Not just the trades Bowman vetoed - it's the trades he didn't creatively go after.

If he's just waiting by the phone for some other GM to give him the perfect trade, he's not doing his job. He needs to be the one calling and creatively getting stuff done.

It takes two to tango, but Stan doesn't always have to let the other guy lead.
- StLBravesFan

Early front runner for quote of the day.

+1

Not just the trades Bowman vetoed - it's the trades he didn't creatively go after.

If he's just waiting by the phone for some other GM to give him the perfect trade, he's not doing his job. He needs to be the one calling and creatively getting stuff done.

It takes two to tango, but Stan doesn't always have to let the other guy lead.
- StLBravesFan

The reality is we really don't know whether Stan is passive or aggressive although my bet would be the former because he is totally married to his depth of prospects and probably overvaluing the talent in the system.

A bigger factor could be relationships with other GM's around the league. After Tallon, Bob Murray. Chevaldayoff and the Montreal tandem now, who the hell does he know and have full trust in dealing with? I don't know the answer to that, but having Mr. Personality Pierre Gauthier in the office sure ain't going to help him much around the league. And Daddy is getting a little long in the tooth to make all his phone calls.

Dunno

Personally, I would do Hammer for Boyle and Bickel. DONE.
- John Jaeckel

Bickel was also an FA target of the Hawks.

steal for what we need, but not true fair trade value

i dont think a top 4 Dman for a bottom 6 center is fair, with the top 4 dman obviously coming at higher premiums
- FourFeathers773

The Hawks do not need another bottom six fwd/C, unless Bolland becomes the 2C the Hawks really need.

I would much prefer keeping Bolland at 3C and finding the 2C they really need.

To be clear, I want them both fired.

In last couple years, Trotz has done more, with less, than Q could ever dream of. Trotz would kill for the kind of roster Stan has "saddled" Q with.
- Ogilthorpe2

In the last couple of years Trotz has not won a Cup nor has Nashville played what I would call an entertaining brand of hockey.

Tracey Myers ‏@TramyersCSN
Not seeing Kruger today. Lines: 13-19-81, 10-36-88, 29-65-25, 52-22-67.

... start the Kruger to team x rumours... now!

I don't know this for fact (at present—I am digging on it). But based on what I have heard, I would bet NYR approached the Hawks first. And if so, you can't assume they are unwilling to give you what you need for Hjalmarsson. The whole league pretty much knows what the Hawks' needs are. They have a lot of centers still: Halpern, Stepan, Krieder and Rupp can play C.
- John Jaeckel

dont disagree JJ, but NYR will NOT part with Boyle, for sure. They love him, he is their top faceoff man, and more importantly, TORTS loves him

i think boyle or stepan is the only guy you really want in dealing hammer (kreider too, but we know that isnt happening)

if someone like rupp is the return for hammer, thats when stan hangs up the phone

Exactly...peeps are worried about having to play Rosy or Brookbank in meaningful roles but its either that or going with what the Hawks have at center and goalie. You gotta give to get. Its especially funny when people snicker at the Hawks FO saying their kids can produce in the NHL now but they expect a team like Anaheim or Ottawa to give up the booty for those same kids.
- PhatJoeSki

I'm not worried about have Roszival or Brookbank in meaningful roles. But I am worried about worried about having them in meaningful roles then having one of the defensemen get injured in addition to Montador being out. Are you then comfortable with Olsen or Stanton playing regular minutes? In a compacted schedule it is likely a defenseman will get injured.

If we traded Hjalmarsson or Leddy for a 2C or starting goalie it would likely be part of a bigger package and I'd hope we would get a depth defenseman in return. I don't have all the answers on how to upgrade our team at centre and goalie, but I worry about solving one problem by creating another.

Trotz is one of the top coaches in the game. No question.

Like you, I think they both need to leave anything short of this team winning at least 4, maybe 8 postseason games.

