That's why I'd stand pat. I don't see McBain as being the player who helps put them team over the top more than Grossmann.
Now, if you have an older player who's about done and you're not a playoff team, sure, you take a shot on potential (Zhitnik for Coburn). But right now, I'd rather stand pat with what we have rather than make a move like that.
- jmatchett383

I'm with you there!

That's why I'd stand pat. I don't see McBain as being the player who helps put them team over the top more than Grossmann.
Now, if you have an older player who's about done and you're not a playoff team, sure, you take a shot on potential (Zhitnik for Coburn). But right now, I'd rather stand pat with what we have rather than make a move like that.
- jmatchett383

C'mon man, over the top for us right now IS making the playoffs.

We aren't a playoff team, remember?

Exactly. Trading a sure thing for a guy who may or may not turn into something is risky at best.
- jmatchett383

Wait, who are the sure things on this team?

Grossmann's only a top-4 defender at ES if he has a decent partner to take the puck-moving burden off of him -- like a young(ish) Komisarek.

Mez is spending more time in doctors' waiting rooms than on the ice.

Coburn has regressed just as dramatically as McBain.


I wouldn't trade Coburn, but Mez and/or Grossmann I wouldn't be so attached to if it meant bringing a younger puck-mover into the mix.

Wait, who are the sure things on this team?

Grossmann's only a top-4 defender at ES if he has a decent partner to take the puck-moving burden off of him -- like a young(ish) Komisarek.

Mez is spending more time in doctors' waiting rooms than on the ice.

Coburn has regressed just as dramatically as McBain.


I wouldn't trade Coburn, but Mez and/or Grossmann I wouldn't be so attached to if it meant bringing a younger puck-mover into the mix.
- Tomahawk

Grossmann is a premier shot blocking defenseman. McBain is..maybe a top-4 defenseman who can move the puck, maybe not. I'd consider Meszaros for sure, but not Grossmann.

That's why I'd stand pat. I don't see McBain as being the player who helps put them team over the top more than Grossmann.
Now, if you have an older player who's about done and you're not a playoff team, sure, you take a shot on potential (Zhitnik for Coburn). But right now, I'd rather stand pat with what we have rather than make a move like that.
- jmatchett383

I'm not in love with Grossmann, so I wouldn't lose sleep over a Grossmann/McBain swap.

But I also wouldn't praise it, either. Would just have to wait and see the results.

C'mon man, over the top for us right now IS making the playoffs.

We aren't a playoff team, remember?
- mayorofangrytown

I think you know what I mean.

C'mon man, over the top for us right now IS making the playoffs.

We aren't a playoff team, remember?
- mayorofangrytown

This statement is true.
However, my opinion is that had this been a full season we would have been (damn asterisk). Of course who knows what our blueline would have looked like. We wouldn't have gone deep into the play-offs but we would have gotten there.
I'm ok with missing them on a shortened season. It gets us a better draft pick and hopefully will put some fire in their step next season.

Of course as a fan not giving a poop about the play-offs is sad. Go Bruins! Yeah that's about the extent of my fervor.

I think you know what I mean.
- jmatchett383

Well you're talking like we're positioned to win the Cup so we can't make some of these swaps so I thought I'd ground you back in reality.

You're welcome.

Continue... I'm still with you.

This statement is true.
However, my opinion is that had this been a full season we would have been (damn asterisk). Of course who knows what our blueline would have looked like. We wouldn't have gone deep into the play-offs but we would have gotten there.
I'm ok with missing them on a shortened season. It gets us a better draft pick and hopefully will put some fire in their step next season.

Of course as a fan not giving a poop about the play-offs is sad. Go Bruins! Yeah that's about the extent of my fervor.
- FlyersGrace

Go Bruins? The hell...?
-Pens: No explanation needed
-Bruins: Have given us fits, and I hate Marchand
-Hawks: Still not over 2010
-Kings: No real hatred. Big DB fan.

