The onus is on him to improve on faceoffs, limit the critical turnovers at his own blueline, and hang on to the puck with more authority if he wants a bigger role at ES.

Lavi's not making his life any easier, but it's a hole that Couturier dug himself into, and he has to dig himself out.
- Tomahawk

He absolutely has. But the problems aren't helped when every mistake lands you on the pine. Then he's pressing the stick and creating more mistakes.

His usage is poor, IMO, too. he starts 65% of his shifts in the Flyers zone. He generally plays against the toughest opposition and with the least offensively talented line mates.

All that said, he isn't playing well. But as the season slips away, I'd like to see him get more opportunity as an offensive player.

Thankfully the recent history is a freak accident during the offseason and a food hit from a Ranger (forget who that was). So I don't think it's a case of sudden deterioration.
- Flyskippy

Callahan. And it sounds like Meszaros is injured again. He didn't practice today.

He's hit a bit of a rookie wall. I would have understood drafting him, but I was and am happy with the Couturier pick.

I do not like how he's being used or handled right now.
- Jsaquella

I'm exteremely unhappy with this handling. The problem with the organization is they expect to compete for a cup every year and there just seems to be so little patience. Lavy is coaching for his life now and unfortunately I think Couturier is taking the brunt of that.

What a shame. The Flyers have become the Edmonton Oilers (crappy, no compete, accustomed to losing, etc) but swap high draft picks for heaps of cash (outspending the rest of the league and the only NHL team spending from the LTIR.

Awesome.

The microbus has an expiring contract, though, which bolsters his value as a rental with the cap coming down next season.

A team taking Coburn would have to really want him for the long haul, and that would weed out quite a few potential suitors.

At the end of the day, unless NHL-ready defensemen are coming back the other way, they can't afford to trade either one of Coburn or Mez and hope to improve next year.
- Tomahawk

I do wonder if there isn't a lot of mental tiredness at work here too. I know other teams have similar schedule issues - or will akin to the Flyers early sked this season, but a lot of losses on a short amount of time can wear on one's psyche.

Just ruminating...

He absolutely has. But the problems aren't helped when every mistake lands you on the pine. Then he's pressing the stick and creating more mistakes.

His usage is poor, IMO, too. he starts 65% of his shifts in the Flyers zone. He generally plays against the toughest opposition and with the least offensively talented line mates.

All that said, he isn't playing well. But as the season slips away, I'd like to see him get more opportunity as an offensive player.
- Jsaquella

I agree 10000000%

The cost to replace what they are currently providing would be league minimum.
- PLindbergh31

Right, but the cost to replace what they've brought in past years will be extravagant.

Ron Hainsey's going to get a 5 year deal this summer for over $5mm per year, probably $5.5mm.

You dump Coburn and Meszaros, you're stuck adding a guy on a deal like that, ot trading young assets to get another guy

Hamilton was climbing the rankings while Couturier was dropping like a stone, though. Central Scouting had Hamilton ranked above Couturier in the final go.

I'm sure some scouts from the teams that chose to pass on him are feeling somewhat vindicated now that he's struggling mightily to produce offense at the NHL level... that was the overarching concern about him pre-draft.
- Tomahawk

I think scouts on team realize that the player is only 20 years old and is in his 2nd NHL Season. And that it's not uncommon for young players to struggle. It was alway belevied that Couturier's offensive game would come around later in his development. Hamilton is playing in a much better situation right now in Boston. And is being sheilded.

I am just dropping in to provide your Lord of the Rings related diversion of the day....

...awesomeness...

Not to change the subject but I felt so bad for Simmer last night. After the split lip with the puck to the face and then the stick cutting his nose I understood why he was seriously miffed. I was glad to see he got a goal (even if a freak thing).

The microbus has an expiring contract, though, which bolsters his value as a rental with the cap coming down next season.

A team taking Coburn would have to really want him for the long haul, and that would weed out quite a few potential suitors.

At the end of the day, unless NHL-ready defensemen are coming back the other way, they can't afford to trade either one of Coburn or Mez and hope to improve next year.
- Tomahawk

Agreed, although the high cost of FA defensemen might make Coburn's $4.5mm look appealing.

They would have too many holes to fill if they started dealing away more defensemen

Right, but the cost to replace what they've brought in past years will be extravagant.

