what would you guys expect/be willing to drop on giroux' next deal?
- stayinthefnnet

Not as high as some others probably.

I'm a fan of Giroux, but he still has to show that he can improve his defensive game.

He showed a really bad habit all year long of looking for the pretty play too much. As well as gliding too much, and not giving his all consistently.

Next year is a big year for Giroux, to see if he can bounce back himself. The point production wasn't terrible, but he made far too many stupid plays that cost the team, or made any offensive chance burn in the ashes of his fancy dancy decisions.

Giroux is a good player, but he is no Crosby. To win, the team will need to have a damn good second line center as well.

Yzerman loves Luongo, and I think the Lindback experiment is over.

Bishop hasnt looked too hot outside of Ottawa's system. In Tampa or international hockey. Ottawa got a Matt Read of their own in Conacher.

Luongo would probably love the decreased spotlight and drama in Tampa, and there is the Florida connection.
- flyer_nutter

This is true. I could see Lou heading there, was just curious with your logic.

Bishop has been MADLY OVERSOLD all over these boards... The guy has yet to play more than 30 games in a season and some had him pegged as a franchise goalie. Why do you think St. Louis essentially gave up on him and let him go? (yes, their crease was crowded with their starters and prospects, but still).

I see either Lindback and/or Bishop heading the other way as part of a deal.

My thing is that Giroux showed at lot more to me when he got his contract.

Brayden Schenn doesnt really have any aspect of his game standout. I hope he has a solid season, and then he is given an extension, but the kid just pisses me off. Not really even sure why.
- flyer_nutter

Because he is down on the ice on every shift, thats what does it for me

The Flyers have had Brayden Schenn for 2 years (ok, 1.5 years) and he's still finding his game. No way does he deserve an extension right now.

That said, he seems to have the proper amount of skill to have a breakout year this year.
- johndewar

To be honest its not his skill that is the problem to me.

The subpar defensive play is the biggest concern. Really (frank)ing tired of this team continuing to build an offense on forwards who have bad defensive games to begin with.

At the right price, I think you can do a heckuva lot worse than Roberto Luongo as one of your goaltenders.

At the right price, that is.
- johndewar

with lu on a buyout, you know he'll be looking for a very reasonable deal. he himself said "my contract sucks". and with the decreased cap for one year price will be a factor for anybody looking for a new deal.

i could see the flyers giving him a 2 or 3 year deal around 4ish. don't think he'll get 5 or north of that.

Bishop has been MADLY OVERSOLD all over these boards...
- Flyers_V88

Not just these boards.

Randy Miller of the Courier post was willing to give up Couturier for Bishop.

This is presumably because Randy Miller is Ben Bishop's agent.

i've never been on the lu train either, but if the flyers buyout bryz, and lu gets bought out in vancouver, i'd love to have him.
- hammarby31

With the injuries to Emery and Backstrom, I have been leaning that way more and more.

Good stopgap for Mason hopefully.

Not as high as some others probably.

I'm a fan of Giroux, but he still has to show that he can improve his defensive game.

He showed a really bad habit all year long of looking for the pretty play too much. As well as gliding too much, and not giving his all consistently.

Next year is a big year for Giroux, to see if he can bounce back himself. The point production wasn't terrible, but he made far too many stupid plays that cost the team, or made any offensive chance burn in the ashes of his fancy dancy decisions.

Giroux is a good player, but he is no Crosby. To win, the team will need to have a damn good second line center as well.
- flyer_nutter

i feel this as well to an extent, but he is still one of the upper level players in the game and is going to be paid accordingly. probably fairly close to crosby

I would normally agree, but with the cap so tight now, and the uncertainty of growth. I'd give G 7 years at $8 mil/yr. If he has another decent to all-star year next season, the value is approaching $9mil/yr.
- Flyers_V88

Sweet Jesus, no offense intended but if Giroux wants 9 million I'd kick his ass out the door.

Maybe if he improves his defensive game, and decisions with the puck. Even then, he is not worth that imo.

