The numbers mean zilch to me. Pay him a buck just to keep Kesels production up.
- honesthockey

There is your problem. They mean something to everyone else.
Nobody will pay bozak 5M because he isn't worth it. Money matters.
But if you ignore it, then I see why you want him. But if money doesn't matter, we could have Crosby there.

if we are able to find a more capable two way center, who plays well at both ends of the ice, then he should replace bozak. saying kadri can replace him really isn't the smartest idea. sure he is better offensively, but that doesn't compare to how much worse he is defensively and on the faceoffs. kadri needs more seasoning before he can play with kessel.

say we were to get vinny, his faceoffs are equivalent to bozak, his offensive production is greater, but his defensive play is lacking. if carlyle can change that aspect of his game, pairing him with kessel will be fine.

someone who i think would replace bozak easily, and might not be to expensive to get, is pavelski. sure, you wouldnt consider him a true #1, but his offense is better then bozak, his faceoffs equivalent, and he plays defensively.
- matt1337

Now that makes sense! The lame brains who see numbers only are (frank)ing clueless.

After a 40 game season, I'd be happier with Kadri than Bozak.

We're forgetting theres 3 players to that one line. Everyone wants someone who can play with kesselm. Well guess what, everybody and their grandma can play with kessel and put up points. Proven by Grandma Bozak.

But Kadri has proven he can play well in the playoffs with Kessel with a small sample size.
But also proved him and Lupul are awesome together.
Kadri for line one is the best bet after Vinny goes elsewhere.
- UsernameUnknown

Yes sir! Bozak did a decent job but we are better off with Kadri#1, Grabbo#2, Bolland #3
I'm just thinking if kessel made Bozak into a 5 mil a year player, what will he do for Kadri

Like every line in the NHL. Crosby works thus the line works.
- honesthockey

It's true.

There is your problem. They mean something to everyone else.
Nobody will pay bozak 5M because he isn't worth it. Money matters.
But if you ignore it, then I see why you want him. But if money doesn't matter, we could have Crosby there.
- UsernameUnknown

Money doesn't matter. It's value and you find ways to make it work. (frank) kept hearing how screwed Chicago was when they had to loss fat boy Byfuglien. You re-adjust and go. Fans worrying about money is (frank)ing retarded.

Yes sir! Bozak did a decent job but we are better off with Kadri#1, Grabbo#2, Bolland #3
I'm just thinking if kessel made Bozak into a 5 mil a year player, what will he do for Kadri
- coolehmon41

Make him a - 25

if we are able to find a more capable two way center, who plays well at both ends of the ice, then he should replace bozak. saying kadri can replace him really isn't the smartest idea. sure he is better offensively, but that doesn't compare to how much worse he is defensively and on the faceoffs. kadri needs more seasoning before he can play with kessel.

say we were to get vinny, his faceoffs are equivalent to bozak, his offensive production is greater, but his defensive play is lacking. if carlyle can change that aspect of his game, pairing him with kessel will be fine.

someone who i think would replace bozak easily, and might not be to expensive to get, is pavelski. sure, you wouldnt consider him a true #1, but his offense is better then bozak, his faceoffs equivalent, and he plays defensively.
- matt1337

IMO lecavalier is perfect, his size and ability to protect the puck are exactly what we need. I'm not sure he's as bad defensively as people think either.

Funny read.

The Wennberg part is the best.

http://sports.yahoo.com/b...hotographs-155531390.html

Kessel has better numbers without Bozak as his center than he has with him as his center.

And the Bozak injury in game 7. Kessel and Kadi both had 2 points each that game. Bozak being hurt didn't cost them the game. The team being awful collectively in the last 10 minutes did though.


- daeth

well that shoud do it, or not

Now that makes sense! The lame brains who see numbers only are (frank)ing clueless.
- honesthockey

is this the first time you've ever agreed with someone on hockeybuzz? i kind of feel honoured lol

but people need to realize a line can't just be all offense, cause what if they get hammered in our zone? they will all be running around like chickens with their heads cut off and be stuck in the zone until reimer/bernier covers the puck or someone will take a stupid penalty from being too tired

they might still produce, but would probably allow more goals then they score

is this the first time you've ever agreed with someone on hockeybuzz? i kind of feel honoured lol

but people need to realize a line can't just be all offense, cause what if they get hammered in our zone? they will all be running around like chickens with their heads cut off and be stuck in the zone until reimer/bernier covers the puck or someone will take a stupid penalty from being too tired

they might still produce, but would probably allow more goals then they score
- matt1337

And that's been proven.

