every game since game 7 against the leafs he has been dominant....he will be a huge reason the Bruins hoist another cup.
that deserves some credit.
- Barx

i give lucic all the credit he has earned.. but no more

But that doesn't mean he is fair value.
I understand the circumstances that go into a player making the money.

On capgeek there is a comparables chart, if you look at all the names that pop up for Grabovski (20 others)... 4 I would take Grabo over for the money Horcoff, Doan (only because of age), Cammalleri, Gionta... the other 16 I would take over Grabo.

But we can move on from this... you like him at 5.5..I am not so in favor of him.
- senstroll

MANY of those guys on capgeek are still on RFA deals.. take those away and what are you left with?

you'll be rather surprised i bet.

i give lucic all the credit he has earned.. but no more
- Dozzer

lucic was a pile of dog poop all season, he did absolutely (frank) all until the playoffs.

i know, i had him in my pool and i will never pick him again.

problem with all the teams playing boston after toronto - nobody learned anything, these teams are wussys.

if someone goes out and breaks lucic or marchands Richard nose's they wont do poop for the rest of the series, i for one would have got a grinder to go out on the ice and completel destroy marchand and take the suspension, the 5 min penalty, the fine, whatever u gotta do to get that guy off his game, or out of the series.

you hurt him, thats what you do.

not wait for the refs to call it, cause guess what, it aint happening.

lucic only brings a physical element to the table. otherwise he hasnt proven he can do more than grabo at all.

i am the only one producing numbers to make my point, the only one offering tangible evidence.. and not just opinion.

prove me wrong, i am more than willing to admit i am wrong.. i do it all the time.. but until someone actually can give me real proof.. then no.

i do not accept opinion as fact.
- Dozzer

Hey, i like grabovski. I think he is a tough SOB. and if he can build after what he looked like in the playoffs, he's going to have many chances to score next season.

But Lucic plays the style of game that i want. Hard and heavy. and in that case, for me he is an upgrade.

Althought the whole thing is apples and oranges...

Frattin, JVR, Kulemin( to some extent) Those are the players who should be compared to, not a speedster, like grabo

yah because that 1 million overpayment is outrageous, yet the darcy tucker, armstrong and 1.5 buyout for lombari = 3.5 mil - is nothing?!

its madness i say, grabo plays 99% of the games in a season. these guys are not even on the team, or playing in Tuckers case.

i think worrying so much about a million over payment is silly, what we need to hope is just grabo to regain his form and carlyle to actually use him as he should be...would you put gretzky on the PK?

no - no you wouldnt...unless fraser was reffing.
- big_dion

What does that have to do with anything? if i could get rid of those I would too.

1 million or 25% its still an overpayment imo. When discussing the salary cap its relevant. And if you are trading or buying out Grabbo its 5.5 not just a 1 mill overpayment. It matters to who you can add to your team.

i will say it again, I dont care if its Bozak or Grab. keep one, do something else with the other

lucic was a pile of dog poop all season, he did absolutely (frank) all until the playoffs.

i know, i had him in my pool and i will never pick him again.

problem with all the teams playing boston after toronto - nobody learned anything, these teams are wussys.

if someone goes out and breaks lucic or marchands Richard nose's they wont do poop for the rest of the series, i for one would have got a grinder to go out on the ice and completel destroy marchand and take the suspension, the 5 min penalty, the fine, whatever u gotta do to get that guy off his game, or out of the series.

you hurt him, thats what you do.

not wait for the refs to call it, cause guess what, it aint happening.
- big_dion

i am not trying to take anythign away from lucic.. but the people flakking on grabo for one poor HALF season are driving me nits..

Bipolar nation. grabo has a good year next year and everyone will be lining up to kiss his feet.. its just the way toronto works

But that doesn't mean he is fair value.
I understand the circumstances that go into a player making the money.

On capgeek there is a comparables chart, if you look at all the names that pop up for Grabovski (20 others)... 4 I would take Grabo over for the money Horcoff, Doan (only because of age), Cammalleri, Gionta... the other 16 I would take over Grabo.

