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Forums :: Blog World :: Bill Meltzer: Meltzer's Musings: Bernier, Bryzgalov, Philly Draft Demographics
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Jsaquella
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Bringing Hexy Back
Joined: 06.16.2006

Jun 24 @ 1:38 PM ET
It's doable, but it also assumes they've made a strategic decision about BSchenn.
- johndewar


I think Schenn is slated for the wing anyhow.
Jsaquella
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Bringing Hexy Back
Joined: 06.16.2006

Jun 24 @ 1:38 PM ET
Rumor has it they were teammates in Tampa Bay, too.
- BulliesPhan87

MJL
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Candyland, PA
Joined: 09.20.2007

Jun 24 @ 1:41 PM ET
he's a real PO...work. don't like that guy. pretty obvious what he's doing.
- isaiah520



What is he doing?
jak521
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Buckle Up.
Joined: 02.19.2008

Jun 24 @ 1:41 PM ET
Rumor has it they were teammates in Tampa Bay, too.
- BulliesPhan87

Stamkos to the Flyers
jak521
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Buckle Up.
Joined: 02.19.2008

Jun 24 @ 1:41 PM ET
I think Schenn is slated for the wing anyhow.
- Jsaquella

I concur
AllInForFlyers
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Call Me Sweetcheeks
Joined: 03.18.2013

Jun 24 @ 1:43 PM ET
First of all, I didn't say anything even closely related to stating Richards and Carter can't be traded.

Secondly, I disagree. Richards and Carter absolutely were difference makers on that team. Adding them, along with what they already had. Elevated the Kings to the team they are today.

- MJL


That's no different than any other team -- Richards and Carter are not special in that regard, that they were some mystical tandem destined to elevate the Kings to greatness. Dean Lombardi wanted Jarome Iginla, not Carter. Calgary just wouldn't move Iginla!

If Chicago wins the Cup, they can say the same things about Michal Handzus that you're saying about Jeff Carter -- and that goes for nearly ever other team that wins.

But for whatever reason, Mike Richards and Jeff Carter's departures from Philadelphia are viewed as something more than just hockey moves, like people should look at the end result of the Kings winning the Cup as some determining factor into the value of the trades, because Carter and Richards' quasi-mystical presence "elevated the Kings."

It's not true. Jonathan Quick elevated the Kings. Drew Doughty elevated the Kings. Carter and Richards contributed, because they're good players. And that's it! There is no more importance to them being there than that.
dingo8urbaby
Philadelphia Flyers
Joined: 06.02.2009

Jun 24 @ 1:44 PM ET
wasnt Gags roomates with Vinny back in juniors ? and they knew each other as young kids playing hockey together?
- MrBigglesworth

They're played the Tampa together for one season. The 2006 Winter Olympics. 2004 World Cup.
johndewar
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: South Jersey, NJ
Joined: 01.16.2009

Jun 24 @ 1:44 PM ET
I think Schenn is slated for the wing anyhow.
- Jsaquella


You're probably right.
jak521
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Buckle Up.
Joined: 02.19.2008

Jun 24 @ 1:45 PM ET
That's no different than any other team -- Richards and Carter are not special in that regard, that they were some mystical tandem destined to elevate the Kings to greatness. Dean Lombardi wanted Jarome Iginla, not Carter. Calgary just wouldn't move Iginla!

If Chicago wins the Cup, they can say the same things about Michal Handzus that you're saying about Jeff Carter -- and that goes for nearly ever other team that wins.

But for whatever reason, Mike Richards and Jeff Carter's departures from Philadelphia are viewed as something more than just hockey moves, like people should look at the end result of the Kings winning the Cup as some determining factor into the value of the trades, because Carter and Richards' quasi-mystical presence "elevated the Kings."

It's not true. Jonathan Quick elevated the Kings. Drew Doughty elevated the Kings. Carter and Richards contributed, because they're good players. And that's it! There is no more importance to them being there than that.