This organization really needs to look at the player's all round game, not just the highlight reel and point production. Or lets continue to give out highly paid contracts to players that cant live up to them realistically.

To be honest its not his skill that is the problem to me.

The subpar defensive play is the biggest concern. Really (frank)ing tired of this team continuing to build an offense on forwards who have bad defensive games to begin with.
- flyer_nutter

He's just 21 and he does have time to fix that.

He's never going to be Mike Richards, defensively.

On the other hand, he has offensive skill to burn.

He's just 21 and he does have time to fix that.

He's never going to be Mike Richards, defensively.

On the other hand, he has offensive skill to burn.
- johndewar

Well then that is an issue to me.

You have Giroux already sub par defensively, and making stupid decisions with the puck at times.

I really just cant get my head around the absolute horsepoop obsession this team has with forwards who may have skill, but are bad defensively. Hopefully Schenn improves there. Or imo his best hope will be as a winger.

Sweet Jesus, no offense intended but if Giroux wants 9 million I'd kick his ass out the door.

Maybe if he improves his defensive game, and decisions with the puck. Even then, he is not worth that imo.

This organization really needs to look at the player's all round game, not just the highlight reel and point production. Or lets continue to give out highly paid contracts to players that cant live up to them realistically.
- flyer_nutter

The assumption of the $9mil was only if he produces a similar year to the one he had last year. Otherwise, I do believe that he will ask for $8mil easy...

Perry and Getzlaf, between the two of them, have what we would deem 2 "all-star" years. Yes, they have a Cup, but their numbers are actually relatively low for their pay. As for their defensive play, I'll let the board argue on that...

As for G's defensive play, it's average when taking into the whole sample. Some games he's unreal, some not so much.

This is true. I could see Lou heading there, was just curious with your logic.

Bishop has been MADLY OVERSOLD all over these boards... The guy has yet to play more than 30 games in a season and some had him pegged as a franchise goalie. Why do you think St. Louis essentially gave up on him and let him go? (yes, their crease was crowded with their starters and prospects, but still).

I see either Lindback and/or Bishop heading the other way as part of a deal.
- Flyers_V88

Another guy I'd look at is Halak. Dont know if St. Louis would be willing to trade, and the price but if the team is looking at the trade route I like him and Hiller.

Would be probably better to not give up assets and sign Luongo if the choice is there though.

Well then that is an issue to me.

You have Giroux already sub par defensively, and making stupid decisions with the puck at times.

I really just cant get my head around the absolute horsepoop obsession this team has with forwards who may have skill, but are bad defensively. Hopefully Schenn improves there. Or imo his best hope will be as a winger.
- flyer_nutter

to be fair, it is hard to find very good two way players. they dont come around often and are seldom moved.

with lu on a buyout, you know he'll be looking for a very reasonable deal. he himself said "my contract sucks". and with the decreased cap for one year price will be a factor for anybody looking for a new deal.

i could see the flyers giving him a 2 or 3 year deal around 4ish. don't think he'll get 5 or north of that.
- hammarby31

Luongo as a mentor for a few years and Mason learning from another good puck handler.

Slap my ass and sign me up!

Sweet Jesus, no offense intended but if Giroux wants 9 million I'd kick his ass out the door.

Maybe if he improves his defensive game, and decisions with the puck. Even then, he is not worth that imo.

This organization really needs to look at the player's all round game, not just the highlight reel and point production. Or lets continue to give out highly paid contracts to players that cant live up to them realistically.
- flyer_nutter

if giroux has an 80 point season with so so defensive play, then yeah maybe you get him for 8. but if he puts up close to 100 points in a full year, he will probably be pushing or exceeding 9. i guess it depends if you view giroux as a really good center who needs a guy behind him, or as that franchise top 5 guy in the league.

Well then that is an issue to me.

You have Giroux already sub par defensively, and making stupid decisions with the puck at times.

I really just cant get my head around the absolute horsepoop obsession this team has with forwards who may have skill, but are bad defensively. Hopefully Schenn improves there. Or imo his best hope will be as a winger.
- flyer_nutter

uh, because skill is difficult to find.

defense and hard work are much easier to acquire as supplemental pieces.

to be fair, it is hard to find very good two way players. they dont come around often and are seldom moved.
- stayinthefnnet

Very true.

