So Smith actually set us back even further? Thanks a lot, Neil...
- Jethro09

No opinion one way or the other...just stating that's the only thing he did..

This is alot to ask for. I have yet to see anything that closely resembles this happening? You are also factoring in alot of "ifs". On top of this we could've said the exact same thing for the last three years. One of you guys say we are going to be ready to compete possibly in the next year or two? Are you kidding me? Why would anyone think that?
- Cptmjl

Building teams is always based on 'if's'. Still, think of a first line forward and top pairing dman (Minnesota just did it), imagine them in our lineup and whatever prospects you expect up with the team next year. At that stage, I think this team takes on a big transformation

Maybe so, but I can think of other people that I'd rather hire than Neil Smith.
- Jethro09

Absolutely, if it was choice between the two I'm saying. Some will disgree and I could understand why at this point. In my eyes Smith is proven. Snow has proved nothing. I've seen Snow do zero but draft and it's debatable at best how good he is at that IMO

No opinion one way or the other...just stating that's the only thing he did..
- keaner17

In two weeks?

I think we're kidding ourselves if we pretend to act like we know how Snow deals with free agents. I've yet to see a single agent or player say anything negative about how Snow has approached UFA's. What I do know is that if I were a free agent, I'd choose to go elsewhere because they play in a cess pool and the tax structure is like financial rape. Do I really want to take a $4 million contract that will get taxed over 60% in NY? Or would I rather get taxed nearly half that in another state with a fresh new arena? It's a simple choice from a life perspective.
As for 'Snowbirds". I'm not a blind supporter nor am I a hate-filled screamer of the rooftops. Maybe that's what will bother some since everyone seems so polarized on these topics. If anything, I only feel compelled to respond to the 'way over the top' comments that act as though Snow is Mr. Magoo and Wang doesn't care. Then the next minute, Wang is some shrewd business man looking to squeeze pennies out of families.
- keaner17

Well, sometimes he brings it on himself with things like this...

https://twitter.com/tpano...status/139478843063926784

Building teams is always based on 'if's'. Still, think of a first line forward and top pairing dman (Minnesota just did it), imagine them in our lineup and whatever prospects you expect up with the team next year. At that stage, I think this team takes on a big transformation
- keaner17

Do you honestly envision Snow doing this? Again, not trying to be a douche but really think about that before you answer. I think the first word I bolded say's it all about your post.

At the fear of going political with this convo... First off bringing up taxes in NY is a little ridiculous. Our country as a whole is getting a$$ raped right now. How many players in Buffalo or Manhattan thought twice about going there because of taxes? Does a player have to "say" anything negative about how Snow "approached them"? Them not signing here speaks volumes. I'll give Snow credit for adding more prospects to our farm. I can't even give him credit for drafting because quite frankly I'm not overly impressed with his drafting. I have a hard time understanding why someone would say he's done a great job drafting? How so? We've drafted in the top five for 5 years. Really think about that. These results look good to you?
- Cptmjl

Really? So when you hear guys like Woods and Mickelson (sp?) talk about moving out of California because the taxes are killing them, you don't think something like that also weights on the minds of players looking for a new home? Really? So if you're faced with the option of making $2million after taxes and playing at NVMC or making $3 million and playing in Dallas..you're not leaning hard towards Dallas?

As for Snow and his drafting, this is that whole extremist argument problem. I think Snow has made plenty of mistakes drafting. However I don't think he's been bad nor great. I score him a B- to C+ on his drafting and probably a C overall.

Really? So when you hear guys like Woods and Mickelson (sp?) talk about moving out of California because the taxes are killing them, you don't think something like that also weights on the minds of players looking for a new home? Really? So if you're faced with the option of making $2million after taxes and playing at NVMC or making $3 million and playing in Dallas..you're not leaning hard towards Dallas?

As for Snow and his drafting, this is that whole extremist argument problem. I think Snow has made plenty of mistakes drafting. However I don't think he's been bad nor great. I score him a B- to C+ on his drafting and probably a C overall.
- keaner17

Guys climb over each other to play for the Rangers. They have the same, if not worse, tax implications for playing there as one would have on the Islanders. And this was the case when the Rangers were not contending. Point is, taxes may be a factor, but I doubt that its the income taxes that kept players away from Long Island since Snow became GM.

Really? So when you hear guys like Woods and Mickelson (sp?) talk about moving out of California because the taxes are killing them, you don't think something like that also weights on the minds of players looking for a new home? Really? So if you're faced with the option of making $2million after taxes and playing at NVMC or making $3 million and playing in Dallas..you're not leaning hard towards Dallas?

As for Snow and his drafting, this is that whole extremist argument problem. I think Snow has made plenty of mistakes drafting. However I don't think he's been bad nor great. I score him a B- to C+ on his drafting and probably a C overall.
- keaner17

Look at all those players who won't sign with the Rangers because of NY taxes...or Robyn Regehr not waiving his NTC to go to the Sabres because of NY taxes...or Richards and Carter refusing to report to LA after being traded because of California taxes. Sorry man, that one's a bit of a reach.