Quenneville needs to adjust to his roster, but Bowman also has to be flexible in making trades for PROVEN talent instead of holding prospects close to his vest hoping they all pan out.

I look to the independent sources for prospect updates and evaluations. Hawks always over hype their farm boys. The fact that Bowman is trying to hang his hat on how great his prospects are, and buy time is sickening.
- SteveRain

Every team over-hypes their prospects. Talk to a Detroit fan or especially Edmonton where the second coming is apparently imminent.

The reality is we really don't know whether Stan is passive or aggressive although my bet would be the former because he is totally married to his depth of prospects and probably overvaluing the talent in the system.

A bigger factor could be relationships with other GM's around the league. After Tallon, Bob Murray. Chevaldayoff and the Montreal tandem now, who the hell does he know and have full trust in dealing with? I don't know the answer to that, but having Mr. Personality Pierre Gauthier in the office sure ain't going to help him much around the league. And Daddy is getting a little long in the tooth to make all his phone calls.
- RickJ

Let me chime in here. The following is what I hear . . . may or may not be correct, but i have heard it form "multiple sources."

Stan is, by all accounts, a really nice guy.

Tallon has no bad blood toward him. Stan had nothing to do with Tallon's demise.

He is seen by some other teams, as I understand it, as wanting every deal to be lop-sided in his favor. He doesn't like to give in order to get. Thus, he doesn't get a lot of deals done.

If teams have an aversion to dealing with him, again this is anecdotal stuff I have heard, it's that he will get close on deals and then inexplicably back out at the last minute. Which I would think other GMs might find to be a waste of their time and bandwidth.

Tracey Myers ‏@TramyersCSN
Not seeing Kruger today. Lines: 13-19-81, 10-36-88, 29-65-25, 52-22-67.

... start the Kruger to team x rumours... now!
- TyCamScore

If that lineup does not scream "we are doing nothing we like our club" I don't know what else is.

Kruger was a Scotty find - I bet Stan would not deal him.

Again, it is as if you are looking over a sheet of paper with 10 trades on it that Bowman Vetoed. They would be Pirri for Getzlaff, Frolik for Nash, Bickell for Bernier or whoever....it takes two to tango...lets bring a little balance into the conversation.
- TrueGrit

Not true.

have I sent out any crazy trade ideas? No.

What I am saying is you have a GM who is hell bent on rolling out the exact same team (save me from the Sheldon Brookbanks of the world) the past 3 years. 2 years, your season has ended by round 1...So why is this year going to be any different?

That's the difference. Instead of making back handed digs, try defending this insane logic to me...

Not just the trades Bowman vetoed - it's the trades he didn't creatively go after.

If he's just waiting by the phone for some other GM to give him the perfect trade, he's not doing his job. He needs to be the one calling and creatively getting stuff done.

It takes two to tango, but Stan doesn't always have to let the other guy lead.
- StLBravesFan

Not convinced it isn't J-Mac making the veto in some cases.

Every team over-hypes their prospects. Talk to a Detroit fan or especially Edmonton where the second coming is apparently imminent.
- fattybeef

I completely agree. And it makes sense from a trading perspective.

That said, Bowman has been sitting on cap room for nearly two years now—and there is an expiration date on prospect juju.

Are McNeill or even Saad seen in the same light they were a year ago? Answer: no.

Not convinced it isn't J-Mac making the veto in some cases.
- fattybeef

Bingo. In fact, I believe it is.

The Hawks do not need another bottom six fwd/C, unless Bolland becomes the 2C the Hawks really need.

I would much prefer keeping Bolland at 3C and finding the 2C they really need.
- Return of the Roar

It's time or Bolland to get an extended, legit shot to be the 2C...he's earned the opportunity. They need to know if he can handle the job, so they know if his Blackhawk future extends beyond his current contract or not. This is a question that MUST be answered.

he will get close on deals and then inexplicably back out at the last minute.
- John Jaeckel

Which would fit the majority of your threads, i.e. this one about how close they were to a deal, now nothing.