Ron Hainsey's going to get a 5 year deal this summer for over $5mm per year, probably $5.5mm.

You dump Coburn and Meszaros, you're stuck adding a guy on a deal like that, ot trading young assets to get another guy
- Jsaquella

I know. There doesn't appear to be a magic formula, or quick fix here. This is going to take a while I'm afraid. And with the shadow Snider casts I'm not very confident it will get done correctly.

I'm exteremely unhappy with this handling. The problem with the organization is they expect to compete for a cup every year and there just seems to be so little patience. Lavy is coaching for his life now and unfortunately I think Couturier is taking the brunt of that.
- nastyflyergirl

I have been a staunch Laviolette supporter, but the reason you cite here is the main reason why I think the ship has sailed with him. When a coach is trying to save his job, the players and organizations best interests take a back seat.

He absolutely has. But the problems aren't helped when every mistake lands you on the pine. Then he's pressing the stick and creating more mistakes.

His usage is poor, IMO, too. he starts 65% of his shifts in the Flyers zone. He generally plays against the toughest opposition and with the least offensively talented line mates.

All that said, he isn't playing well. But as the season slips away, I'd like to see him get more opportunity as an offensive player.
- Jsaquella

Kind of reminds me of the convo we had RE: Carter after the game at Buzzgate I.

I know. There doesn't appear to be a magic formula, or quick fix here. This is going to take a while I'm afraid. And with the shadow Snider casts I'm not very confident it will get done correctly.
- PLindbergh31

You just have to hope that Coburn returns to form or Meszaros stays healthy or maybe both.

Kind of reminds me of the convo we had RE: Carter after the game at Buzzgate I.
- Flyskippy

Yeah. He's doing algebra. Not sure that Couturier is over thinking, just seems worried to make a mistake, so he hesitates and boom, turnover.

He did look awful on the 4th goal last night. Spectating.

At this point we all know that this year is over and I think most of us are just wishing we get a nice high pick this year. I think it hard to judge about this team moving forward because we dont know what this team will look like moving forward. I think we all believe that after this year that the flyers will be very active this off season, whether its via trades or Free Agency, so trying to decide what will happen for this team moving forward is tough to gauge.

I have little issue trading Coburn if it means getting a D man with a higher ceiling in here. We have our Big Men in the top 4 covered with Grossman and Schenn. Sure, next year might not be all pretty but something needs to be done to add speed on the D.

IMO, if you get offered a 1st for Coburn you take it.

You just have to hope that Coburn returns to form or Meszaros stays healthy or maybe both.
- Jsaquella

I'm hoping for both. There's not a lot of rest time this year. It's like a turning a sprint like the 100m into a 3k at sprint speed - that's too long.

I have little issue trading Coburn if it means getting a D man with a higher ceiling in here. We have our Big Men in the top 4 covered with Grossman and Schenn. Sure, next year might not be all pretty but something needs to be done to add speed on the D.

IMO, if you get offered a 1st for Coburn you take it.
- hereticpride

Coburn's got more speed than both Grossmann and Schenn

Coburn's got more speed than both Grossmann and Schenn
- Jsaquella

But manages to play worse than the two.

I'm hoping for both. There's not a lot of rest time this year. It's like a turning a sprint like the 100m into a 3k at sprint speed - that's too long.
- Flyskippy

Given all the other stuff going on, I'm willing to give Coburn another year. Mesz does worry me with the injuries.

But manages to play worse than the two.
- hereticpride

True, he's had a very bad year. I feel he can rebound. I'd listen to offers for him, just would hesitate to jump unless it was too good to refuse.

Next year the Flyers have almost 15 million dollars committed to Timonen, Coburn, and Meszaros. Is changing the coach going to make these players perform better?
Maybe, but there isn't a guarantee of that. Right now these guys are literally playing like spare parts.
- PLindbergh31

Playing a more disciplined defensive system with a stress on proper positional play by the forwards will make ALL Flyer defensemen look better next year.

True, he's had a very bad year. I feel he can rebound. I'd listen to offers for him, just would hesitate to jump unless it was too good to refuse.
- Jsaquella

That's where I'm at. If there is a chance to move him and draft a strong puckmover in the first I would be all over it.