- AllInForFlyers

Adding players of Carter and Richards caliber doesnt have a quasi-mystical effect... It has a very definite effect.
MrBigglesworth
Location: PA
Joined: 01.30.2008

Jun 24 @ 1:45 PM ET
They're played the Tampa together for one season. The 2006 Winter Olympics. 2004 World Cup.
- dingo8urbaby



right, but are they BFF's ??!?
stayinthefnnet
Pittsburgh Penguins
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Joined: 01.12.2012

Jun 24 @ 1:45 PM ET
That's no different than any other team -- Richards and Carter are not special in that regard, that they were some mystical tandem destined to elevate the Kings to greatness. Dean Lombardi wanted Jarome Iginla, not Carter. Calgary just wouldn't move Iginla!

If Chicago wins the Cup, they can say the same things about Michal Handzus that you're saying about Jeff Carter -- and that goes for nearly ever other team that wins.

But for whatever reason, Mike Richards and Jeff Carter's departures from Philadelphia are viewed as something more than just hockey moves, like people should look at the end result of the Kings winning the Cup as some determining factor into the value of the trades, because Carter and Richards' quasi-mystical presence "elevated the Kings."

It's not true. Jonathan Quick elevated the Kings. Drew Doughty elevated the Kings. Carter and Richards contributed, because they're good players. And that's it! There is no more importance to them being there than that.

- AllInForFlyers


ugh if only he would have then.
MrBigglesworth
Location: PA
Joined: 01.30.2008

Jun 24 @ 1:46 PM ET
Stamkos to the Flyers
- jak521


I'd be happy with just a Pronger full recovery
Jsaquella
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Bringing Hexy Back
Joined: 06.16.2006

Jun 24 @ 1:46 PM ET
Pittsburgh Penguins ‏@penguins 1m

NEWS ALERT: The #Pens have acquired forward Harry Zolnierczyk from the Anaheim Ducks in exchange for Alex Grant
johndewar
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: South Jersey, NJ
Joined: 01.16.2009

Jun 24 @ 1:47 PM ET
wasnt Gags roomates with Vinny back in juniors ? and they knew each other as young kids playing hockey together?
- MrBigglesworth


Gagne played for Quebec and Lecavalier for Rimouski in their days in the Q.

bradleyc4
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: the jewelry is still out
Joined: 01.16.2007

Jun 24 @ 1:47 PM ET
Harry the Z to the Pens
bradleyc4
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: the jewelry is still out
Joined: 01.16.2007

Jun 24 @ 1:47 PM ET
Backstrom signs a 3-year deal with the Wild
dingo8urbaby
Philadelphia Flyers
Joined: 06.02.2009

Jun 24 @ 1:47 PM ET
That's no different than any other team -- Richards and Carter are not special in that regard, that they were some mystical tandem destined to elevate the Kings to greatness. Dean Lombardi wanted Jarome Iginla, not Carter. Calgary just wouldn't move Iginla!

If Chicago wins the Cup, they can say the same things about Michal Handzus that you're saying about Jeff Carter -- and that goes for nearly ever other team that wins.

But for whatever reason, Mike Richards and Jeff Carter's departures from Philadelphia are viewed as something more than just hockey moves, like people should look at the end result of the Kings winning the Cup as some determining factor into the value of the trades, because Carter and Richards' quasi-mystical presence "elevated the Kings."

It's not true. Jonathan Quick elevated the Kings. Drew Doughty elevated the Kings. Carter and Richards contributed, because they're good players. And that's it! There is no more importance to them being there than that.

- AllInForFlyers


Fans view the Richards and Carter Cup win the same way they view the Bob Vezina or Patrick Sharp's Cup win. After the fact complaining. You could make the argument people were more upset about the Patrick Sharp Cup in over the Richards and Carter Cup Win.
AllInForFlyers
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Call Me Sweetcheeks
Joined: 03.18.2013

Jun 24 @ 1:47 PM ET
Adding players of Carter and Richards caliber doesnt have a quasi-mystical effect... It has a very definite effect.
- jak521


Tell Columbus that adding a player of Jeff Carter's caliber has "a very definite effect."
johndewar
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: South Jersey, NJ
Joined: 01.16.2009

Jun 24 @ 1:48 PM ET
right, but are they BFF's ??!?
- MrBigglesworth


Probably not "Max Talbot/Bruno Gervais" or "Mike Richards/Jeff Carter" level BFFs.