But we can move on from this... you like him at 5.5..I am not so in favor of him.
- senstroll

i don't like grabovski at 5.5, but at most he's a mil overpaid.

he got paid like he was on the open market. that should never happen when a team still has exclusive negotiating rights. but he and his agent were able to exploit the situation in toronto for another million bucks. they knew toronto had no real elite talent at center, and they pushed it right to the deadline. it is what it is.

i guarantee grabovski's contract will be less of a burden in toronto than the same contract will be for whoever hands it to clarkson (pretty much willing to bet that's exactly what he gets)

lucic was a pile of dog poop all season, he did absolutely (frank) all until the playoffs.

i know, i had him in my pool and i will never pick him again.

problem with all the teams playing boston after toronto - nobody learned anything, these teams are wussys.

if someone goes out and breaks lucic or marchands Richard nose's they wont do poop for the rest of the series, i for one would have got a grinder to go out on the ice and completel destroy marchand and take the suspension, the 5 min penalty, the fine, whatever u gotta do to get that guy off his game, or out of the series.

you hurt him, thats what you do.

not wait for the refs to call it, cause guess what, it aint happening.
- big_dion

this is why I want to sign clarkson, and to a lesser degree clowe.....we need some warriors, who can also chip in some offense.
i want more MEAN

Hey, i like grabovski. I think he is a tough SOB. and if he can build after what he looked like in the playoffs, he's going to have many chances to score next season.

But Lucic plays the style of game that i want. Hard and heavy. and in that case, for me he is an upgrade.

Althought the whole thing is apples and oranges...

Frattin, JVR, Kulemin( to some extent) Those are the players who should be compared to, not a speedster, like grabo
- Lee Denault

thats acceptable to me.. you arent saying that lucic is far and away better, you are saying you prefer his style.

and thats fine by me.

thats acceptable to me.. you arent saying that lucic is far and away better, you are saying you prefer his style.

and thats fine by me.
- Dozzer

some people liek their forwards to sakte around D,i like mine to skate through them.

Grabo I think has a fetish in which he likes getting drilled with his head down in open ice, or against the boards. But that's why I love him, he keeps getting back up!


It's almost to the point now where when i watcha agame with my leaf hater freinds they say "Grabo gets nailed again! HAHA" And I say "That's his game. Just wait"

i am not trying to take anythign away from lucic.. but the people flakking on grabo for one poor HALF season are driving me nits..

Bipolar nation. grabo has a good year next year and everyone will be lining up to kiss his feet.. its just the way toronto works
- Dozzer

you keep mentioning the half season... he was overpaid the day he signed it, I remember thinking that at the time... and all the points to keep mentioning as to why he was paid 5.5 prove exactly that he got more than he really should have. The other option was to trade him at the deadline, that would have been fine too.

prove your point then. what does lucic do that grabo doesnt?
- Dozzer

Hit, intimidate, carry his team, score timely goals

you keep mentioning the half season... he was overpaid the day he signed it, I remember thinking that at the time... and all the points to keep mentioning as to why he was paid 5.5 prove exactly that he got more than he really should have. The other option was to trade him at the deadline, that would have been fine too.
- senstroll

maybe they shopped him, and didn't get any real bites? burke decided an overpay was better than risk letting him go for nothing, considering how depleted his team was at center?

no one really knows what the exact circumstances were

maybe they shopped him, and didn't get any real bites? burke decided an overpay was better than risk letting him go for nothing, considering how depleted his team was at center?

no one really knows what the exact circumstances were
- joel878

reasons for being over paid don't negate the overpayment itself.

again i'm saying he got overpaid (by about a mil or so) because of the circumstances, much like clarkson will. which is the original point

you keep mentioning the half season... he was overpaid the day he signed it, I remember thinking that at the time... and all the points to keep mentioning as to why he was paid 5.5 prove exactly that he got more than he really should have. The other option was to trade him at the deadline, that would have been fine too.
- senstroll

cant fault a guy for taking advantage of his situation

he would of gotten the same or more on the open market (there was no centres)

clarkson is going to get about the same and he doesnt "deserve" it either.

salary has very little to do with on ice product. and thats the flat out truth.

cant fault a guy for taking advantage of his situation

he would of gotten the same or more on the open market (there was no centres)

clarkson is going to get about the same and he doesnt "deserve" it either.

salary has very little to do with on ice product. and thats the flat out truth.
- Dozzer

Can't Fault the fans for thinking he is overpaid and expect more from him then.

