But if the top league is offering lesser players, what then? Will people still pay to go watch?

Most hockey fans in PHO, DAL, STL, etc, probably have the slightest clue between a NHLer vs an AHLer. Sure they might know a few superstars, but they wouldn't really know how they affected the game. They would still go watch their team wearing their prefered jersey for an overpriced ticker. Then buy an overprice beer and hotdog. Go back to work the next day and talk about their awesome time they had watching an NHL game which happens to be the most popular league...
- l3ig_l2ecl

people from Arizona would be able to make out the difference between the Montreal Canadiens and an ECHL team.

But if the top league is offering lesser players, what then? Will people still pay to go watch?

Most hockey fans in PHO, DAL, STL, etc, probably have the slightest clue between a NHLer vs an AHLer. Sure they might know a few superstars, but they wouldn't really know how they affected the game. They would still go watch their team wearing their prefered jersey for an overpriced ticker. Then buy an overprice beer and hotdog. Go back to work the next day and talk about their awesome time they had watching an NHL game which happens to be the most popular league...
- l3ig_l2ecl

AHLers won't be able to be scabs, and fans in the southern markets will be able to tell the difference between an NHLer and a senior mens leaguer.

That's like saying fans in the Sunbelt don't know the difference between games against the Penguins and the Blue Jackets.

If they were going to games just for the hell of it and not caring about the product on the ice, then they wouldn't have attendance issues.

Go back and read... I said where he chose to relocate those teams.



Child, you are off you're rocker.
- boonerbuck

did he choose phoenix?

and if he chose colorado, i think he did well on that.

im on my xbox cause comp crapped out so sorry for terrible grammar/slow responses. So team expenses count against the total profit? Like the electric bills? lol terrible example im sure but you get what im aiming at.
- Orphen22

some teams wants to stay around the break even point, don't pay much in taxes. Buffalo kept their ticket price low to take advantage of the revenue sharing program and limit how much taxes they pay at the end of the year.

How in the world do the owners not need the players? These are the best hockey players in the world playing in the best hockey league in the world. You don't pay NHL prices to see AHL or QMJHL games do you? The NHL is a partnership, or should be. We pay the prices we pay to see the best hockey in the world, plain and simple. If you want to pay NHL prices for less than NHL quality, then go on and do it. I for one will not
- uf1910

Here is a horrible analogy I'll offer up.

It's kind of like when McDonalds started making their hamburgers smaller, you didn't really notice unless you took the bun off to see it was in fact smaller.

Similar product, but smaller and at a higher cost. Remember the McDLT? Hot side hot/ Cold side cold? I loved it and then they got rid of it and replaced it with some cruder version of it. It wasn't the same but I still ate it for awhile.

Even though I tried to stop eating at McDonalds many times, in the end my intentions were defeated by that evil corporation...

did he choose phoenix?

and if he chose colorado, i think he did well on that.
- Fountain-San

Wasn't Bettman the one who put the provision on the new Winnipeg Jets that they have to sell at least 13,000 tickets a year for the next 3 years in order for the franchise to e approved?

did he choose phoenix?

and if he chose colorado, i think he did well on that.
- Fountain-San

It's still pretty damn tilted. Most of his expansions and relocations have failed to hold their own.

wow Im so lost...so sales of team related gear doesnt add money? We still sell out majority of games though...I really dont understand this crap lmao
- Orphen22

All about ticker sales.

Toronto averages $123 per seat per game, 41 games, 19,500 average per game. So it's over 98mil+ or ticket revenue.
Buffalo is at 38.25 per seat and averages 18,550 per game. Were only at 29mil. Thats 60mil in revenue less than Toronto.

because fans think it's gospel, the closest thing to what the financials actually are. please tell me how you fact check the ledgers of NHL teams?

does it go something like this?

hi, i'm buzz journalist from forbes. can you please let me see your financial records? cuz ya, we're writing an article. and we're forbes.

whatever.
- hnic

I wasn't ripping on you, just trying to comprehend the logic of the argument. I hear a lot of people saying forbes is bullpoop, so I tend to wonder how such a high profile publication could get away with making up facts. That's all.

It's still pretty damn tilted. Most of his expansions and relocations have failed to hold their own.
- boonerbuck

expansions, maybe.

re-locations, not really his call. just where were the new owners with new buildings.

and he did keep 3 maybe 4 canadian teams from moving. never gets mentioned. at least not by Wedge.

Wasn't Bettman the one who put the provision on the new Winnipeg Jets that they have to sell at least 13,000 tickets a year for the next 3 years in order for the franchise to e approved?
- glove_was_stuck

and he would put that same provision on any city to secure a team.

All about ticker sales.

Toronto averages $123 per seat per game, 41 games, 19,500 average per game. So it's over 98mil+ or ticket revenue.
Buffalo is at 38.25 per seat and averages 18,550 per game. Were only at 29mil. Thats 60mil in revenue less than Toronto.
- l3ig_l2ecl

okay so I do not need to be upset that we are 22nd its just tick prices vs high an low scaled averages. I guess I am looking at it from a almost competive way...my want to be higher so seeing us low worries me. idk I just want hockey back this whole thing is irratating

okay so I do not need to be upset that we are 22nd its just tick prices vs high an low scaled averages. I guess I am looking at it from a almost competive way...my want to be higher so seeing us low worries me. idk I just want hockey back this whole thing is irratating
- Orphen22

xbox?

