geez, it wasn't chose one over the other, they offered Rask a contract three times and he refused to sign, the problem was JFJ screwed up the trade.
- LeafMan

They still had a year to sign him.....

He was never fired though
- faceto27

No he bailed before they got bad and went to a team on the cusp of winning it all.

Could he??
- DoctorNHL

someone thought so... anyways... the point was...dont trade Gardiner because you have Rielly.

we have some great mistakes to learn from... dont keep repeating them

They still had a year to sign him.....
- jribout

Last post, he wasn't going to sign, I will dig up the article tomorrow if I remember.

No he bailed before they got bad and went to a team on the cusp of winning it all.
- LeafMan

Partially true....... Buffalo wasn't close to anything.

That's unfair to most. I've said that having Reilly makes it more justifiable to move a young dman for a young centre. If we had Strome in the system and not Reilly then it wouldn't. The Leafs have more depth on Def (which of course includes prospects) then they do at centre. No need to cringe.
- The Law

Although The Law.. under Carlyle it seems like the Defence has depth.. I still think they are flimsy... Phaneuf's price tag is high for what he can effectively put out consistently.. he has been inconsistent all year...

Liles.. is a bad defender.. who needs to be traded..

Komi needs to go to for the money.

Gunnarsson is good but not spectacular.. I would like to keep him.

Fraser, Holzer, & Kostka are punching well above their capabilities.. and for the most part play a simple enough game at a great price that they fit into Carlyle's system.. but we could plug those spots with many others.

Gardiner.. has some serious deficiencies.. on the D end.. although Carlyle & Eakins I am sure will fix that.. he will be one of our better defenders..

Reilly has a lot of promise but we still have to wait and see.. so far looks good...

Blacker might never get a chance..

Percy.. is smart.. we will see if he can fill out.. and be able to play in the NHL.. but I have high hopes for him also.

As for Centers we have a lot of 2nd liners.. and potentially more in the AHL if need be.. not to mention a few that will come also in the minors..

Gardiner could be exceptional... much more so than ROR for me.. that is why I won't include him.. because of the upside.

David Pagnotta ‏@TheFourthPeriod

Another down... RT @JohnForslund Canes will officially announce soon that Jeff Skinner has sustained a concussion and will not play tmrw


The NHL has a serious concussion problem brewing.

someone thought so... anyways... the point was...dont trade Gardiner because you have Rielly.

we have some great mistakes to learn from... dont keep repeating them
- senstroll

Agreed fully....

point is, keep your prospects..
- senstroll

or trade them for a prospect with just as high of a ceiling that plays a position they need help in

Doesn't that make an even stronger case for moving Gardiner for ROR?

We know ROR can play in the NHL.
- Atomic Wedgie

They both can. But they'd be better off acquiring O'Reilly without giving up other young players. Better to have them both than just one.

or trade them for a prospect with just as high of a ceiling that plays a position they need help in
- bobbyisno1

THIS

Although The Law.. under Carlyle it seems like the Defence has depth.. I still think they are flimsy... Phaneuf's price tag is high for what he can effectively put out consistently.. he has been inconsistent all year...

Liles.. is a bad defender.. who needs to be traded..

Komi needs to go to for the money.

Gunnarsson is good but not spectacular.. I would like to keep him.

Fraser, Holzer, & Kostka are punching well above their capabilities.. and for the most part play a simple enough game at a great price that they fit into Carlyle's system.. but we could plug those spots with many others.

Gardiner.. has some serious deficiencies.. on the D end.. although Carlyle & Eakins I am sure will fix that.. he will be one of our better defenders..

Reilly has a lot of promise but we still have to wait and see.. so far looks good...

Blacker might never get a chance..

Percy.. is smart.. we will see if he can fill out.. and be able to play in the NHL.. but I have high hopes for him also.

As for Centers we have a lot of 2nd liners.. and potentially more in the AHL if need be.. not to mention a few that will come also in the minors..

Gardiner could be exceptional... much more so than ROR for me.. that is why I won't include him.. because of the upside.
- DoctorNHL

And how are we down the middle? That position that Scotty Bowman called the most important in hockey?

David Pagnotta ‏@TheFourthPeriod

Another down... RT @JohnForslund Canes will officially announce soon that Jeff Skinner has sustained a concussion and will not play tmrw


The NHL has a serious concussion problem brewing.
- faceto27

Thats a couple now for Skinner... how his career doesnt get de-railed here...

