A Schenn is a bit more easy to place than a player like JVR.

both were high end picks, but JVR really gives them something they haven't had in quite some time.
- aries1976

i wasnt so sure about it at first.. but carlyle seems to have him convinced now that he's going to produce more being the big guy in front of the net.. nice to see he has taken it to heart

he will be a hell of a player if he continues to use his size to his advantage.

Good chance Hartnell bites Phaneuf tonight.
- robin_steele264

Hartnell is injured.



I keep finding it hilarious how all the media experts keep saying something along the lines of "Ironically now that Burke is gone the Leafs are finally living up to his pugnacity etc. "

Except its not ironic. This is the team Burke built. Nonnis hasnt even made a single roster move. Since Burke had to get rid of a lot crap before he could ice the team he wanted, its hard to blame him for coming up short during the building of his team.

I want to watch Silent Hill.

sure hope Hall's wearing the mouthguard.

if he decides to take a chomp out of someone, there could be serious damage.
- BorjeFan4Ever

I hear he can take a whole bale of hay at a time.

I don't think it's that Carlyle didn't have much use for Schenn- because Schenn is very much a Carlyle player- it's that they probably felt they needed what JVR could bring more.
- Feeling Glucky?

I don't disagree. I think Carlyle could have put in the work with Schenn to make him into a decent enough second pairing guy.

But for all the trouble that would have been, they'd rather invest the effort in JVR.

Atomic if you saw the whole Orr thing than you would see that he was within his rights.. Plakanec two handed him knocking the stick out of his Plakanec then kicked the stick down the ice.. that is when Orr.. got his head of steam.. and let up at the last second probably knowing he would be suspended if he laid a clean shoulder on him..


That is when Gionta rushed him with his stick up.. Orr grabbed him and shook him.. don't think he was going to hit Gionta.. unless Gionta punched him.. that is when Bourque face cranked him from behind and he turned and did this:




Nothing that Orr did was wrong.. the incidental knee was when he turned.. and he grazed him.. there was no actual knee on knee.. it hit him on the side..
- DoctorNHL

Keep in mind I've only seen clips, but in my humble opinion, Orr dropped his gloves too early.

I don't have a problem with him trying to pummel Gionta after Gionta gives him free dental work with his stick.

But Orr's gloves are off before Gionta hits him.

Many will disagree with me, but in my book Orr needs to keep his gloves on until Gionta hits him - then he can drop the gloves and commence pummelling.

But in any event, my point is this: to me a goon trying to pummel a captain is a much bigger incident than Grabbo biting Patches.

I'm just surprised by what became the topic of the day on Hockeybuzz. If I'm a Habs fan, I'd be much, much more pissed about what Orr did (right or wrong - two sides herre) than what Grabbo did.

I don't think it's that Carlyle didn't have much use for Schenn- because Schenn is very much a Carlyle player- it's that they probably felt they needed what JVR could bring more.
- Feeling Glucky?

Tocchet had a good observation of both players...He said with Schenn you know what you're getting a solid 3 shutdown dman where with JvR there's potential for a 30-40 goals per year type growth...He went with JvR and the Leafs winning this trade...

i wasnt so sure about it at first.. but carlyle seems to have him convinced now that he's going to produce more being the big guy in front of the net.. nice to see he has taken it to heart

he will be a hell of a player if he continues to use his size to his advantage.
- Dozzer

I really like JVR's game. Leafs are best when they have a big body in front of the net.

Hartnell is injured.



I keep finding it hilarious how all the media experts keep saying something along the lines of "Ironically now that Burke is gone the Leafs are finally living up to his pugnacity etc. "

Except its not ironic. This is the team Burke built. Nonnis hasnt even made a single roster move. Since Burke had to get rid of a lot crap before he could ice the team he wanted, its hard to blame him for coming up short during the building of his team.
- Aquaman_2400

not true at all

he moved lombardi out of town and demoted connolly opening up roster spots for younger guys

both pretty minor moves at the time.. but as it turns out, they were actually quite effective.

ACC booked on that date because of the lockout? If not it doesn't make sense.
- LeafMan

I took a quick look at the ACC online schedule - looks like the building is dark that night.

i wasnt so sure about it at first.. but carlyle seems to have him convinced now that he's going to produce more being the big guy in front of the net.. nice to see he has taken it to heart

he will be a hell of a player if he continues to use his size to his advantage.
- Dozzer

Agreed.

Fraser and Holzer make Schenn look very replaceable as well.
Fraser already a +6... which to some doesn't mean a lot, but still that's a very respectable and reliable number for the short number of games he has played.

