I think the answer here is, Owners do not need players that make multi-millions to run their business. They could run it with a cap of 1mil per player and still would find a way to turn a profit.

Would I pay $150 to see the the Canadiens play? Yes
Would I pay $150 to see the Bulldogs play? No
Would I pay $150 to see the Canadiens play with an AHL roster assuming the whole entire league was doing the same making it a competitive league fighting for the Stanley Cup? YES!!!
- l3ig_l2ecl

exactly... all the players are doing right now is shortening their own earning window.

the owners wont budge... nor do they have to.. sure a lockout means some red in the ledger.. but for the most part.. these owners' personal ledgers run well into the black

for alot of these guys these NHL teams are just play things used to fuel their own competitive desires

Forbes published its estimate of NHL business for 2011-12. Included in that was an estimate of each team's revenue and profit for the season.

Brian Stubits, a blogger for CBSSports.com, then put out this article, which originally contained this line:



which has since been partially corrected as it says "the large majority of the operating income ..." but is still proceeded by "the top three blow all the other teams in the NHL away when in terms of revenue each season."

For the "83 percent of revenue" comment to be correct, it would have to be the case that the top 3 teams (Toronto, NY Rangers, Montreal) generated $2.810 billion in revenue last year (based on the Forbes estimate of $3.374 billion in revenue, and not the NHL's stated $3.303 billion in HRR). The Forbes data clearly shows that didn't happen; it does show, however, that leaguewide profit was $250 million and the top 3 teams had a combined profit of $207.5 million - or 83% of the leaguewide total.

Hence, my comment that way too many people do not understand the difference between revenue and profit - and even Stubits in his correction half-asses it as he makes a point referencing revenues and then tries to support it by referencing profits.

Hope that helps clarify things.
- Irish Blues

So talking profits, Canadian teams account for 75% of league profit... Not too shabby....

That's not the point. Even if it isn't their primary business. They're still not in the Hockey business to lose money, like it's just a hobby. That's the point. This idea that the Owner's are just willing to flush money down the toilet because it's not their primary business is hogwash. They made a financial investment. They're in it to make money and build the worth of the franchise. The real 0 you want to think about is how many Owner's are currently doing that. And that's 0!
- MJL

you just said it

"they are not in the hockey business to lose money"

and here we are.. in a lockout

and i never said the owners dont want hockey to be played.. they do.. but on their terms

my point is that its worth more to the owners to lock out their clubs than to continue playing in the red.

And people wonder why I think some of the owners are crappy businessmen.

Take Minnesota, for example. Lost $3.9M last year but thought it was a good idea to drop $196M in contracts on two guys.
- Scoob

plus or minus 5 million is pretty much breaking even, and the acquisition of those two guys is what is supose to boost their revenue, a playoff birth for one example.

Would I pay $150 to see the Canadiens play with an AHL roster assuming the whole entire league was doing the same making it a competitive league fighting for the Stanley Cup? YES!!!
- l3ig_l2ecl

Um, you do know that there already is a league of AHL caliber players playing in a competitive league fighting for a trophy, right? And you also know that you can enjoy it for far less than $150, right?

Not technically, who is the onwner of the Yotes anyways?
- CaptainK

The NHL is right now

Bettman doesnt own the NHL, he is just an employee

We should have a Canadian Hockey League like the CFL and let the US fight for themselves if they want hockey that bad.

Bring back Quebec and add teams in Halifax and perhaps Saskatoon or Regina and have a nice 10 team Canadian league that'll make money and be great for Canadian hockey fans.

Who knows, in a 10 team league, the Leafs MAY even make the playoffs.

The NHL is right now

Bettman doesnt own the NHL, he is just an employee
- Dozzer

i know, just playing Dozzie

i know, just playing Dozzie
- CaptainK

lol fair enough

wouldnt of it been awesome if i got the answer wrong tho? lol that would of been sweet

And people wonder why I think some of the owners are crappy businessmen.

Take Minnesota, for example. Lost $3.9M last year but thought it was a good idea to drop $196M in contracts on two guys.
- Scoob

I remember reading somewhere the next day ticket sales went up by 22% , I agree its sketchy business but I guess ownership feels that two elite level talent players (Sutter is debatable ) can put people in those seats.

We should have a Canadian Hockey League like the CFL and let the US fight for themselves if they want hockey that bad.

Bring back Quebec and add teams in Halifax and perhaps Saskatoon or Regina and have a nice 10 team Canadian league that'll make money and be great for Canadian hockey fans.

Who knows, in a 10 team league, the Leafs MAY even make the playoffs.
- tmlfan69

Vancouver would win the cup....then proceed to destroy their beautiful city

We should have a Canadian Hockey League like the CFL and let the US fight for themselves if they want hockey that bad.

Bring back Quebec and add teams in Halifax and perhaps Saskatoon or Regina and have a nice 10 team Canadian league that'll make money and be great for Canadian hockey fans.