But they certainly speak the same language.
dingo8urbaby
Philadelphia Flyers
Joined: 06.02.2009

Jun 24 @ 1:48 PM ET
Pittsburgh Penguins ‏@penguins 1m

NEWS ALERT: The #Pens have acquired forward Harry Zolnierczyk from the Anaheim Ducks in exchange for Alex Grant

- Jsaquella


Harry Z is gonna be such a cancer in that dressing room.
BulliesPhan87
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: the lone wolf of hockeybuzz
Joined: 07.31.2009

Jun 24 @ 1:48 PM ET
Pittsburgh Penguins ‏@penguins 1m

NEWS ALERT: The #Pens have acquired forward Harry Zolnierczyk from the Anaheim Ducks in exchange for Alex Grant

- Jsaquella

Oh my
MJL
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Candyland, PA
Joined: 09.20.2007

Jun 24 @ 1:48 PM ET
That's no different than any other team -- Richards and Carter are not special in that regard, that they were some mystical tandem destined to elevate the Kings to greatness. Dean Lombardi wanted Jarome Iginla, not Carter. Calgary just wouldn't move Iginla!

If Chicago wins the Cup, they can say the same things about Michal Handzus that you're saying about Jeff Carter -- and that goes for nearly ever other team that wins.

But for whatever reason, Mike Richards and Jeff Carter's departures from Philadelphia are viewed as something more than just hockey moves, like people should look at the end result of the Kings winning the Cup as some determining factor into the value of the trades, because Carter and Richards' quasi-mystical presence "elevated the Kings."

It's not true. Jonathan Quick elevated the Kings. Drew Doughty elevated the Kings. Carter and Richards contributed, because they're good players. And that's it! There is no more importance to them being there than that.

- AllInForFlyers



You're dealing with the wrong guy if you're insinuating that I think the Carter and Richards trades are anything more then just Hockey moves.

And I disagree completely, that Richards and Carter weren't immensely important to that team. They are top players that played top minutes in al situations, including the PK, PP, and at ES. The Kings aren't a Cup team without the additions of Carter and Richards. Just as they aren't a Cup team without Doughty, Kopitar, and Quick. But for some reason, some want to downplay their importance to that team for some reason.

And I'll repeat the same statement I made previously. It takes all hands on deck to win a Cup.

The fact that Lombardi may have wanted Iginla, doesn't in any way lessen the contribution and element that Carter added to that team.
MBFlyerfan
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Be nice from now on, NJ
Joined: 03.17.2006

Jun 24 @ 1:48 PM ET
Yes but Giroux also isn't winning faceoffs at a level Bergeron is every night for the Bruins. It's not like Giroux is winning 80 to 85 percent of the draws either. There is always that chance Giroux could lose a faceoff and in my opinion you have to be above average defensively if it happens. Sean Couturier was used in plenty of defensive zone draws his rookie season (5 on 5, PK, even in the playoffs). It doesn't make sense to me to be afraid to use all your players.
- dingo8urbaby


Giroux is MOST DEFINITELY not above average defensively. He is average on his best nights, and below average in most nights. He tends to lose his men in the defensive zone and rarely busts his ass getting deep on the defensive zone back check. He will improve, and he has over the course of his career, but overall he is NOT anything more than an average defender.
jak521
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Buckle Up.
Joined: 02.19.2008

Jun 24 @ 1:49 PM ET
Pittsburgh Penguins ‏@penguins 1m

NEWS ALERT: The #Pens have acquired forward Harry Zolnierczyk from the Anaheim Ducks in exchange for Alex Grant

- Jsaquella

Leave it to the Pens to go after the pervert.
aightwebang17
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Typical Montreal, PA
Joined: 07.10.2008

Jun 24 @ 1:49 PM ET
Harry the Z to the Pens
- bradleyc4

Dupuis' replacement
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