Yes you can, and you should. That's why teams acquire and have depth at crucial positions such as defense. I'm not against trading Meszaros if they bring in another capable defenseman with a lower Cap hit. This is the same premise as when you were calling for Coburn to be traded for a draft pick.
- MJL

It's you throwing darts for the sake of starting an argument. Did you not read that the cap space would be used for a UFA forward for depth? Try again

he knows how to dial it up in the plyoffs...at least he did this past yr. seemed like he was a threat almost every shift.
- isaiah520

You don't have to sell me, I like JvR

thats a discussion point. i think it does because of the inordinate number and/or value of assets needed to acquire them. the flyers traded a 2nd line winger and the equiv of 3 #1 picks to acquire pronger and were willing to part w/ 4 in the RFA bid for weber. even if the flyers were to develop 1 of their own top 4 dmen every 5-7 yrs, it would be a tremendous boon to their asset pool.
- isaiah520

yeah that is true. i guess if you hit on one yourself it spares you being gutting in the acquisition price. but the pain can be lessened if you have such a high quantity of good young forwards, that moving one wont leave you totally depleted.

as far as the guys you mentioned though, they were among the top (if not the best) guy at their position at the time of the completed/attempted trade. if you tried to do that for a forward, the cost would be pretty much the same.

i will concede though that the price for a good young defender is typically more than that of a forward

Now THAT era had a horrible defense corps. When Greg Hawgood is a fan favorite, either they suck or everyone is drunk
- Jsaquella

9 goal scorers up front & only Garry Galley on the backend

9 goal scorers up front & only Garry Galley on the backend
- puckhead17

If you had Ryan McGill along the wall to help, you would be jittery too.
Roussel and Soderstrom were horrendous, those were some dark times to be a Flyers fan.
- ravishingone

Some of those defensemen, back then... gah... Greg Hawgood, Rob Zettler, Stu Malgunas, Gord Hynes, Corey Foster... its like a Who's Who of Who Shouldnt Be in the NHL.

as well as cap relief

grabbing ufa's at $4-$5 mill per cannot be done as liberally as in he past
- puckhead17

that too...it's all interrelated.

What's the situation with the salary cap ceiling after this coming season?

Is it assured of going up again (every season) as it did prior to the lockout?

Now THAT era had a horrible defense corps. When Greg Hawgood is a fan favorite, either they suck or everyone is drunk
- Jsaquella

I was just out of college and bought season tickets in the third level of the Spectrum. Dam, was that a hike to your seat. However, "yes" had to invest in a case of Red Dog and liberally consume in the parking lot was a must before watching those teams take the ice.

Well, except Boston, who only has one
- Jsaquella

Right......And Boston has Chara and then a bunch of solid but not spectacular dmen (even though I really Seidenberg) and play a great system.

My point is I know the Flyers can't find the next Shea Weber with 28th pick every year. Just give me somebody every few years that can come in and play some mins.

They can't so they have to over pay in FA or give up quality assets to get another teams 6th dmen.

Now THAT era had a horrible defense corps. When Greg Hawgood is a fan favorite, either they suck or everyone is drunk
- Jsaquella

hawgood made gus look like chara

It's you throwing darts for the sake of starting an argument. Did you not read that the cap space would be used for a UFA forward for depth? Try again
- Just5

With both Meszaros and Grossmann having injury concerns. I don't think it's a very good idea to trade a defenseman to add a forward. As I said previously, if they want to trade Meszaros and bring in a solid 3rd pair defenseman with a lesser Cap hit to create more cap flexibility. I'm fine with that. You have to go all the way back to last Season to see what happens when defenseman get injured. And it's the same concern as when you wanted to trade Coburn for a draft pick.

That's the thing, they still acquire them. When they went to the SCF in 1985 & 87, they didn't have many home grown defensemen, either.

Or in 2010. Strangely enough, not many people female doged about their draft record and defnsemen then
- Jsaquella

FINALLY. FINALLY. Someone tells the truth.

I nearly lose my mind whenever people trot out the old "the Flyers' farm system is terrible" or "the Flyers don't draft well" and other things that simply make no sense to anyone who pays attention.

No, the Flyers aren't perfect. I'm not saying that there are things that they couldn't do better, or have done better.

But at the same time, the organization isn't staffed by Village Idiots. They put together teams using ALL METHODS AVAILABLE TO THEM.

Drafting. Free agency. College free agents. Trades. Buyouts. Demotions. Waivers. "Money waving."

Matt Read, for example, was a street free agent who has performed at the level of a high second-round pick. So why does it matter to some when the Flyers trade a second-round pick in the year he's acquired and performing?

It doesn't matter if the Flyers have seven defensemen who are all from different organizations, depending on who the defensmen are. I would argue that not too many people would complain if the Flyers blueline next season was Kimmo Timonen, Luke Schenn, Nicklas Grossmann, Mark Streit, Keith Yandle and Braydon Coburn -- and not one of those players would have been drafted by the Flyers.

It doesn't matter how the players get here. What matters is what they do when they are here -- two of the top 10 Flyers in the last 25 years, John LeClair and Eric Desjardins, were acquired through trade.

Eric Lindros wasn't drafted by the Flyers. Claude Giroux was. Both great players -- but Giroux isn't better just because the Flyers drafted him.

I wish more people stopped focusing on that stuff and just focused on what guys are actually doing in the organization.

What's the situation with the salary cap ceiling after this coming season?