IMO lecavalier is perfect, his size and ability to protect the puck are exactly what we need. I'm not sure he's as bad defensively as people think either.
- ky678468

if he was so good defensively, why did he only play 7:17 sh toi in 39 games this year? thats an average of 0:11 sh toi/g

is this the first time you've ever agreed with someone on hockeybuzz? i kind of feel honoured lol

but people need to realize a line can't just be all offense, cause what if they get hammered in our zone? they will all be running around like chickens with their heads cut off and be stuck in the zone until reimer/bernier covers the puck or someone will take a stupid penalty from being too tired

they might still produce, but would probably allow more goals then they score
- matt1337

Kessel's on-ice goals for and against avg numbers since 2009 are better without Bozak than they are with him. Bozak's defensive abilities are grossly overrated.

http://stats.hockeyanalys...ue&season=2009-13&sit=5v5

Kessel since 2009 with Bozak (on-ice ES stats)

Goals for per 20 minutes: 0.895
Goals against per 20 minutes: 0.975

Kessel since 2009 without Bozak (on-ice ES stats)

Goals for per 20 minutes: 1.043
Goals against per 20 minutes: 0.977


^^ bump these stats

And that's been proven.
- honesthockey

they can't just replace bozak with anyone, it needs to be a good two way center

http://theleafsnation.com...sters-tyler-bozak-edition
- daeth

Boom please explain HH

Boom please explain HH
- jribout

They're just stats and I'm being a poo-y head for using them. Gotta go by your gut feeling or you're just being a stat whoring loser.

Agreed. The second anyone can prove they can be on the ice when Kessel produces like he has move Bozak. Until then you gotta keep him.
- honesthockey

There was a stat out there that showed Kessels production with Bozak, and with other centers on the team. Kessel was substantially better when not playing with Bozak... too lazy to find it right now though..

see you guys are already on it... good job

Kessel's on-ice goals for and against avg numbers since 2009 are better without Bozak than they are with him. Bozak's defensive abilities are grossly overrated.

http://stats.hockeyanalys...ue&season=2009-13&sit=5v5

Kessel since 2009 with Bozak (on-ice ES stats)

Goals for per 20 minutes: 0.895
Goals against per 20 minutes: 0.975

Kessel since 2009 without Bozak (on-ice ES stats)

Goals for per 20 minutes: 1.043
Goals against per 20 minutes: 0.977


^^ bump these stats
- daeth

you think carlyle doesnt have these? how about look at these stats for the past 2 years, not since 2009.

if he was so good defensively, why did he only play 7:17 sh toi in 39 games this year? thats an average of 0:11 sh toi/g
- matt1337

Probably because he's not on tampa's pk. David Krejci plays 0:19 sh toi/g and I would consider him defensively responsible as well. I don't think he's mike peca i said he's better than people give him credit for

Kessel's on-ice goals for and against avg numbers since 2009 are better without Bozak than they are with him. Bozak's defensive abilities are grossly overrated.

http://stats.hockeyanalys...ue&season=2009-13&sit=5v5

Kessel since 2009 with Bozak (on-ice ES stats)

Goals for per 20 minutes: 0.895
Goals against per 20 minutes: 0.975

Kessel since 2009 without Bozak (on-ice ES stats)

Goals for per 20 minutes: 1.043
Goals against per 20 minutes: 0.977


^^ bump these stats
- daeth

I do find it hilarious that you make a great case using facts, yet HH, Mr. I know everything, dismisses it because it goes against his argument, then at the same time calls people asshats. Thank you for providing these links, I learned something new.

There was a stat out there that showed Kessels production with Bozak, and with other centers on the team. Kessel was substantially better when not playing with Bozak... too lazy to find it right now though..

see you guys are already on it... good job
- orienbrady22

It's in this thread, but conveniently ignored by one poster.

Bozak looking at Condos in Winnipeg today......
- Byfuglien Ate Me

There is your problem. They mean something to everyone else.
Nobody will pay bozak 5M because he isn't worth it. Money matters.
But if you ignore it, then I see why you want him. But if money doesn't matter, we could have Crosby there.
- UsernameUnknown

you think carlyle doesnt have these? how about look at these stats for the past 2 years, not since 2009.
- matt1337

http://stats.hockeyanalys...ue&season=2010-13&sit=5v5

Since 2010

With Bozak

GF per 20: 0.868
GA per 20: 0.985

WIthout Bozak

GF per 20: 1.107
GA per 20: 1.061

Negative goals for and against with Bozak still, positive goals for and against without Bozak still.

I agree 100%. My point all along is until someone proves they can keep Kessels production up you gotta keep Bozak there.
- honesthockey

Kadri proved it in the playoffs so I guess he should continue to get a chance until he proves he cannot do it....

Also Kessel's jump in points came with the addition of Lupul and JVR.....