Sure...that's why MAF has played in 2 Stanley Cup Finals and won 1 of them.


- Killian

I wish MAF of four years ago was still playing for the Pens...

Thanks to Fleury, I still get irrationally concerned when pucks are shot from the corner or behind the net at Vokoun's feet.

Maybe Fleury should just throw his stick at the puck when it's played from behind the net... He does better against penalty shots and breakaways than pucks at his feet.

Problem is too that Sid has stats on his side. He played with Iggy for a few games and got chances, but only had a couple points. First game back with his crew and he scores a hat trick. Sort of hard to tell the guy that he's wrong when he's put up so many points with Kunitz...

And while he's played the best with Kunitz and Neal, Malkin has put up some good stats without Kunitz for the most part in the post season.
- rival22

Yeah but if you send Iggy to the 3rd line that messing everyone up. Maybe Bylsma is making a good TEAM decision.

Problem is too that Sid has stats on his side. He played with Iggy for a few games and got chances, but only had a couple points. First game back with his crew and he scores a hat trick. Sort of hard to tell the guy that he's wrong when he's put up so many points with Kunitz...

And while he's played the best with Kunitz and Neal, Malkin has put up some good stats without Kunitz for the most part in the post season.
- rival22

there is merit to that. just when malkin iggy and neal are out there together it is just so unimpressive. im sure there are many reasons why, but even strength iggy is downright close to being a liability out there. not only is he having a hard time, but i think his presence messes malkin up. it makes him think too much out there. he works best even strength when it his essentially him and neal, with kunitz doing the dirty work.

Ottawa fans are delusional. They've won a game because we GAVE IT away. We were dumb.

I'm still mad at Bylsma & Co.

Ottawa fans are delusional. They've win a game because we GAVE IT away. We were dumb.

I'm still mad at Bylsma & Co.
- Orpik44

"I hear there was a phone call made"
"Ovie shut up"

there is merit to that. just when malkin iggy and neal are out there together it is just so unimpressive. im sure there are many reasons why, but even strength iggy is downright close to being a liability out there. not only is he having a hard time, but i think his presence messes malkin up. it makes him think too much out there. he works best even strength when it his essentially him and neal, with kunitz doing the dirty work.
- stayinthefnnet

One silver lining of the last game, is that Malkin played incredibly well, and was possessed with the puck in OT, not looking for or deferring to Inginla. If that keeps up, then there is nothing to worry about.

I do like Kunitz over Iginla on the first line because of his speed though. Iginla is a step slow, and that is hidden on Malkin's line because there is more east/west play.

I don't know... I was thinking that for some reason handed-ness was an issue for Sid, preferring to have a left handed right wing, but he did well and liked playing with Guerin on the right side.

I wish MAF of four years ago was still playing for the Pens...

Thanks to Fleury, I still get irrationally concerned when pucks are shot from the corner or behind the net at Vokoun's feet.

Maybe Fleury should just throw his stick at the puck when it's played from behind the net... He does better against penalty shots and breakaways than pucks at his feet.
- rival22

I dunno, I'm going to defend Fleury. I believe that it wasn't completely his fault that Vokoun replaced him in the first place. The team was playing like garbage in front of him. Were there a few goals that she should've stopped? Absolutely. But this is a guy that posted a 23-8 record in the regular season with a .916 sv % and 2.39 GAA which when you look at his career stats, is up there with one of his best seasons yet. Truth is, he hasn't been the same since his daughter was born. However, I believe he deserves a second chance. If he's going to get one, it needs to happen in this series. Otherwise, you're reaching the point of no return with Vokoun between the pipes. It will be very difficult to insert Fleury into the Conference or Stanley Cup finals if he hasn't played a game since Round 1.

I dunno, I'm going to defend Fleury. I believe that it wasn't completely his fault that Vokoun replaced him in the first place. The team was playing like garbage in front of him. Were there a few goals that she should've stopped? Absolutely. But this is a guy that posted a 23-8 record in the regular season with a .916 sv % and 2.39 GAA which when you look at his career stats, is up there with one of his best seasons yet. Truth is, he hasn't been the same since his daughter was born. However, I believe he deserves a second chance. If he's going to get one, it needs to happen in this series. Otherwise, you're reaching the point of no return with Vokoun between the pipes. It will be very difficult to insert Fleury into the Conference or Stanley Cup finals if he hasn't played a game since Round 1.
- Killian

It wasn't totally his fault, but as much as the guys love him, he lost them in that last game. You could see it on their faces, after two different soft goals, I saw both Craig Adams and Brooks Orpik (both great team guys) just drop their shoulders and look up to the sky, like "ahhhh... not again..." They had lost their confidence in him.

I like Fleury A LOT, but you can't give him a charity chance in the playoffs just to see if he can redeem himself. Unless Vokoun puts a couple bad games together, you need to stick with him, he gives you the best chance to win right now.

