There is something to be said for the fact that Drury never came close to the player he was here when he left to go to NY. He had also pretty much been completely forgotten about while he was in Calgary. Most of his "magic" had worn off at that point.

I think it really had more to do with the team in general than it did with Ruff though. Right out of the lockout the league was more focused on offense and that team had more than most teams could handle.
- HonkFortheGoose

I really do credit Drury more than Ruff. He was the only real captain (other than Peca) that Ruff had. Drury demanded a lot from his teammates and held players accountable. He got the respect that Ruff only wishes he had. Drury also challenged and questioned Ruff. That is something a captain needs to do. If you believe Paul Hamilton, Ruff hated Drury as captain

I feel differently about that I think Drury was the exact player Ruff loved to have. Drury and Peca. The bottom line is we haven't found that player again since Drury left.
- sabresfandan

Drury is a lot like Peca. But again, I think he had more to do with how that team performed than Ruff did. I'm also not surprised that when he went to NY he didn't do quite as good. I think a lot of it has to do with the coach letting guys play their game, and I think because Ruff trusted Drury, he let him do his thing. I don't think the same thing could be said for Drury in NY. Especially after Tortorella took over.

I just certainly hope the next move we see with this team isn't a trade like Stafford for Penner, Darcy has to find a way to land a stud player.

Thanks sir

I also think that we don't need to make drastic changes for our team to drastically improve...

Get me Dubinsky & Helm...
Improved grit, secondary scoring helped, FACEOFFS improved

Vanek-Hodgson-Pominville
Foligno-Ennis-DUBINSKY
Ott-Grigorenko-Stafford
Hecht-HELM-Kaleta
Gerbe
Scott

Get me Giordano to help steady our defense
Ehrhoff-GIORDANO
Sekera-Myers (as goose points out, they were good together last year)
Weber-Sulzer/Regehr

None of those 3 trades should cost us much more than picks & prospects
Then in the offseason,
Take advantage of the brutal cap trouble Vancouver and/or Chicago are in, and get me someone like Bieksa, Hamhuis, Hjalmarsson...

Then we'd have a solid freaking defense!
And Miller will again be of Vezina quality
- jdfitz77

This is where you lose me.... We are near the bottom of the NHL is wins and defense, you say it's a talent problem and not a caoching problem but somehow we do not need a drastic change to the roster?

Drury is a lot like Peca. But again, I think he had more to do with how that team performed than Ruff did. I'm also not surprised that when he went to NY he didn't do quite as good. I think a lot of it has to do with the coach letting guys play their game, and I think because Ruff trusted Drury, he let him do his thing. I don't think the same thing could be said for Drury in NY. Especially after Tortorella took over.
- HonkFortheGoose

I agree with that Drury had free reign here like you said Ruff had complete trust in him.

Getting Drury was a big deal when we got him. He had an off year in Calgary but he had already made a name for himself with his playoff heroics in Colorado. He was the best forward this team had in almost a decade. Lindy didn't make him a star, Drury gave this team credibility and made the players accountable. Something Pominville can't do

Briere wasn't a star before he got here but it isn't like Ruff turned a beer league player into an all star. He did score 30 in PHX the year before
- ZamboniMassacre

Like I said,
They didn't suck before they got here
But they did improve quite a bit
And their best years were undeniably here under Ruff

Like I said,
They didn't suck before they got here
But they did improve quite a bit
And their best years were undeniably here under Ruff
- jdfitz77

AGREED, I've always been a Ruff fan but if Darcy doesn't want to shakeup the roster via trade then it has to be firing Ruff as the next move. Like Hamilton said it's either blow up the roster or fire the coach.

I really do credit Drury more than Ruff. He was the only real captain (other than Peca) that Ruff had. Drury demanded a lot from his teammates and held players accountable. He got the respect that Ruff only wishes he had. Drury also challenged and questioned Ruff. That is something a captain needs to do. If you believe Paul Hamilton, Ruff hated Drury as captain
- ZamboniMassacre

I wouldn't be surprised. That's part of why Pommer is captain now. Because he won't question Ruff.

Don't get me wrong, I don't have a problem with Pommer as captain, but he's the complete opposite of Drury personality wise.

They left and signed $7mil per deals
And their stats (and most would say leadership & other intangibles) were better here than anywhere else
- jdfitz77

They were the highest scoring team in the NHL. Of course there best numbers will be here. Did Peter Laviolette make Scott Hartnell a star because he had a career year last year? Or is it because he gets to play with Claude Giroux.

I just certainly hope the next move we see with this team isn't a trade like Stafford for Penner, Darcy has to find a way to land a stud player.
- sabresfandan

That would actually free up cap space though once this year is over. Penner is in the last year of his deal.

That would actually free up cap space though once this year is over. Penner is in the last year of his deal.
- HonkFortheGoose

Yeah I know but I wouldn't like that kind of move at all but it would be nice to get 21's contract off the books.

