That was my point. His offensive numbers are okay, but questions still remain about his ability to play in his own zone. Can he be a complete player, or will he just be another mike green (with a little less offense)
- sensarmy_11

Um better in his own zone? The guy was a +9 last year on the 3rd worst team in the entire league. Safe to say he's really good in his own zone.

People are saying Habs fans are undervaluing O'reilly because they don't watch him enough. Well a lot of people undervalue Subban for the exact same reasons. If they were to watch even 5 Habs games from last year, it was clear to see he was easily our best defenseman. And this year, with our D corps pretty much unchanged last year (except for Markov becoming old Markov), he's top 2. So how do we overvalue Subban when he's a top pairing D who plays on the PP and PKs? I don't know.

Well, Subban is playing right now and helping his team, while ROR still wants his Jamie Benn money. PK caved in because A) he really wanted to stay in Montreal and said so multiple times and B) saw that Bergevin wasn't someone you could fool, unlike Greg Sherman who got a history of bad trades and inflated contracts.
So, unless the Avs want to already write-off this season and tank on purpose, they will either give O'Reilly his money or get rid of a problem and try to get some assets back right now to help their very weak offense.

And while my Heatley example was not perfect (because of the NTC), you can't deny that a player trade value goes down when he publicly states that he wants to get traded.
- Gannicus

To the best of my knowledge, o'reilly has never asked to be traded.

4 more times than Vancouver? The Rangers. Not that they should be proud of their average.
- Gian_Carlo

i was refering to the Quick vs Lundqvist comments.

Um better in his own zone? The guy was a +9 last year on the 3rd worst team in the entire league. Safe to say he's really good in his own zone.

People are saying Habs fans are undervaluing O'reilly because they don't watch him enough. Well a lot of people undervalue Subban for the exact same reasons. If they were to watch even 5 Habs games from last year, it was clear to see he was easily our best defenseman. And this year, with our D corps pretty much unchanged last year (except for Markov becoming old Markov), he's top 2. So how do we overvalue Subban when he's a top pairing D who plays on the PP and PKs? I don't know.
- Saundies

Come on man, plus/minus is the WORST stat ever to judge a guys defensive ability. Last season filip kuba had like the 3rd highes plus/minus in the league, and i believe when lidstrom won his last norris he was even or maybe +1. That stat is useless.

Is pk awful in his own zone? No

Does he have A LOT of room for improvement in his defensive game? Definitely

I'm not undervaluing subban. I've been praising o'reilly for 10 pages and i still said pk is probably worth a little more.

U need to talk to that other genius habs fan, who seems to think o'reilly is worth only eller and a 2nd rd pick.

Come on man, plus/minus is the WORST stat ever to judge a guys defensive ability. Last season filip kuba had like the 3rd highes plus/minus in the league, and i believe when lidstrom won his last norris he was even or maybe +1. That stat is useless.

Is pk awful in his own zone? No

Does he have A LOT of room for improvement in his defensive game? Definitely

I'm not undervaluing subban. I've been praising o'reilly for 10 pages and i still said pk is probably worth a little more.

U need to talk to that other genius habs fan, who seems to think o'reilly is worth only eller and a 2nd rd pick.
- sensarmy_11

If you were to find my last post in here, which I know you won't do, I already said that Eller, Weber, and the 2nd is clearly not even close to what it would take to get O'reilly. If anything, I said, I'd AT LEAST start with Desharnais and try to build a package around him in some way.

Plus minus might not be the greatest stat in the world, but when your team is third last in the NHL and everyone assumes that you're just a powerplay/offensive player like people do with Subban I think it's fair to say that it means something. Especially when you're a #1 Defense who constantly has to go up against every team's top players every night, on a terrible team, with that kind of plus minus. You can't just throw it out the window either, because guaranteed is he was a -20 or something like that you'd be all "LOOK HOW BAD HE IS DEFENSIVELY! -20!"

Plus, Kuba played great for you guys last year, at least that's what I had to listen to all the analysts rave about everytime we played Ottawa.

If you were to find my last post in here, which I know you won't do, I already said that Eller, Weber, and the 2nd is clearly not even close to what it would take to get O'reilly. If anything, I said, I'd AT LEAST start with Desharnais and try to build a package around him in some way.
.
- Saundies

Well around Eller or Desharnais there is not much difference... trade Desharnais instead of Eller I'm fine with it... I prefer to keep Eller than Desharnais if you give me the choice

If you were to find my last post in here, which I know you won't do, I already said that Eller, Weber, and the 2nd is clearly not even close to what it would take to get O'reilly. If anything, I said, I'd AT LEAST start with Desharnais and try to build a package around him in some way.

