 4 forwards that are "almost" as good as Kessel and better than any other TO forward.
- Morris

I didnt look at it that way. Well said.

Oilers rule

It's as much the age as the extra dimensions to his game that puts him ahead imo.

If we had to pick one of the three to start a team around, i dont think there's much question most would take hall first
- hugefemale dog77

That's all I was really trying to say.

?
Good rebuttal bud. I prove your point to be wrong n you have nothing
- TheNugeIsHuge

It obviously wasn't a rebuttal, it was a question. The fact that you wanna be right all the time and point out I have nothing on top of not answering the question, answers the question.

All of those dmen from your second list having lower percentages should make sense, considering they are nowhere near the defenders of the counter parts you listed.

However, if a third pairing defender like Keaton Ellerby has a higher on ice SV% than Doughty (your first list), it's probably only because he's not on the ice anywhere near as much.

I shouldn't have to spell this out for you, your looking all of them up yourself. The entire game of hockey and how good each player is can't be explained through statistics. Learn to understand this and well coversate further.

Your entire point was SV% is all goalies. So, what....Quick magically plays better for Keaton (frank)ing Ellerby than he does for Doughty and Scuderi, and better for Doughty than Scuderi to go even further?

That's all I was really trying to say.
- TheTaoOfSemenko

And u were right.

I think a numbers/age argument can be made when comparing ebs and kessel as they're very similar players.
But while numbers comparisons can be used for hall as well, its much more than that. Its pretty plain to see imo

It obviously wasn't a rebuttal, it was a question. The fact that you wanna be right all the time and point out I have nothing on top of not answering the question, answers the question.

All of those dmen from your second list having lower percentages should make sense, considering they are nowhere near the defenders of the counter parts you listed.

However, if a third pairing defender like Keaton Ellerby has a higher on ice SV% than Doughty (your first list), it's probably only because he's not on the ice anywhere near as much.

I shouldn't have to spell this out for you, your looking all of them up yourself. The entire game of hockey and how good each player is can't be explained through statistics. Learn to understand this and well coversate further.

Your entire point was SV% is all goalies. So, what....Quick magically plays better for Keaton (frank)ing Ellerby than he does for Doughty and Scuderi, and better for Doughty than Scuderi to go even further?
- mochoson

I mean, theoretically, it probably can. They'd just be ridiculously convoluted statistics that would be hard to interpret, calculate, explain, etc.

No sport can be reduced to bite-sized statistics, but advanced mathematicians could, upon dedicating themselves to studying and collecting decades of hockey data, concievably explain "talent' to other mathematicians, all things being equal.

I mean, theoretically, it probably can. They'd just be ridiculously convoluted statistics that would be hard to interpret, calculate, explain, etc.

No sport can be reduced to bite-sized statistics, but advanced mathematicians could, upon dedicating themselves to studying and collecting decades of hockey data, concievably explain "talent' to other mathematicians, all things being equal.
- Morris

I think non-linear mathematics could come close. No one would understand it except guys named Elliot and Hans that have never worn a pair of skates, but it's possible.

I mean, theoretically, it probably can. They'd just be ridiculously convoluted statistics that would be hard to interpret, calculate, explain, etc.

No sport can be reduced to bite-sized statistics, but advanced mathematicians could, upon dedicating themselves to studying and collecting decades of hockey data, concievably explain "talent' to other mathematicians, all things being equal.
- Morris

Fuk reducing it to just numbers. How does one explain intangibles?
If you've played the game or watched it a high level for any length of time, you know there's so much more that goes into it.

How do we quantify heart, mean streak, grit, toughness to play against, coachability, character etc etc?

Forgetting these parts of the game when comparing players does a huge disservice to the player and the sport

Fuk reducing it to just numbers. How does one explain intangibles?
If you've played the game or watched it a high level for any length of time, you know there's so much more that goes into it.

How do we quantify heart, mean streak, grit, toughness to play against, coachability, character etc etc?

Forgetting these parts of the game when comparing players does a huge disservice to the player and the sport
- hugefemale dog77

Thank you.

I can't just come out and say "Well I'm a college player, trust me, there's way more to it then that", that's just douchey.

Fuk reducing it to just numbers. How does one explain intangibles?
If you've played the game or watched it a high level for any length of time, you know there's so much more that goes into it.

How do we quantify heart, mean streak, grit, toughness to play against, coachability, character etc etc?

Forgetting these parts of the game when comparing players does a huge disservice to the player and the sport
- hugefemale dog77

I think what it comes down to is are you using the stats to help your point or are the stats themselves the point.

Thank you.

I can't just come out and say "Well I'm a college player, trust me, there's way more to it then that", that's just douchey.
- mochoson

DeVry doesn't count.

DeVry doesn't count.
- TheTaoOfSemenko

See now thats funny. Gotta be a certain age i think though.

Fuk reducing it to just numbers. How does one explain intangibles?
If you've played the game or watched it a high level for any length of time, you know there's so much more that goes into it.

How do we quantify heart, mean streak, grit, toughness to play against, coachability, character etc etc?

Forgetting these parts of the game when comparing players does a huge disservice to the player and the sport
- hugefemale dog77

Yeah I agree with you. It's not useful to use exclusively math in evaluating players. But theoretically with enough time and resources they could mathematically quantify those kinds of intangibles. Again, using resources that would far outstrip their own efficiency and that would probably only ever be comprehensible by other mathematicians. I'm talking AI kinda stuff here