Tocchet had a good observation of both players...He said with Schenn you know what you're getting a solid 3 shutdown dman where with JvR there's potential for a 30-40 goals per year type growth...He went with JvR and the Leafs winning this trade...
- Flyfreaky

HOw is a debate. The second the trade was made I said, "huge steal for the Leafs" and time will only prove that correct. In a worse case scenerio, the Leafs only slightly ripped off Philly.

I took a quick look at the ACC online schedule - looks like the building is dark that night.
- Atomic Wedgie

Maybe they could replay the Leafs/Habs game from the other night...

not true at all

he moved lombardi out of town and demoted connolly opening up roster spots for younger guys

both pretty minor moves at the time.. but as it turns out, they were actually quite effective.
- Dozzer

FRAZER MACLAREN.


nuff said.

not true at all

he moved lombardi out of town and demoted connolly opening up roster spots for younger guys

both pretty minor moves at the time.. but as it turns out, they were actually quite effective.
- Dozzer

You right, but in fairness, lots of people, including me, said in the summer that those were obvious moves to make and Burke most likely would have done the same thing.

Agreed.

Fraser and Holzer make Schenn look very replaceable as well.
Fraser already a +6... which to some doesn't mean a lot, but still that's a very respectable and reliable number for the short number of games he has played.
- aries1976

The short number of games can skew the stat.

Keep in mind I've only seen clips, but in my humble opinion, Orr dropped his gloves too early.

I don't have a problem with him trying to pummel Gionta after Gionta gives him free dental work with his stick.

But Orr's gloves are off before Gionta hits him.

Many will disagree with me, but in my book Orr needs to keep his gloves on until Gionta hits him - then he can drop the gloves and commence pummelling.

But in any event, my point is this: to me a goon trying to pummel a captain is a much bigger incident than Grabbo biting Patches.

I'm just surprised by what became the topic of the day on Hockeybuzz. If I'm a Habs fan, I'd be much, much more pissed about what Orr did (right or wrong - two sides herre) than what Grabbo did.
- Atomic Wedgie

the part you missed

after the hit gionta skated directly at orr and looked like he had every intention of engaging him

at the last second he seemed to realize what he was doing and decided to not drop his gloves and stick but put it up into Orr's face. it basically amounts to goading the guy into a fight.. it happens so fast out on the ice.. and orr had every reason to believe gionta was coming at him

and who knows what might of been said out there as well. thats something we dont get to be privy to.

Maybe they could replay the Leafs/Habs game from the other night...
- Flyfreaky

They should show that game's highlights every morning in school when the kids are singing O'Canada.

HOw is a debate. The second the trade was made I said, "huge steal for the Leafs" and time will only prove that correct. In a worse case scenerio, the Leafs only slightly ripped off Philly.
- Aquaman_2400

I didn't mind trading JvR for Schenn...I think Schenn can develop into a solid #3 with some 2 plug in possibilities...JvR should be a solid 25+ goals per year kinda player...

Agreed.

Fraser and Holzer make Schenn look very replaceable as well.
Fraser already a +6... which to some doesn't mean a lot, but still that's a very respectable and reliable number for the short number of games he has played.
- aries1976

yup, the leafs have enough offensive D in the lineup

they needed tough guys.. basically guys who can actually do the job komi was supposed to do.

In this day and age, with jillionaire players, every coach has a shelf life.

Ruff's act has grown stake, imho.

Doesn't make him a bad coach.

It's just time for a change.
- Atomic Wedgie

Yeah, even before jillionaire players, coaches had shelf lives. Even Scotty Bowman, the greatest coach of all time, moved around several times.

The typical coach only gets around 4-5 years with a team, maybe 7-8 with huge success.

The short number of games can skew the stat.
- Feeling Glucky?

the obvious, is they're not scoring 5 on 5, when he is on the ice, dependability, is dependability, no matter how many games are played.

Tocchet had a good observation of both players...He said with Schenn you know what you're getting a solid 3 shutdown dman where with JvR there's potential for a 30-40 goals per year type growth...He went with JvR and the Leafs winning this trade...
- Flyfreaky

If JVR lives up to his potential, or at least shows up to the majority of games, it's a win.

I think it's still closer than most Leafs fans would want to admit.

I think Max has a bit of a size advantage, but Grabovski isn't one to back down. It will be an animated affair next time for sure. Always love to see a good healthy hate between a couple teams.
- BlueBallz

Agreed BB Grabo will KO him for definite...

not true at all

he moved lombardi out of town and demoted connolly opening up roster spots for younger guys

both pretty minor moves at the time.. but as it turns out, they were actually quite effective.
- Dozzer

and pickud up Frazer McLaren