Grossmann is a premier shot blocking defenseman. McBain is..maybe a top-4 defenseman who can move the puck, maybe not. I'd consider Meszaros for sure, but not Grossmann.
- jmatchett383

Guys like Zanon, Komisarek, B Allen, M Fraser, B Clark, Hamrlik have been better at at blocking shots and I'd trade any one of them for a young top-4 dman any day of the week (and thrice on Sundays).

Wait, who are the sure things on this team?

Grossmann's only a top-4 defender at ES if he has a decent partner to take the puck-moving burden off of him -- like a young(ish) Komisarek.

Mez is spending more time in doctors' waiting rooms than on the ice.

Coburn has regressed just as dramatically as McBain.


I wouldn't trade Coburn, but Mez and/or Grossmann I wouldn't be so attached to if it meant bringing a younger puck-mover into the mix.
- Tomahawk

As someone mentioned yesterday, it actually wouldn't be the worst thing the Flyers have ever done is moving Meszaros' salary for another type of player.

I would, because with Claude Giroux coming up next year, I simply cannot see how the Flyers would re-sign Meszaros to anything resembling the cap hit he would seek, and while he is in no way a bad player, he is overpaid for a third-pairing defenseman.

Doesn't mean he can't play, doesn't mean that the Flyers should kill themselves trying to move him. But I probably wouldn't throw myself off a cliff screaming "noooooooooooo" if the Flyers did a Meszaros for McBain deal, maybe with Carolina tossing in a fourth or fifth-rounder, because McBain is right-handed, younger, is mobile and, again, it is difficult to see how Meszaros woujld be re-signed.

Grossmann is a premier shot blocking defenseman. McBain is..maybe a top-4 defenseman who can move the puck, maybe not. I'd consider Meszaros for sure, but not Grossmann.
- jmatchett383

This
Grossmann is a solid top 4 stay at home. Currently we have more stay at home. Fine. But why would you trade a consistent player for one who isn't? Even if the need was greater. The hole you leave has to be filled with something. Go ask your goalie who he wants playing those minutes...
Sometimes I think the only defenseman Bryz likes is Grossmann.

Well you're talking like we're positioned to win the Cup so we can't make some of these swaps so I thought I'd ground you back in reality.

You're welcome.

Continue... I'm still with you.

- mayorofangrytown

"Over the top" should never mean anything but a Stanley Cup win. I don't want this team to be a playoff contender, I want them to be a Stanley Cup winner.

Yes, they're aways away from that right now (at least 2 years), but I don't think McBain is a player that's going to magically make us jump and become an instant contender, and I think Grossmann is more valuable to us to become a playoff contender as well as to challenge for the Cup in a few years.

Guys like Zanon, Komisarek, B Allen, M Fraser, B Clark, Hamrlik have been better at at blocking shots and I'd trade any one of them for a young top-4 dman any day of the week (and thrice on Sundays).
- Tomahawk

That is false. Grossmann averaged 2.73 blocks/game last year. Only Zanon had a better amount.

Guys like Zanon, Komisarek, B Allen, M Fraser, B Clark, Hamrlik have been better at at blocking shots and I'd trade any one of them for a young top-4 dman any day of the week (and thrice on Sundays).
- Tomahawk

Would you deal any of those guys you just mentioned for Grossmann, straight up?

Go Bruins? The hell...?
-Pens: No explanation needed
-Bruins: Have given us fits, and I hate Marchand
-Hawks: Still not over 2010
-Kings: No real hatred. Big DB fan.
- jmatchett383

The “Go Bruins” was more in relation to just this series. As long as the Penguins get annihilated I'm happy. After that I don't really care who wins it. The fiancee wants LA, but I'm not keen on them repeating. I have a gripe against them all sadly.

