grabo and kessel are both zone penetrators.. they like to carry it in.. and distribute from there.. setup.. and shoot when it comes back to them if the shot is there

too similar of a player to mesh well
- Dozzer

Still odd to never see the best winger play with the best centre once in 3+ years.

When did Nonis refuse to trade him? He's also technically not allowed to renegotiate an extension before July 1st. That would stop me from asking his agent about "Player K's" desire to remain a Leaf and what he thinks it might cost.
- 1979AD

He has next year to trade him. Lets just relax a bit and not panic as if Nonis doesn't have a full year to make the decision. He doesnt have to negotiate. Call his agent, gauge Kessels interest. There are no rules against discussions with agents, without negotiating an actual contract. You dont have to make offers, but take the year to figure out where Kessel stands and what his plans are.

At least it is KFC, that should be enough to ruin your appi, No?
- bixll

i like their fries

their chicken?

meh. when i want breaded chicken i will make my own like i did last night

My point is that in order to build a good team, a sturdy team, a team that can compete you dont trade a player like Kessel. Like you said, it's the quality, and Kessel is quality whether some like him or not. Im not entirey sure where you got the notion where I said build a pile of poop.
- systemtool

What notion? I didn't say you said that... I said it because it could be derived from the fact that you said "it should be a matter of building something." You don't just build to build since you more than likely will end up with a poopty project (like the Leafs for years now) or a bunch of scrap pieces thrown together, you build it right by accumulating a solid core of young players. Kessel is a one-dimsenional player, sure he's quality but he does not contain the aspects that a well-rounded star should have. You do not build around a one-dimensional player.

He has next year to trade him. Lets just relax a bit and not panic as if Nonis doesn't have a full year to make the decision. He doesnt have to negotiate. Call his agent, gauge Kessels interest. There are no rules against discussions with agents, without negotiating an actual contract. You dont have to make offers, but take the year to figure out where Kessel stands and what his plans are.
- systemtool

Now you're preaching to the choir. I was just trying to figure out why/how you held such a strong opinion that he won't walk as a UFA.

i like their fries

their chicken?

meh. when i want breaded chicken i will make my own like i did last night
- Dozzer

Anything made at home is better than fast food, good call Dozzer.

That said, of all the fast food chicken places, Popeyes is the only one I would consider.

grabo and kessel are both zone penetrators.. they like to carry it in.. and distribute from there.. setup.. and shoot when it comes back to them if the shot is there

too similar of a player to mesh well
- Dozzer

that is the thought, yes, and i agree, it may not work...but

with kessel in this slump, i feel he actually NEEEEEDS to score a goal, even just 1. ASAP.

say grabo enters the zone, he can weave his magic and find phil..if JVR is in front like he should be great! phil can shoot or pull the D away which leaves Gbov open for the pass and bury.

just saying MAYBE worth trying because we need phil with some goals, then by all means swithc back! but gotta get him going you know!

The Rangers didn't get Richards just to have him play with Gaborik and Taylor (frank)ing Pyatt, they got Nash because they expected him to mesh with Richards. They got a good player and said "we need to now get him a winger."
- Conquest

So they got a really good centre.

And then they got a really good winger.

And your revelation is they didn't get Nash to play on their third line?

Thanks, tips.

Now you're preaching to the choir. I was just trying to figure out why/how you held such a strong opinion that he won't walk as a UFA.
- 1979AD

Nonis would be hung from the CN Tower if he let Kessel walk, and he has to know it. Wont is a strong word for someone on the outside, but it not logical or fair to think Nonis isn't aware of this.

i like their fries

their chicken?

meh. when i want breaded chicken i will make my own like i did last night
- Dozzer

But did you use 11 herbs and spices?

i like their fries

their chicken?

meh. when i want breaded chicken i will make my own like i did last night
- Dozzer

What do u use??

Still odd to never see the best winger play with the best centre once in 3+ years.
- 1979AD

its been tried.. it really didnt work out.. then again.. in fairness.. not much time was given for them to gel

its their style of play.. they are both really similar.. each one of the guys needs a physical guy (power forward) and a defensive guy who can pitch in offense from time to time

They got him because hes a good player, he was available and he was willing to waive his NTC to go there.
- systemtool

Any team could have went after him, that's not an argument to say it was simply because he's a good player. He decided to go there on his own because he saw that they were a contender. If the Leafs had the Rangers exact line-up, he would've more than likely went to the Leafs, it wasn't simply because he loves New York and wants to stand around beside the Empire State Building. Any player is available for the right price, the Rangers had a need and went after it to allow a Nash-Richards-Gaborik line.

grabo and kessel are both zone penetrators.. they like to carry it in.. and distribute from there.. setup.. and shoot when it comes back to them if the shot is there

too similar of a player to mesh well
- Dozzer

they could just play rock, paper and scissors before each rush, no? keep the opponents guessing on where the shot is going to come from?

Anything made at home is better than fast food, good call Dozzer.

That said, of all the fast food chicken places, Popeyes is the only one I would consider.
- systemtool

never tried it... there is a mary browns fried chicken i used to like here in london.. but i was in my early 20s and i went out drinking alot lol

So they got a really good centre.

And then they got a really good winger.

And your revelation is they didn't get Nash to play on their third line?