He would have gotten more on the open market thank (frank) we got the discount then

reasons for being over paid don't negate the overpayment itself.

again i'm saying he got overpaid (by about a mil or so) because of the circumstances, much like clarkson will. which is the original point
- dragus84

i'm not disagreeing. i'm saying it's real simple to make that judgement while playing armchair gm.

people don't know the circumstances. would leaf fans be happier overpaying him? or having him walk for nothing. i'm not even sure which i'd prefer, but i guarantee had he walked, this conversation would have been full of people moaning and female doging that our only legitimate top 6 center was allowed to walk away for nothing.

on another topic

Tim Panaccio ✔ @tpanotchCSN
2 NHL sources tell CSN Flyers & ANA talking of Bobby Ryan. Among scenarios being discussed: Coburn, 11th pick for Ryan... more later

so those that want Ryan
a comparable might be Gardiner, 21st pick and a 2nd?

i'm not disagreeing. i'm saying it's real simple to make that judgement while playing armchair gm.

people don't know the circumstances. would leaf fans be happier overpaying him? or having him walk for nothing. i'm not even sure which i'd prefer, but i guarantee had he walked, this conversation would have been full of people moaning and female doging that our only legitimate top 6 center was allowed to walk away for nothing.
- joel878

ya, i'm not arguing with you.

seems like a very circular argument here... my point was never to complain about garbo's contract directly.

Only a response to the will clarkson be overpaid conversation, to which i pointed to other FA's who were overpaid. The reasons they are overpaid make sense to me and I get that.

Just saying as it should be obvious, then any time something is up for grabs to multiple teams, especially with limited supply, the price goes up.

Now i'm also NOT saying he's as good as Lucic. Can't imagine a scenario where you would turn down a grabo for lucic trade.

on another topic




so those that want Ryan
a comparable might be Gardiner, 21st pick and a 2nd?
- senstroll

think with brayden coburn, franson is a better comparable than gardiner.

i'd consider it.. then i'd look to flip ryan and something else for a top flight center.

Hey, i like grabovski. I think he is a tough SOB. and if he can build after what he looked like in the playoffs, he's going to have many chances to score next season.

But Lucic plays the style of game that i want. Hard and heavy. and in that case, for me he is an upgrade.

Althought the whole thing is apples and oranges...

Frattin, JVR, Kulemin( to some extent) Those are the players who should be compared to, not a speedster, like grabo
- Lee Denault

I like Grabovski a lot but the Lucic comparison is going too far. Imagine Leafs up 4-1 with ten minutes left and the Bruins line of Krejci, Horton and Grabovski take over the game and win it for Boston. Not sure it happens that way without Lucic

ya, i'm not arguing with you.

seems like a very circular argument here... my point was never to complain about garbo's contract directly.

Only a response to the will clarkson be overpaid conversation, to which i pointed to other FA's who were overpaid. The reasons they are overpaid make sense to me and I get that.

Just saying as it should be obvious, then any time something is up for grabs to multiple teams, especially with limited supply, the price goes up.

Now i'm also NOT saying he's as good as Lucic. Can't imagine a scenario where you would turn down a grabo for lucic trade.
- dragus84

oh for sure, i wasn't trying to sound like a d-bag.

funny, when i said more or less the exact same thing yesterday in regards to clarkson and getting overpaid on the open market, i got 'why wouldn't you want that? obviously that means there's massive value there' as a response.

i'm not saying i wouldn't make that trade, but it's in clear violation of my no trading with boston clause.

think with brayden coburn, franson is a better comparable than gardiner.

i'd consider it.. then i'd look to flip ryan and something else for a top flight center.
- joel878

I would pass on either I think.
Try our luck with a FA in Clarkson or Horton

Horton/Clarkson, Gardiner/Franson, 21 pick, 2nd is better than Bobby Ryan

on another topic




so those that want Ryan
a comparable might be Gardiner, 21st pick and a 2nd?
- senstroll

I think as Leafs fans we tend to drool over any hyped guy from another team because we're dying for someone to come in and have great success and help turn things around.

But i think things are turning (although we may have overachieved a littel this year), we made some big strides in a lot of areas and I like the idea of staying the course and not shipping our young guys/1st round picks out of town, especially for a winger which is pretty low on the need scale. If you're gonna move gardiner and a 1st plus i think its for that high paring d man or in a package for a C

oh for sure, i wasn't trying to sound like a d-bag.

funny, when i said more or less the exact same thing yesterday in regards to clarkson and getting overpaid on the open market, i got 'why wouldn't you want that? obviously that means there's massive value there' as a response.

i'm not saying i wouldn't make that trade, but it's in clear violation of my no trading with boston clause.
- joel878

ahah i don't think we've been fleeced by boston as bad as the media and others make it sound.

Sure seguin and hamilton, but we got a top 6 or 7 scorer in the nhl... which is extreeeeeemely rare to find. Hate on Kessel all you want, he is an elite player and you would have to give up a cpl of firsts atleast to obtain anybody in the top 10 over the last couple years.

rask for raycroft ... i have absolutely nothing to defend this one

and then a declining/toast kaberle for colborne and a 1st and maybe even 2nd, not too shabby