Less than that.

The Avalanche probably need defense and probably wouldn't mind replacing O'Reilly with a center. Problem is, they can't take Grabovski because if they could do that, they would have just paid O'Reilly already. Liles, they could fit. Familiar face, veteran and they need the help on defense.

The trick would be to find a team willing to take Grabovski and have them give up the additional pieces required to acquire O'Reilly.

Like I said though, three way deals rarely ever happen in the NHL anymore. Still something the Leafs should consider.
- Two_For_Truth

don't ferget that Grabovski has a limited no trade clause .....

so you can't ship him to another team unless he approves it.

Gilmour wasn't a 1C until he was traded to the Leafs.
- faceto27

Dude you are comparing ROR to Gilmour again... he will be lucky to be a Grabo with multiple 50 point seasons.. let alone one of the best Captains the Leafs ever had.

Last post, he wasn't going to sign, I will dig up the article tomorrow if I remember.
- LeafMan

Cool I did not know that, any reason why?

And how are we down the middle? That position that Scotty Bowman called the most important in hockey?
- The Law

3 second line centers.. and probably 3 3rd or 4th liners..

The point is we should be using those hot commodities to get a first line center.. not overpaying for a potential 2nd liner... I say potential because he needs to put a few 50 pt seasons in a row to be considered that.

They both can. But they'd be better off acquiring O'Reilly without giving up other young players. Better to have them both than just one.
- Two_For_Truth

You're absolutely right ....and when I finish 'tackling' the blond and the brunette tonight I'll sleep better for it.

Sometimes you've got a tough decision to make though ....

THIS
- faceto27

30 pt rookie defender for a 50 pt forward.. I would think most teams would prefer the first.. because those are much harder to find than 50 point forwards.

You're absolutely right ....and when I finish 'tackling' the blond and the brunette tonight I'll sleep better for it.

Sometimes you've got a tough decision to make though ....
- The Law

Always take the brunette.. they are better in bed...

Dude you are comparing ROR to Gilmour again... he will be lucky to be a Grabo with multiple 50 point seasons.. let alone one of the best Captains the Leafs ever had.
- DoctorNHL

The point i'm making is that you were saying Dougie was a great 1C. Which I agree, BUT, dougie started off as third line checking center first, then developed into the 1C. And you cannot make that statement about RoR, you nor I know what his ceiling may be.

He is a center with a big upside. Gardiner is a defenseman with a big upside. We don't have any center's with a big upside in our system, aside with the potential of Kadri. We have a surplus of big upside defenseman, therefore you can trade one of them for a player that fills a position that we are lacking in.

or trade them for a prospect with just as high of a ceiling that plays a position they need help in
- bobbyisno1

not yet...unless you can get ROR for less than one of our young prospects
add the right player as a FA if you cant in the meantime, keep drafting, developing until its time to add the pieces you need..leafs are not there yet.

imagine if Burke just waited, kept our picks, seguin, hamilton or whoever else it turned out to be.. then add a Perry this off season... not the other way around

Dude you are comparing ROR to Gilmour again... he will be lucky to be a Grabo with multiple 50 point seasons.. let alone one of the best Captains the Leafs ever had.
- DoctorNHL

he had his first 50 point season when he was 27, it's a little different don't ya think

3 second line centers.. and probably 3 3rd or 4th liners..

The point is we should be using those hot commodities to get a first line center.. not overpaying for a potential 2nd liner... I say potential because he needs to put a few 50 pt seasons in a row to be considered that.
- DoctorNHL

So given Gardiners brief history you'd agree that he's only a 3rd pairing dman because he doesn't have the resume to suggest otherwise yet?

99 flavours of ice cream ....

Grabo has done enough to be a #2 ...I'm not putting Bozak there though. Kadri is the only reason I even hesitate (for a second) to acknowledge this team needs help down the middle. Kadri might show enough over the next 3/4 months to make us all forget about our centre ice needs ...but the problem is the market for centres may be empty by then.

Last post, he wasn't going to sign, I will dig up the article tomorrow if I remember.
- LeafMan

Leafman I don't remember the contract issue either.. my recollection was that the Leafs had an open Goalie spot and he was interested.. he was just waiting in Europe until a roster spot opened up on the NHL team..

which it did...

not trying to say you didn't read an article saying that.. you know how Toronto is.. the writers find every bullcrap they can muster.. and make issues out of nothing.