Thanks, tips.
- Atomic Wedgie

What revelation? The point I wanted to prove is that they got a player and then said, "now we want someone to play with him", to disprove your idiotic notion of "You don't get a guy and then think about what other guys would go well with that guy." Please try to follow along with your own argument.

its been tried.. it really didnt work out.. then again.. in fairness.. not much time was given for them to gel

its their style of play.. they are both really similar.. each one of the guys needs a physical guy (power forward) and a defensive guy who can pitch in offense from time to time
- Dozzer

i agree with ya bruce, i do.

i jsut wonder with the lack of lupul and the concentration that phil is getting...maybe everyone once in a while RC could switch it up and toss Grabo out there for a couple shifts with that line to see what happens...

i just feel like grabo may be able to take some of the attention away from phil, and jVR in front that should also open up some room, together...maybe enough to get that damned monkey off his back!

What notion? I didn't say you said that... I said it because it could be derived from the fact that you said "it should be a matter of building something." You don't just build to build since you more than likely will end up with a poopty project (like the Leafs for years now) or a bunch of scrap pieces thrown together, you build it right by accumulating a solid core of young players. Kessel is a one-dimsenional player, sure he's quality but he does not contain the aspects that a well-rounded star should have. You do not build around a one-dimensional player.
- Conquest

I didnt think I needed to be as specific to have to say building a winner in order for people to understand the point. Sorry, my bad.

I dont care how many dimensions Kessel has. He was 6th in the league in points, and thats good enough for me and should be for most teams. Again, you bring it back to building "around" a certain player. That is the exact point im making. This team is desperate for top level talent and the solution isnt and shouldnt be trading him. You build "a team that can contend" by building "with" Kessel.

As for a solid core of young players. Kessel is 25.

I had this debate with UG last night. Its not a matter of building "around" anything. It should be about building something.
- systemtool

Not to start a debate, but that sounds like the same thing in a different skin. However I do agree with you - you build "about" winning for instance. I get it.

Any team could have went after him, that's not an argument to say it was simply because he's a good player. He decided to go there on his own because he saw that they were a contender. If the Leafs had the Rangers exact line-up, he would've more than likely went to the Leafs, it wasn't simply because he loves New York and wants to stand around beside the Empire State Building. Any player is available for the right price, the Rangers had a need and went after it to allow a Nash-Richards-Gaborik line.
- Conquest

He had a NTC so no, any team could have went after him, but it was about which team Nash would go to.

He himself said his first choice was the Rangers. It's irrelevant what his reasons were.

Can we drop the "build around" concept?

It just doesn't work that way.

You get as many good guys as you can. You don't get a guy and then think about what other guys would go well with that guy.
- Atomic Wedgie

That's actually wrong because it does work that way.

The Leafs, for 13 seasons, were built around Sundin. That's a fact and you know it. Everything stopped and started with Sundin. Everything revolved around Sundin. He was the constant figure. The Penguins, are built around Crosby and Malkin. The Blackhawks, are built around Toews and Kane etc.

Are you honestly going to argue against the irrefutable fact that the Red Wings were once built around Howe? Yzerman? The Bruins with Orr? The Oilers weren't built around Gretzky? The Penguins weren't built around Lemieux? The Islanders weren't built around Trottier? The Canadiens weren't built around Richard, Believeau, Lafleur and countless others? The Leafs weren't built around Armstrong? Keon? Sittler? Clark? Sundin?

History shows it to be true. On most championship teams, there is at least one guy that the team revolves around. One guy who is a constant cornerstone. Most times, the guy is there for a really long time and holds the captaincy. It's pretty common.

i agree with ya bruce, i do.

i jsut wonder with the lack of lupul and the concentration that phil is getting...maybe everyone once in a while RC could switch it up and toss Grabo out there for a couple shifts with that line to see what happens...

i just feel like grabo may be able to take some of the attention away from phil, and jVR in front that should also open up some room, together...maybe enough to get that damned monkey off his back!
- big_dion

I agree with this. You see almost every other team load up the top players on one line for a shift or two, especially when looking for a boost in momentum.

I find it funny that with 2 different coaches, the lines still look identical, and there is no real attempt to see if something else might work. (injury situations aside)

Anyone see that movie "Hotel Transylvania"?

Its a cartoon kids movie. Im wondering if its suitable for an almost 2 year old? Im about to watch the DVD with him but thought Id ask.

I'm perfectly fine with the Kessel cloud if he's willing to re-up for Lupulish money. If not (and it's unlikely), you gotta do the old Jeff Carter (high potential, nhl playing, 22-24 year old + 1st rd. pick).
- 1979AD

That'd be pretty good, especially if the Leafs could spend a little time getting teams to try and up the bid rather than trade him out of left field like the Flyers did.

That's actually wrong because it does work that way.

The Leafs, for 13 seasons, were built around Sundin. That's a fact and you know it. Everything stopped and started with Sundin. Everything revolved around Sundin. He was the constant figure. The Penguins, are built around Crosby and Malkin. The Blackhawks, are built around Toews and Kane etc.

Are you honestly going to argue against the irrefutable fact that the Red Wings were once built around Howe? Yzerman? The Bruins with Orr? The Oilers weren't built around Gretzky? The Penguins weren't built around Lemieux? The Islanders weren't built around Trottier? The Canadiens weren't built around Richard, Believeau, Lafleur and countless others? The Leafs weren't built around Armstrong? Keon? Sittler? Clark? Sundin?

History shows it to be true. On most championship teams, there is at least one guy that the team revolves around. One guy who is a constant cornerstone. Most times, the guy is there for a really long time and holds the captaincy. It's pretty common.
- Two_For_Truth

quick question ug

how come you dont use your real alias?

just a question, you can answer this one, i wont bite.