Really? So when you hear guys like Woods and Mickelson (sp?) talk about moving out of California because the taxes are killing them, you don't think something like that also weights on the minds of players looking for a new home? Really? So if you're faced with the option of making $2million after taxes and playing at NVMC or making $3 million and playing in Dallas..you're not leaning hard towards Dallas?

As for Snow and his drafting, this is that whole extremist argument problem. I think Snow has made plenty of mistakes drafting. However I don't think he's been bad nor great. I score him a B- to C+ on his drafting and probably a C overall.
- keaner17

I'll agree to disagree with you on the tax issue but if you think you're going to pay a 1 million tax differential between here and Dallas as a millionaire I don't know what to tell you. You may want to read into that a little more. As far as the second paragraph I agree. I'd give him a C and that's just because I haven't seen him do anything else. I don't think that's good for a team that I've been a fan of for forty years. Call me crazy.

Guys climb over each other to play for the Rangers. They have the same, if not worse, tax implications for playing there as one would have on the Islanders. And this was the case when the Rangers were not contending. Point is, taxes may be a factor, but I doubt that its the income taxes that kept players away from Long Island since Snow became GM.
- Jethro09

Do you honestly envision Snow doing this? Again, not trying to be a douche but really think about that before you answer. I think the first word I bolded say's it all about your post.
- Cptmjl

I think we're going to see a far different approach from this organization as the 2015 season approaches and I've been saying that for a couple of years now, even before the Barclay deal was reached.

I can promise you that a 'venue' plays a pretty good role in helping a player to decide where to play and for the first time in more than a generation, the Isles actually have seomething to promise in that regard.

The Isles have a lot of prospects and a lot of payroll and finally a promise of revenue. Ricky would tell you we're going 'Balls to the Wall!'

I think we're going to see a far different approach from this organization as the 2015 season approaches and I've been saying that for a couple of years now, even before the Barclay deal was reached.

I can promise you that a 'venue' plays a pretty good role in helping a player to decide where to play and for the first time in more than a generation, the Isles actually have seomething to promise in that regard.

The Isles have a lot of prospects and a lot of payroll and finally a promise of revenue. Ricky would tell you we're going 'Balls to the Wall!'
- keaner17

I want nothing more than to follow this way of thinking. Wang/Snow have done zero to facilitate these thoughts. Nothing. I honestly have no idea whether Wang or Snow truly want to win? Not even an inkling. When the clock strikes 2015 and we are working the waiver wire where do you go from there?

Look at all those players who won't sign with the Rangers because of NY taxes...or Robyn Regehr not waiving his NTC to go to the Sabres because of NY taxes...or Richards and Carter refusing to report to LA after being traded because of California taxes. Sorry man, that one's a bit of a reach.
- UIF

You guys are missing the point here. It's the culmination of things. No, I don't believe anyone is turning this team down soley based on taxes. However, when you add in the dumpy arena they play in, with the bad rep and then the kick in the arse taxes...YES..it makes a difference. Guys go to LA because, hell,...it's LA. Guys go to the Rangers because like it or not, an original six team that's the NHL's version of the YAnkee's carries a lot more alure than playing for a team playing in a crumbling stadium that's a media joke.

If you're looking for a single smoking gun, you're missing the tree's from the forest. But the Isles have more hurdles than any other team in the league which has given Snow a handicap that no other GM in years has face. THAT"S THE POINT.

I think we're going to see a far different approach from this organization as the 2015 season approaches and I've been saying that for a couple of years now, even before the Barclay deal was reached.

I can promise you that a 'venue' plays a pretty good role in helping a player to decide where to play and for the first time in more than a generation, the Isles actually have seomething to promise in that regard.

The Isles have a lot of prospects and a lot of payroll and finally a promise of revenue. Ricky would tell you we're going 'Balls to the Wall!'
- keaner17

Like I've said before, the best thing about the move to Barclays is that there will be big-money interests there that Wang will probably have to...if not answer to then at least appease. It won't be Wang's private little play thing operating in the shadows anymore. There will be a mandate to win finally, because no wins equals no attendance, which equals no revenue, and after going through all of that to get the Isles there, I'm not sure the Barclays folks would stand for that.

Look at all those players who won't sign with the Rangers because of NY taxes...or Robyn Regehr not waiving his NTC to go to the Sabres because of NY taxes...or Richards and Carter refusing to report to LA after being traded because of California taxes. Sorry man, that one's a bit of a reach. :lol:
- UIF

This is what drives me crazy with the Snow fans. They will create any excuse for his benefit? I'll never understand why, it's almost cultish. With that said I'm not saying you're a huge fan of Snow Keaner. You're like Sweden

I want nothing more than to follow this way of thinking. Wang/Snow have done zero to facilitate these thoughts. Nothing. I honestly have no idea whether Wang or Snow truly want to win? Not even an inkling. When the clock strikes 2015 and we are working the waiver wire where do you go from there?
- Cptmjl

Why on earth wouldn't they want to win? It seems that everyone gets stuck in this frame of mind that every team owner has a guy like the owner in the Natural. Some evil guy with the blinds drawn with a diabolical plan for failure.
Of course they want to win. Winning makes MONEY! It sells jersey's, concessions, parking, tickets, playoff tickets etc....