I agree with that Drury had free reign here like you said Ruff had complete trust in him.
- sabresfandan

It's funny that you say that. Paul Hamilton (among others) have said numerous times that Ruff did not like Drury as captain. He hated that Drury would challenge him and question his decisions

It's funny that you say that. Paul Hamilton (among others) have said numerous times that Ruff did not like Drury as captain. He hated that Drury would challenge him and question his decisions
- ZamboniMassacre

When push came to shove Lindy knew what he had with Drury, I don't think he disliked Drury at all.

I wouldn't be surprised. That's part of why Pommer is captain now. Because he won't question Ruff.

Don't get me wrong, I don't have a problem with Pommer as captain, but he's the complete opposite of Drury personality wise.
- HonkFortheGoose

I do have a problem with Pommer as captain. I like him as a player a lot but as a captain, he's nothing. That's the problem, we don't really have somebody like a Drury or Peca. Even bigger problem is that Lindy doesn't like those kind of captains. That's why we get stuck with Pommer and Hecht and the like

That would actually free up cap space though once this year is over. Penner is in the last year of his deal.
- HonkFortheGoose

yeah i'm okay with that, if we can't get somebody like brassard, o'reilly, or a veteran defenseman, then we might as well get a penner type and hope they throw in a draft pick or prospect.

Drury had 5 20+ goal seasons in a row before he came here and scored 30+ on the highest scoring team in the NHL, then he had 2 more 20+ goal seasons in New York. Breire was in his prime and had a 30 goal season before he came here. They flourished here because they were on the most talented team post lockout. Ruff did nothing special to make them "stars", they were already very good players.
- sbroads24

I feel like we are just going in circles here...

But this whole line of discussion started when someone said "maybe we can get Brown from LA"
And I said that'd be great

And then someone responded "why, Ruff will just ruin him"
Or something to that effect

I'm just trying to say that there have been a bunch of guys here that have done very well under Ruff

The talent here needs improving...
Pretending guys like Regehr have anything left in the tank,
Or Leopold is actually worthy of top4 min,
Well, that's just wrong IMO
And blaming Ruff for that is a cop out

I'm ok with firing Ruff,
But it's more on the players IMO than him
I guess we will just have to agree to disagree on that

It's funny that you say that. Paul Hamilton (among others) have said numerous times that Ruff did not like Drury as captain. He hated that Drury would challenge him and question his decisions
- ZamboniMassacre

I heard Drury asked Ruff for a trade. He didn't like Ruffs just squeak into 8th mentality.

When push came to shove Lindy knew what he had with Drury, I don't think he disliked Drury at all.
- sabresfandan

I'm only just saying what people who are constantly around the team have reported. It's not like Hamilton has any kind of agenda against Ruff so I totally believe it.

I heard Drury asked Ruff for a trade. He didn't like Ruffs just squeak into 8th mentality.
- Buffalo--Sabres

I didn't hear that he asked for a trade but I don't really think he respected Ruff much

I'm only just saying what people who are constantly around the team have reported. It's not like Hamilton has any kind of agenda against Ruff so I totally believe it.
- ZamboniMassacre

Yeah I like Paul Hamilton a lot I think he does a good job, a lot of stuff leaks out months or even years later.

It's funny that you say that. Paul Hamilton (among others) have said numerous times that Ruff did not like Drury as captain. He hated that Drury would challenge him and question his decisions
- ZamboniMassacre

He may not have liked Drury's personality, but it didn't mean he didn't trust him when it came to his play on the ice.

I feel like we are just going in circles here...

But this whole line of discussion started when someone said "maybe we can get Brown from LA"
And I said that'd be great

And then someone responded "why, Ruff will just ruin him"
Or something to that effect

I'm just trying to say that there have been a bunch of guys here that have done very well under Ruff

The talent here needs improving...
Pretending guys like Regehr have anything left in the tank,
Or Leopold is actually worthy of top4 min,
Well, that's just wrong IMO
And blaming Ruff for that is a cop out

I'm ok with firing Ruff,
But it's more on the players IMO than him
I guess we will just have to agree to disagree on that
- jdfitz77

Brown would be fine because he wouldn't take Ruff's sh!t, just like Drury didn't take it. Those players don't get walked over

He may not have liked Drury's personality, but it didn't mean he didn't trust him when it came to his play on the ice.
- HonkFortheGoose

Exactly what my point was.

I heard Drury asked Ruff for a trade. He didn't like Ruffs just squeak into 8th mentality.
- Buffalo--Sabres

i remember paul hamilton saying (at the beginning of drurys last season) that he was sick of having new linemates constantly and wanted set linemates like briere had.

we can blame ruff all we want, and maybe he should be fired just to make noise but it's on the players too and part of that is that this group isn't talented enough.

there are things we can do to improve and our youth developing is a positive, so imo, all is not lost. we've got better youth in the system now then we did 3-4 years ago.

I do have a problem with Pommer as captain. I like him as a player a lot but as a captain, he's nothing. That's the problem, we don't really have somebody like a Drury or Peca. Even bigger problem is that Lindy doesn't like those kind of captains. That's why we get stuck with Pommer and Hecht and the like
- ZamboniMassacre

The fact that you think we need a Captain like Drury or Peca says that you don't think the players here are capable of motivating themselves. Do you think Crosby goes into the lockerroom and acts like Peca or Drury did? I doubt it.