I think Iginla needs to play RW.

Looking back now I feel it's a little disturbing when you look at how slow the guys are that Shero is bringing in-

Brandon Sutter- Plays a solid boring game. Looks really slow.

Brendan Morrow- Really thought he would be more physical in the playoffs. To slow though.

Iggy- Still has a great shot. To bad you only can see it on a PP because he really needs others to set him up. Painfully slow.

Douglass Murray- Love his physical play but he is also slow but gets covered up by the fact that he plays the system well.

.............................................................................................................
My lines
Duper - Crosby - Iginla - Just because no Bennett
Kunitz- Malkin - Neal - Top line last year.
Cooke - Jokinen- Kennedy - Speed and physical for opposing top line
Morrow- Sutter - Adams - A 4th line better than most

Not going to happen though. Go Pens

Sure...that's why MAF has played in 2 Stanley Cup Finals and won 1 of them.
- Killian

The Penguins won in spite of Fleury, not because of him. His GAA and Save % were 2.61 and .908 respectively, good for 7th of the 8 goalies that made it beyond the first round.

Turns out when you're averaging 3½ goals a game in the playoffs, you can still win if your goalie lets in beach balls.

It wasn't totally his fault, but as much as the guys love him, he lost them in that last game. You could see it on their faces, after two different soft goals, I saw both Craig Adams and Brooks Orpik (both great team guys) just drop their shoulders and look up to the sky, like "ahhhh... not again..." They had lost their confidence in him.

I like Fleury A LOT, but you can't give him a charity chance in the playoffs just to see if he can redeem himself. Unless Vokoun puts a couple bad games together, you need to stick with him, he gives you the best chance to win right now.
- rival22

Im a big Fleury guy myself, but I think this is very accurate.

The Penguins won in spite of Fleury, not because of him. His GAA and Save % were 2.61 and .908 respectively, good for 7th of the 8 goalies that made it beyond the first round.

Turns out when you're averaging 3½ goals a game in the playoffs, you can still win if your goalie lets in beach balls.
- tkecanuck341

^ THIS

It wasn't totally his fault, but as much as the guys love him, he lost them in that last game. You could see it on their faces, after two different soft goals, I saw both Craig Adams and Brooks Orpik (both great team guys) just drop their shoulders and look up to the sky, like "ahhhh... not again..." They had lost their confidence in him.

I like Fleury A LOT, but you can't give him a charity chance in the playoffs just to see if he can redeem himself. Unless Vokoun puts a couple bad games together, you need to stick with him, he gives you the best chance to win right now.
- rival22

I said before the playoffs that I believed that we had such a good team, that I would feel confident with either goalie in the crease...and I still believe that. I do think Vokoun will remain in goal until he has a bad game because he's earned it. However, one thing about Fleury is that he is a bounce back goaltender. I remember them putting up a stat this season that after he gets pulled in a game, the following game he usually puts up a great performance. It's hard for me to believe that our franchise goaltender (and one that he played in 2 stanley cup finals) will remain on the bench for the remainder of our postseason. I think that Fleury will get another chance, and hopefully he will make the most of it. Because at this point, he knows that if he doesn't regain his 2008-2009 form, that he will be watching Vokoun for the rest of the season.

The Penguins won in spite of Fleury, not because of him. His GAA and Save % were 2.61 and .908 respectively, good for 7th of the 8 goalies that made it beyond the first round.

Turns out when you're averaging 3½ goals a game in the playoffs, you can still win if your goalie lets in beach balls.
- tkecanuck341

Go back and watch the Flyers series our Cup year, Fleury was a total beast.
Also against the Caps when Ovie was other worldly he stuffed him on countless breakaways and power plays.
No FLuery in 09' no Cup in 09'

The Penguins won in spite of Fleury, not because of him. His GAA and Save % were 2.61 and .908 respectively, good for 7th of the 8 goalies that made it beyond the first round.

Turns out when you're averaging 3½ goals a game in the playoffs, you can still win if your goalie lets in beach balls.
- tkecanuck341

I think Iginla needs to play RW.

Looking back now I feel it's a little disturbing when you look at how slow the guys are that Shero is bringing in-

Brandon Sutter- Plays a solid boring game. Looks really slow.

Brendan Morrow- Really thought he would be more physical in the playoffs. To slow though.

Iggy- Still has a great shot. To bad you only can see it on a PP because he really needs others to set him up. Painfully slow.

Douglass Murray- Love his physical play but he is also slow but gets covered up by the fact that he plays the system well.