As to the Cubs: they also spent a lot on payroll - don't have each year's figures, but IIRC, they were $115MM to $125MM each year for several years until 2012 - they just spent badly under the Tribune ownership.
- StLBravesFan

Yes, but that was an attempt from prior ownership to win a World Series with the thought he could sell it for more. The point of that Cubs dis was that it seems Hawks like Cubs Ownership could care less about the team performance, just as long as the seats are filled. If the Hawks go 1 and done in the playoffs and the seats are still full ... Why would ownership make any changes in the FO?

If that lineup does not scream "we are doing nothing we like our club" I don't know what else is.

Kruger was a Scotty find - I bet Stan would not deal him.
- Return of the Roar

Leddy was a Stan find. They were ready to deal him (for a return they did not get) yesterday AM.

It's possible they might deal Kruger, what if he went to NYR along with Hammer for Boyle++?

Every team over-hypes their prospects. Talk to a Detroit fan or especially Edmonton where the second coming is apparently imminent.
- fattybeef

If Edmonton gets any goaltending and can find a d man...watch out. That's a loaded team, and if I'm not mistaken they rolled the Hawks a bunch of times last year.

Prospects always get overhyped, but the best GMs deal those who appear to be a gem, but really turn out to be crap.

I completely agree. And it makes sense from a trading perspective.

That said, Bowman has been sitting on cap room for nearly two years now—and there is an expiration date on prospect juju.

Are McNeill or even Saad seen in the same light they were a year ago? Answer: no.
- John Jaeckel

yup, how bad has mcneils stock fallen?

kid was drafted and being labeled "NHL ready" and physically mature.

two years later it doesnt even look close to him cracking NHL and he barely got on to Canadas junior team via backdoor

It's time or Bolland to get an extended, legit shot to be the 2C...he's earned the opportunity. They need to know if he can handle the job, so they know if his Blackhawk future extends beyond his current contract or not. This is a question that MUST be answered.
- Ogilthorpe2

Excellent point.

So the question is how long do you wait to see if he can do it? My guess is they give him until the trade deadline, miss out on the best players at the best pricing, and if Bolland fails, his value is diminished as well. If he succeeds, then great.

But it is the lowest risk play, and why that is the path Stan will take.

It's time or Bolland to get an extended, legit shot to be the 2C...he's earned the opportunity. They need to know if he can handle the job, so they know if his Blackhawk future extends beyond his current contract or not. This is a question that MUST be answered.
- Ogilthorpe2

100% agree. I'll lay off your boy as I'm curious to see if he can finally become a top 6 player. No excuses if he's given the long look, and paired with legit talent.

If he bombs, he's still THE top 3rd line center in hockey with a huge market.

This is the 2nd biggest story line this eason for this team, behind Crawford rebounding.

It's time or Bolland to get an extended, legit shot to be the 2C...he's earned the opportunity. They need to know if he can handle the job, so they know if his Blackhawk future extends beyond his current contract or not. This is a question that MUST be answered.
- Ogilthorpe2

The Hawks believe in sticks, ie, playing righty guys with righty guys and vice versa for lefties. So it makes sense to play Sharpp on Bolland's LW. No, kane is not a righty but he has close tot he best hands in the game and adjusting to Bolland should be no problem. This is aline that could give opposing coaches some real matchup problems. if you're detroit, you have to send Kronwall and Ericsson out against Hossa and Toews. So who do you send out against these guys. Colaiocovo and White? Ha. Good luck wid dat.

Point is, Bolland is being given every opportunity to succeed.

Leddy was a Stan find. They were ready to deal him (for a return they did not get) yesterday AM.

It's possible they might deal Kruger, what if he went to NYR along with Hammer for Boyle++?
- John Jaeckel

Maybe the Leddy thing is different because of the agent mess....

To me it boils down to whether the bigger need is goalie or center. If you had to make that choice, who do you reserve hammer for in a trade?