Is it assured of going up again (every season) as it did prior to the lockout?
- puckhead17

There is still some fuzziness in terms of next Season. Some think it is going to go up substantially. Some such as James Mirtle expect it to stay about the same next Season, and then start to go up after that.

Right......And Boston has Chara and then a bunch of solid but not spectacular dmen (even though I really Seidenberg) and play a great system.

My point is I know the Flyers can't find the next Shea Weber with 28th pick every year. Just give me somebody every few years that can come in and play some mins.

They can't so they have to over pay in FA or give up quality assets to get another teams 6th dmen.
- SonicDefMonkeys

What 6th defensemen have they given up quality assets to get?

Their defense is actually similar to Boston's, when you get past Chara. Granted, that's a huge thing to get past, being that he's arguably the nest defenseman in the game, but the guys beyond him are very similar to what the Flyers have.

The Bruins also play far better team defense than the Flyers. If the Flyers played anywhere near as solid defense as a team as Boston, there'd be few complaints about the defensemen

Right......And Boston has Chara and then a bunch of solid but not spectacular dmen (even though I really Seidenberg) and play a great system.

My point is I know the Flyers can't find the next Shea Weber with 28th pick every year. Just give me somebody every few years that can come in and play some mins.

They can't so they have to over pay in FA or give up quality assets to get another teams 6th dmen.
- SonicDefMonkeys

Well that is hopefully going to happen this year with Gustafsson. And hopefully one of Alt, Ghostibhere, or any of the other recent defenseman they drafted will pan out.

There is still some fuzziness in terms of next Season. Some think it is going to go up substantially. Some such as James Mirtle expect it to stay about the same next Season, and then start to go up after that.
- MJL

If it does go up, nothing related to the deferred escrow situation like previously?

hawgood made gus look like chara
- isaiah520

He'd make sure he'd introduce himself to the Flyers goalies once a week, because they never saw him during games

I was on this same page yesterday when I saw the Streit news. Trade Mez for a conditional 7th/bag of peanuts, it sounds like to me. We have to clear off his cap hit to fit Streit.

I'm still calling Penner as our next offensive signing.

Does anyone think Mesz could be packaged with the 41st to move up or is he in the strictly cap dump, take what you cant get group now?
- hereticpride

Some of us are going to be dead-wrong about Andrej Meszaros' value. I think he gets moved for a low-second or high-third rounder, or a third-line winger who can score 15 goals.

I absolutely think he has value, because he's only got one year left on his deal.

Others of us think he has no value at all, because of the injuries.

I am curious which segment of us is correct, because obviously, there's no middle ground there.

What 6th defensemen have they given up quality assets to get?

Their defense is actually similar to Boston's, when you get past Chara. Granted, that's a huge thing to get past, being that he's arguably the nest defenseman in the game, but the guys beyond him are very similar to what the Flyers have.

The Bruins also play far better team defense than the Flyers. If the Flyers played anywhere near as solid defense as a team as Boston, there'd be few complaints about the defensemen
- Jsaquella

agreed, except for Chara they aren't all that "stocked",
imagine Boston playing run & gun style with the guys they have, they are suited for the system

FINALLY. FINALLY. Someone tells the truth.

I nearly lose my mind whenever people trot out the old "the Flyers' farm system is terrible" or "the Flyers don't draft well" and other things that simply make no sense to anyone who pays attention.

No, the Flyers aren't perfect. I'm not saying that there are things that they couldn't do better, or have done better.

But at the same time, the organization isn't staffed by Village Idiots. They put together teams using ALL METHODS AVAILABLE TO THEM.

Drafting. Free agency. College free agents. Trades. Buyouts. Demotions. Waivers. "Money waving."

Matt Read, for example, was a street free agent who has performed at the level of a high second-round pick. So why does it matter to some when the Flyers trade a second-round pick in the year he's acquired and performing?

It doesn't matter if the Flyers have seven defensemen who are all from different organizations, depending on who the defensmen are. I would argue that not too many people would complain if the Flyers blueline next season was Kimmo Timonen, Luke Schenn, Nicklas Grossmann, Mark Streit, Keith Yandle and Braydon Coburn -- and not one of those players would have been drafted by the Flyers.

It doesn't matter how the players get here. What matters is what they do when they are here -- two of the top 10 Flyers in the last 25 years, John LeClair and Eric Desjardins, were acquired through trade.

Eric Lindros wasn't drafted by the Flyers. Claude Giroux was. Both great players -- but Giroux isn't better just because the Flyers drafted him.

I wish more people stopped focusing on that stuff and just focused on what guys are actually doing in the organization.
- AllInForFlyers

Amen! I don't care how they build a top team as long as they do it. They need to improve in some areas, no doubt. But it's made into a much bigger deal then it really is.

agreed, except for Chara they aren't all that "stocked",
imagine Boston playing run & gun style with the guys they have, they are suited for the system
- puckhead17

Streit's definitely a move to fit the system. He's a really capable puck carrier.

Some of those defensemen, back then... gah... Greg Hawgood, Rob Zettler, Stu Malgunas, Gord Hynes, Corey Foster... its like a Who's Who of Who Shouldnt Be in the NHL.
- Doc_Sarcasm

My God. Why would you post this? You nearly made a grown man cry.

Streit's definitely a move to fit the system. He's a really capable puck carrier.
- Jsaquella

I'ts like having an older Matt Carle back kind of

he skates better then I thought, it's a good move, depending on the contract term