.............................................................................................................
My lines
Duper - Crosby - Iginla - Just because no Bennett
Kunitz- Malkin - Neal - Top line last year.
Cooke - Jokinen- Kennedy - Speed and physical for opposing top line
Morrow- Sutter - Adams - A 4th line better than most

Not going to happen though. Go Pens
- lloyd095

Sutter is having a really good playoff run, it's just not showing up on the scoreboard. He is averaging over 16 minutes of ice time, and has been on the ice for 3 goals against. That's pretty good when your playing a shut-down role against the other teams top lines. Also, for all the time he plays on the PK, he has not been on the ice for a PP goal against.

The Penguins won in spite of Fleury, not because of him. His GAA and Save % were 2.61 and .908 respectively, good for 7th of the 8 goalies that made it beyond the first round.

Turns out when you're averaging 3½ goals a game in the playoffs, you can still win if your goalie lets in beach balls.
- tkecanuck341

Yeah, but in games where the Pens faced elimination, Fleury had a 1.33 GAA and a .943 save %. He played lights out in game 6 and 7 of the finals.

Go back and watch the Flyers series our Cup year, Fleury was a total beast.
Also against the Caps when Ovie was other worldly he stuffed him on countless breakaways and power plays.
No FLuery in 09' no Cup in 09'
- nbartley9

And the Final as well... He had the bad game in GM#5, but played his ass off in GM#4, and held the Wings to 1 goal in each of GM#6 & GM#7, both elimination games.

And don't forget the 2008 Final, GM#5, the one that Talbot tied up in the last minute to force OT. Look at the shots-

Shots by period:
Team 1 2 3 OT1 OT2 OT3 T
Pittsburgh 7 7 4 2 8 4 32
Detroit 8 12 14 13 7 4 58

The formatting sucks, but through the first OT, the Pens were outshot 47-20 and Fleury held his ground when force with elimination.

as far as fleury goes, people saying the pens won in spite of him are retarded. however, right now i just dont believe that player is under the pads anymore. until i see otherwise from him, they would have to win in spite of him now.

Sutter is having a really good playoff run, it's just not showing up on the scoreboard. He is averaging over 16 minutes of ice time, and has been on the ice for 3 goals against. That's pretty good when your playing a shut-down role against the other teams top lines. Also, for all the time he plays on the PK, he has not been on the ice for a PP goal against.
- cap1681

Agreed and out of all the guys we acquired he's the guy that stays the longest but he is pretty slow. Plays a safe game to make sure he doesn't get burned. Maybe putting Jokinen on the 3rd line with Kennedy was a reach but I do like the speed of that combination.

Edit - My point was that Shero seems to be bringing in slower players in the last year

Agreed and out of all the guys we acquired he's the guy that stays the longest but he is pretty slow. Plays a safe game to make sure he doesn't get burned. Maybe putting Jokinen on the 3rd line with Kennedy was a reach but I do like the speed of that combination.
- lloyd095

sutter has been fine. not outstanding, but he is doing what he needs to be doing. hes young, and probably still has a little room for improvement. hes fine as a third line center.

And the Final as well... He had the bad game in GM#5, but played his ass off in GM#4, and held the Wings to 1 goal in each of GM#6 & GM#7, both elimination games.

And don't forget the 2008 Final, the one that Talbot tied up in the last minute to force OT. Look at the shots-

Shots by period:
Team 1 2 3 OT1 OT2 OT3 T
Pittsburgh 7 7 4 2 8 4 32
Detroit 8 12 14 13 7 4 58

The formatting sucks, but through the first OT, the Pens were outshot 47-20 and Fleury held his ground when force with elimination.
- rival22

How awesome is it that our area of so much concern is that we have 2 starting goalies. That I feel confident with either one in the cage.

Everyone muster up the squeakiest baby voice you can, and say in unison "our best players are at 70%"

Iginla should be with Sid...they work well together. He also needs to be at the point on the power play (or on the left circle)...he can and does shoot.

I think the one guy that needs to step it up and will potentially make a really big difference is Neal.

7 games...3 points..only 17 shots and 10 hits?

His 9 shots in the last two games are encouraging...we need more of that.

Sick of all you fans referring to how good Geno's line was with Kunitz. Crosby's was better. Sid deserves to play with whoever he wants. Neal was brought in and due to injuries he played with and has stayed with Geno. Maybe it's not the centers maybe it is the winger. Move him down to the 3rd and move morrow up or insert Bennett. If we held on and go up 3-0 none of these discussions happen. That was about as good as Ottawa could play and it took them almost 2 games to win 1. Calm down we are fine.

Agreed and out of all the guys we acquired he's the guy that stays the longest but he is pretty slow. Plays a safe game to make sure he doesn't get burned. Maybe putting Jokinen on the 3rd line with Kennedy was a reach but I do like the speed of that combination.

Edit - My point was that Shero seems to be bringing in slower players in the last year
- lloyd095

Bringing in slower players got us past the 1st round. Guess it is working