Here is a horrible analogy I'll offer up.

It's kind of like when McDonalds started making their hamburgers smaller, you didn't really notice unless you took the bun off to see it was in fact smaller.

Similar product, but smaller and at a higher cost. Remember the McDLT? Hot side hot/ Cold side cold? I loved it and then they got rid of it and replaced it with some cruder version of it. It wasn't the same but I still ate it for awhile.

Even though I tried to stop eating at McDonalds many times, in the end my intentions were defeated by that evil corporation...
- MnGump

I'm not sure we are on the same page here but I'll try.

If you go to McD's today and a burger cost $1, then go tomorrow and the burger still costs $1 but is half the size and the "quality" of the meat is inferior, would you continue going to McD's to pay the $1 for a clearly inferior burger? For me, nah, I'd go find a burger somewhere else that is better price/quality.

And I know I probably just killed my argument by using quality and McD's in the same sentence but sometimes poop happens I guess

wow Im so lost...so sales of team related gear doesnt add money? We still sell out majority of games though...I really dont understand this crap lmao
- Orphen22

It adds money to the league, not the team (at least for jerseys - for the other crap, I've found it hard to get a definitive answer).

xbox?
- Fountain-San

yeah the stupid internet explorer app. Its like pulling teeth to type things out...

What looks like a duck, walks like a duck, whether it's in a pond in Canada or Mexico. It's still a (frank)ing duck.....
- l3ig_l2ecl

http://aduckaday.blogspot...010/09/islander-duck.html[img][/img]

okay so I do not need to be upset that we are 22nd its just tick prices vs high an low scaled averages. I guess I am looking at it from a almost competive way...my want to be higher so seeing us low worries me. idk I just want hockey back this whole thing is irratating
- Orphen22

You shouldn't be worried, but the owner of your team is an idiot.

If you claim that hockey is so popular in Buffalo, then ask yourself how much you would pay for hockey tickets? Here in Montreal, supply and demand dictates that you can buy a nose bleed ticket for over $100. I for one have bought many of them.

Go back and read... I said where he chose to relocate those teams.



Child, you are off you're rocker.
- boonerbuck

Gary Bettman didn't choose where to relocate a single team over his entire NHL career.

Thanks for playing.

Enjoy these lovely parting gifts.

It adds money to the league, not the team (at least for jerseys - for the other crap, I've found it hard to get a definitive answer).
- Atomic Wedgie

you an me both.

yeah the stupid internet explorer app. Its like pulling teeth to type things out...
- Orphen22

detatch the keyboard from your computer and plug it into the xbox.

expansions, maybe.

re-locations, not really his call. just where were the new owners with new buildings.

and he did keep 3 maybe 4 canadian teams from moving. never gets mentioned. at least not by Wedge.
- Fountain-San

The NHL approves or blocks those relocations.

The NHL blocks relocating teams from going to cities that they plan to expand in as well. The NHL believes in those markets but dont relocate there. Expanding in those markets makes no sense when you have so many failing teams to begin with. In the end it neither here nor there because those markets flopped for the most part anyways. I just don't understand the logic behind GB and keeping him as Commish. I certainly wouldnt be a big spporter like Wedge.

I'm not sure we are on the same page here but I'll try.

If you go to McD's today and a burger cost $1, then go tomorrow and the burger still costs $1 but is half the size and the "quality" of the meat is inferior, would you continue going to McD's to pay the $1 for a clearly inferior burger? For me, nah, I'd go find a burger somewhere else that is better price/quality.

And I know I probably just killed my argument by using quality and McD's in the same sentence but sometimes poop happens I guess
- uf1910

Here's a better question.

If McD's reduced their quality and size, but charged the same price, yet it's still bigger and better than other fast food around in this continent, and also they still have the same fries, would you go to another continent to get a better and bigger burger?

but the building was a problem too wasn't it?
- Fountain-San

That was Norm Greens argument, he wanted a new stadium with more suites so as to provide a more profitable hockey environment. He had already spent a couple of million on renovations at the Met but was not satisfied and based his relocation on the arena argument. Tax payers paying for new arenas/stadiums back in the early 90's was unfathomable. The Twins got their new stadium a few years ago most on the tax payers dime, and now the Vikings just got their stadium deal approved again with Minnesota tax payers footing most of the bill.

The worst part is, Xcel energy center (home of the Wild) bill was footed almost completely by the tax payers of St. Paul and the state of Minnesota through certain sales tax increases. All after refusing to pay for one for the Northstars.

The state was originally trying to get the Whalers or Jets to come here before an expansion was sought out.

Wasn't Bettman the one who put the provision on the new Winnipeg Jets that they have to sell at least 13,000 tickets a year for the next 3 years in order for the franchise to e approved?
- glove_was_stuck

There have been some who have speculated that the whole "must sell 13,000" drive was pure b.s. - a marketing ploy designed by the Jets to push ticket sales.