Out of the Flyers forwards, too many are pretty bad defensively. The organization chooses to ignore that aspect of a players game too often, and its blamed on systems too much. These guys often come in with that question in their game, drafted, FA or trade.

Simmonds, Hartnell, Giroux, Brayden Schenn and Rinaldo all need major improvement. Briere will probably be gone, and Talbot/Coots had down years defensively.

Still, to me, too many guys that are expected to play big minutes, that are poopty in their own end. Some of the younger players can improve there, I hope they do. Wouldnt bet my testicles on it though. Instead they could look at that aspect of a players game before bringing them in or giving them extensions, which frankly imo they choose to ignore.

if giroux has an 80 point season with so so defensive play, then yeah maybe you get him for 8. but if he puts up close to 100 points in a full year, he will probably be pushing or exceeding 9. i guess it depends if you view giroux as a really good center who needs a guy behind him, or as that franchise top 5 guy in the league.
- stayinthefnnet

Top 5 in the league

Crosby

then in no particular order Toews, Malkin, Lundqvist, Stamkos.

Ive got Giroux out of the top 5

We need to start relegating teams so STHs don't have to spend their money to watch crappy teams like the Flames, Panthers, Coyotes, lightning and Flyers.
- mayorofangrytown

uh, because skill is difficult to find.

defense and hard work are much easier to acquire as supplemental pieces.
- bradleyc4

I'll agree with you for sure.

At the same time, this whole thing for me lies in that too many of the forwards are bad defensively to begin with.

Then its a shock why year after year the team gives up so many goals. Its about building a balanced team, and looking at every aspect instead of just throwing a bunch of players together. My beef with the team for a little while now.

Everything about the Hartnell extension was in his best interest including timing of it, Flyers received no favors.

I like the player and feel that we need him.

Are we going to extend Cooter and Schenn this summer? Think they'd give us a hometown discount? I don't think their agents will be chomping at the bit to get deals done this summer.
- Just5

As I said to you previously. It was a good deal for both sides. The Flyers got him at a reasonable Cap hit. And Hartnell signed for less then he could've gotten in Free Agency, in return for a longer deal.

They will be re-signed at some point in the next Season. If they're not traded.

if giroux has an 80 point season with so so defensive play, then yeah maybe you get him for 8. but if he puts up close to 100 points in a full year, he will probably be pushing or exceeding 9. i guess it depends if you view giroux as a really good center who needs a guy behind him, or as that franchise top 5 guy in the league.
- stayinthefnnet

You are dead on to me in that last point.

I dont view him as a real franchise top 5 guy in the league. He can be, he is still young, but he needs to improve parts of his game consistently.

You are dead on to me in that last point.

I dont view him as a real franchise top 5 guy in the league. He can be, he is still young, but he needs to improve parts of his game consistently.
- flyer_nutter

yeah. however, even if the flyers dont. im sure somebody would. i thought coming into this year he was going to be, and granted it was a shortened season, but it made me think he still has a little to go before he is in that upper upper crust.

Not as high as some others probably.

I'm a fan of Giroux, but he still has to show that he can improve his defensive game.

He showed a really bad habit all year long of looking for the pretty play too much. As well as gliding too much, and not giving his all consistently.

Next year is a big year for Giroux, to see if he can bounce back himself. The point production wasn't terrible, but he made far too many stupid plays that cost the team, or made any offensive chance burn in the ashes of his fancy dancy decisions.

Giroux is a good player, but he is no Crosby. To win, the team will need to have a damn good second line center as well.
- flyer_nutter

Who ever thought that Giroux was Crosby? Giroux is going to get his money. And I wouldn't be surprised if he gets it before they even drop the puck for next Season. There are certainly areas of his game that he needs to improve on. Giroux is one of the top player in the League, and he's going to be paid like it. I think you're drastically overstating how much he needs to bounce back.