Anyone post the pic of Chara hoisting Crosby instead of the cup yet? Cracked me up…

This statement is true.
However, my opinion is that had this been a full season we would have been (damn asterisk). Of course who knows what our blueline would have looked like. We wouldn't have gone deep into the play-offs but we would have gotten there.
I'm ok with missing them on a shortened season. It gets us a better draft pick and hopefully will put some fire in their step next season.

Of course as a fan not giving a poop about the play-offs is sad. Go Bruins! Yeah that's about the extent of my fervor.
- FlyersGrace

I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around what this team has done lately. We miss in 2007. Make it for 5 years with the Apex being losing to Chicago in the Finals and now we're out again. Other than the early 90's this is as frustrating an era of Flyers hockey as I've lived through.

I blame the Salary Cap.

Anyone post the pic of Chara hoisting Crosby instead of the cup yet? Cracked me up…
- FlyersGrace

There was also a gif of Chara breaking Crosby in half and baby pacifers came tumbling out of Crosby. That was just gold.

"Over the top" should never mean anything but a Stanley Cup win. I don't want this team to be a playoff contender, I want them to be a Stanley Cup winner.

Yes, they're aways away from that right now (at least 2 years), but I don't think McBain is a player that's going to magically make us jump and become an instant contender, and I think Grossmann is more valuable to us to become a playoff contender as well as to challenge for the Cup in a few years.
- jmatchett383

I told you. I'm still with you. I don't disagree with a damn thing you just said.

You just said "if we weren't a playoff team" (you know paraphrased slightly) so I had to pull ya back from 2012.

There was also a gif of Chara breaking Crosby in half and baby pacifers came tumbling out of Crosby. That was just gold.
- johndewar

DontForgetTocchett shared that with me yesterday a I had to clean soda off my keyboard.

Would you deal any of those guys you just mentioned for Grossmann, straight up?
- johndewar

Today? Probably only Mark Fraser. He's just as big, just as mean, but younger and much more mobile.

Komisarek, Allen and Hamrlik in their formative years had much stronger claims to being legit top-4 dmen than Grossmann since they all had more well-rounded games.

Grossmann is one-dimensional... what he does he does really well... but there's nothing else there.

Probably only Mark Fraser. He's just as big, just as mean, but younger and much more mobile.

Komisarek, Allen and Hamrlik in their formative years had much stronger claims to being legit top-4 dmen than Grossmann since they all had more well-rounded games.
- Tomahawk

At one time those players did, sure. Hell, Hamrlik was the top pick in his draft year. You wouldn't trade Grossmann for any of those players now and expect to not get looked at funny.

And for Fraser? Maybe.

Wait, who are the sure things on this team?

Grossmann's only a top-4 defender at ES if he has a decent partner to take the puck-moving burden off of him -- like a young(ish) Komisarek.

Mez is spending more time in doctors' waiting rooms than on the ice.

Coburn has regressed just as dramatically as McBain.


I wouldn't trade Coburn, but Mez and/or Grossmann I wouldn't be so attached to if it meant bringing a younger puck-mover into the mix.
- Tomahawk

That is true of the majority of #4 defenseman equal to Grossmann. He plays a role and fills a niche. You know you can throw him out there for defensive shifts, and on the PK. And you know what he's going to give you game in and game out.
Coburn has played at high levels in his career. Has McBain? Equal to Coburn?

I told you. I'm still with you. I don't disagree with a damn thing you just said.

You just said "if we weren't a playoff team" (you know paraphrased slightly) so I had to pull ya back from 2012.

- mayorofangrytown

My bad. I actually think we are a playoff (or playoff caliber) team, despite last season's record.

Grossmann is one-dimensional... what he does he does really well... but there's nothing else there.
- Tomahawk

K, I'll give ya that. Grossmann is one dimensional and is very good at what he does. And yes we need a puck moving D-man. Problem is Grossmann eats a ton of our hardest defensive minutes. I take a LONG HARD look at who you are getting back if he's included in a trade. We better have someone coming in who is just as good or better to eat that time. You trade Mez or forwards for that young mobile D-man who has yet to make a name for themselves.