You guys are missing the point here. It's the culmination of things. No, I don't believe anyone is turning this team down soley based on taxes. However, when you add in the dumpy arena they play in, with the bad rep and then the kick in the arse taxes...YES..it makes a difference. Guys go to LA because, hell,...it's LA. Guys go to the Rangers because like it or not, an original six team that's the NHL's version of the YAnkee's carries a lot more alure than playing for a team playing in a crumbling stadium that's a media joke.

If you're looking for a single smoking gun, you're missing the tree's from the forest. But the Isles have more hurdles than any other team in the league which has given Snow a handicap that no other GM in years has face. THAT"S THE POINT.
- keaner17

? I don't understand the LA comment? The thing I think you may not be understanding is that Snow himself is a handicap to the Islanders whether you accept that FACT or not. It's right there before your eyes.

This is what drives me crazy with the Snow fans. They will create any excuse for his benefit? I'll never understand why, it's almost cultish. With that said I'm not saying you're a huge fan of Snow Keaner. You're like Sweden
- Cptmjl

Why on earth wouldn't they want to win? It seems that everyone gets stuck in this frame of mind that every team owner has a guy like the owner in the Natural. Some evil guy with the blinds drawn with a diabolical plan for failure.
Of course they want to win. Winning makes MONEY! It sells jersey's, concessions, parking, tickets, playoff tickets etc....
- keaner17

I can't answer this? All I can do is look at the body of Snow's work and Wang as an owner and I'm compelled to ask that question. The Islanders as a whole from the players(most) to management to the owner in no way look like an orginization that wants to win. You disagree?

? I don't understand the LA comment? The thing I think you may not be understanding is that Snow himself is a handicap to the Islanders whether you accept that FACT or not. It's right there before your eyes.
- Cptmjl

But it's not FACT. That's an opinion and one that we really have no way of proving or disproving. I'd be inclined to agree that him some cases he may be, but is it due to perception or reality? We don't know. The only time I think we'll be able to really draw a conclusion is when this team is on an even playing field with other teams.
As for the LA comment, I live in the Philly area. Not a single Flyers fan would have been surprised that Richards and Carter reported to LA. That was their DREAM destination.

Why on earth wouldn't they want to win? It seems that everyone gets stuck in this frame of mind that every team owner has a guy like the owner in the Natural. Some evil guy with the blinds drawn with a diabolical plan for failure.
Of course they want to win. Winning makes MONEY! It sells jersey's, concessions, parking, tickets, playoff tickets etc....
- keaner17

Wang needs to hang this in Snow's cubicle.

I can't answer this? All I can do is look at the body of Snow's work and Wang as an owner and I'm compelled to ask that question. The Islanders as a whole from the players(most) to management to the owner in no way look like an orginization that wants to win. You disagree?
- Cptmjl

Yes, I disagree. I don't think we look like an organization that knows how to win and that causes long frustrated fans such as ourselves to assume the worst. If nothing else, those suspicions make for good messageboard fodder

But it's not FACT. That's an opinion and one that we really have no way of proving or disproving. I'd be inclined to agree that him some cases he may be, but is it due to perception or reality? We don't know. The only time I think we'll be able to really draw a conclusion is when this team is on an even playing field with other teams.
As for the LA comment, I live in the Philly area. Not a single Flyers fan would have been surprised that Richards and Carter reported to LA. That was their DREAM destination.
- keaner17

Come on man. You think all of these FA's look at the Coliseum and NY's taxes and pin that as a reason not to play here on their wall? Of course some of it is relevant but Isles fans put way too much credance in this thought process because Snow went public saying so. Snow's job is to sell this team to perspective players. He has failed miserably at doing so. That's a FACT damn it

Come on man. You think all of these FA's look at the Coliseum and NY's taxes and pin that as a reason not to play here on their wall? Of course some of it is relevant but Isles fans put way too much credance in this thought process because Snow went public saying so. Snow's job is to sell this team to perspective players. He has failed miserably at doing so. That's a FACT damn it
- Cptmjl

I think people need to remember that coming to a new team is a life decision for these guys. As I've said (repeatedly), I think there are several issues that ultimately go into those players rejecting the Isles and yes, I think Taxes and NVMC are two big ones. I also think the Isles reputation was terrible before Snow ever came to the team. We weren't exactly signing guys left and right during the Gluckstein days either. Some of the financial stories from Milbury are hilarious. Players are aware of a team that couldn't afford equipment in the 1990's and has had sewage destroy their exercise equipment.

So do I think these problems come down to the fact that Snow can't talk them into bed? Do I think Smith could have done it any better? I doubt it.