Plus minus might not be the greatest stat in the world, but when your team is third last in the NHL and everyone assumes that you're just a powerplay/offensive player like people do with Subban I think it's fair to say that it means something. Especially when you're a #1 Defense who constantly has to go up against every team's top players every night, on a terrible team, with that kind of plus minus. You can't just throw it out the window either, because guaranteed is he was a -20 or something like that you'd be all "LOOK HOW BAD HE IS DEFENSIVELY! -20!"

Plus, Kuba played great for you guys last year, at least that's what I had to listen to all the analysts rave about everytime we played Ottawa.
- Saundies

Sorry, didn't mean to lump u in with that homer

As for plus/minus, no you can't just dismiss it, but you also can't just say "he was plus nine, must mean he's good defensively".

And kuba is, at best, an avg dman who benefitted from playing with karlsson

Hehe, Stastny would probably benefit from a change of scenery and yes he's not worth his contract but he's better than Vermette. PHX are deep at D but not so much at C and it's the other way around for the Avs. Plus those 2 teams have history when it comes to trades. And dude, read it again... I say those 2 players plus other unknown assets would be a good deal. Offer Barrie or Elliot, draft pick who cares? PHX is moving to Quebec anyway lol

Your Predators would benefit a lot from Stastny...He's a solid 1B/2A centre that got overpaid too quickly and I think he needs a change. His time has run it's course in Colorado unfortunately.
- 19Sakic19

you said they would be the main pieces. I said Stastny doesn't work as the main piece. He's a secondary piece for Yandle. I like Stastny, but Yandle is sick.

you said they would be the main pieces. I said Stastny doesn't work as the main piece. He's a secondary piece for Yandle. I like Stastny, but Yandle is sick.
- prock

Well at least we can agree to disagree lol I don't think he's a secondary piece. I think it's a pretty fair trade if you add a little more and yes Yandle is sick! but I'm not sure PHX see that. Lots of people are saying he is/will be available. Not like I'm saying; Kobasew, Hunwick, and a 3rd lol...

Hope we see some trades soon! At least the Islanders keep it entertaining haha!

Oilers may be looking for a center but the Islanders don't have one. With Halls ability last night taking face offs, they can just as easily look for a winger. Although I think they are inquiring about Visnovsky. He did good with the Oilers and although he left Edmonton saying he wanted warmer climates, he might like the warmer welcome the team gives him after the drama he has caused in NYI.

who won the vezina?
- rangerdanger94

Who won the cup with the first 8th seeded team ever to accomplish the feat? Wgaf about the Vezina. Not to mention, who deserved the Vezina? Quick had two more shutouts, 100 more saves, and a better GAA on a team that couldn't score a damn goal all year until the playoffs came around. Not to mention the dude had to coop with two different coaching styles half way through the year. The win-loss stats are hindered due to the offensive deficiency, and the sv% is virtually even. Hank got it because he plays in New York on an original 6 team, with style and hair like Beckham. Only a fool would think Beckham was ever the best, but just like the Hank believers, there were ppl who thought so.

Well at least we can agree to disagree lol I don't think he's a secondary piece. I think it's a pretty fair trade if you add a little more and yes Yandle is sick! but I'm not sure PHX see that. Lots of people are saying he is/will be available. Not like I'm saying; Kobasew, Hunwick, and a 3rd lol...

Hope we see some trades soon! At least the Islanders keep it entertaining haha!
- 19Sakic19

Yeah, I don't see it. Yandle was FOURTH in Norris voting just two years ago. You don't trade that for a package where the main piece is an overpaid second line centre.

Not quite sure why people think the ducks should get more from the leafs in a Kessel/getslaf trade. In past 3 years getslaf has 203 points and Kessel has 202. Seems pretty even to me and Kessel is younger.

Not quite sure why people think the ducks should get more from the leafs in a Kessel/getslaf trade. In past 3 years getslaf has 203 points and Kessel has 202. Seems pretty even to me and Kessel is younger.
- Hallis2

Getz is also a center who has and uses his size. I dont think the leafs should do it. Not when they are a fringe playoff team, and hes a pending ufa.