Who knows, in a 10 team league, the Leafs MAY even make the playoffs.
- tmlfan69

Um, you do know that there already is a league of AHL caliber players playing in a competitive league fighting for a trophy, right? And you also know that you can enjoy it for far less than $150, right?
- Scoob

Yes, but there is this thing called Pride.
I'm not sure how old I was when it hit me. I think I might have been around 11 or so. It was the time where I started watching every Canadiens game on TV. How I started buying everything that had a CH on it.
Since then, I've seen guys like Patrick Roy, Damphouse, Koivu, and many others come and go. Yet, all I still care about is that CH.

It doesn't matter who wears it. The CH is a religion to me. You could have Crosby being it's captain, or Sean Avery. I wouldn't have to agree or like the managers decision for it, but I would respect it, cheer for it, and adore it.

Players do not make the NHL. The logo on the front combining each season (well some seem to be missing.....)for the chance to win the Stanley Cup. Bragging rights for years to come and show that pride that we all have.

This is why I hate the lockout, but if I had to choose one or the other, it's the owners, because they represent my CH that I've loved since I was a kid.

Any chance someone with a lot of time on their hands can dig up these stats since the last lockout and present them in a format that shows which teams are screwing these negotiations up for the fans?

#3GameBoycott to start the season

plus or minus 5 million is pretty much breaking even, and the acquisition of those two guys is what is supose to boost their revenue, a playoff birth for one example.
- CaptainK

I'd love to see their analysis on how they hope it will work out. They basically sell out every regular season game already.

Yes, but there is this thing called Pride.
I'm not sure how old I was when it hit me. I think I might have been around 11 or so. It was the time where I started watching every Canadiens game on TV. How I started buying everything that had a CH on it.
Since then, I've seen guys like Patrick Roy, Damphouse, Koivu, and many others come and go. Yet, all I still care about is that CH.

It doesn't matter who wears it. The CH is a religion to me. You could have Crosby being it's captain, or Sean Avery. I wouldn't have to agree or like the managers decision for it, but I would respect it, cheer for it, and adore it.

Players do not make the NHL. The logo on the front combining each season (well some seem to be missing.....)for the chance to win the Stanley Cup. Bragging rights for years to come and show that pride that we all have.

This is why I hate the lockout, but if I had to choose one or the other, it's the owners, because they represent my CH that I've loved since I was a kid.
- l3ig_l2ecl

I hear ya, but you can't polish a turd. Putting the CH on an AHL player and calling them an NHLer is a disgrace to the crest, imho.

laughing at your own jokes is cool
- hnic

Canucks fan spotted!

And people wonder why I think some of the owners are crappy businessmen.

Take Minnesota, for example. Lost $3.9M last year but thought it was a good idea to drop $196M in contracts on two guys.
- Scoob

On the surface it certainly looks unreasonable, however looking at the long term effect, both players will undoubtedly increase ticket and merchandise sales enough to justify the hefty cost of their employment (provided they deliver).

The interesting part of Parise is, being a beloved hometown native, I firmly believe he has incredible marketability potential here in Minnie that most likely could not be acheived on any other team. I think the positive effect he'll have on the market here in Minnie was by itself worth collectively buying out the rest of his career.

Like I said, on the surface it looks ridiculous, but if you also consider the bevy of up and coming talent along with Parise and Suter and provided they both deliver what the Wild hope they payed for, I think they will eventually pay for themselves while making the Wild a much more profitable organization.

Time will tell I guess...

Am I seeing this right? Nine of the thirteen teams in bold were expansion or relocation under Betteman?

- boonerbuck

How exactly is Gary Bettman to blame for teams relocating?

Betteman fights every inch of the way to keep his poor location choices where they are. There are so many contradictions with the NHL. He couldnt sell the NHL in these places when the economy was booming...what did he think would happen during recessions?
- boonerbuck

I've got a bit of a newsflash for you, Skippy:

To date, Gary Bettman has fought every inch of the way to keep exactly five teams where they are:

Pheonix
Ottawa
Calgary
Edmonton
Vancouver.

Yeah, Bonerbuck.

Vancouver.

On the surface it certainly looks unreasonable, however looking at the long term effect, both players will undoubtedly increase ticket and merchandise sales enough to justify the hefty cost of their employment (provided they deliver).

The interesting part of Parise is, being a beloved hometown native, I firmly believe he has incredible marketability potential here in Minnie that most likely could not be acheived on any other team. I think the positive effect he'll have on the market here in Minnie was by itself worth collectively buying out the rest of his career.

Like I said, on the surface it looks ridiculous, but if you also consider the bevy of up and coming talent along with Parise and Suter and provided they both deliver what the Wild hope they payed for, I think they will eventually pay for themselves while making the Wild a much more profitable organization.

Time will tell I guess...
- MnGump

Color me skeptical that it will prove to be a profitable situation

I hear ya, but you can't polish a turd. Putting the CH on an AHL player and calling them an NHLer is a disgrace to the crest, imho.
- Scoob

I don't know. I'm only 28 yo. I don't remember how it was like back in the 80s, but when I watch videos of games Gretzky was playing, everyone seems like a turd compared to him.
I look at videos from the 60s, and it's hard to imagine it was entertaining.
In the end however, when it's what you have, people get use to it and fall in love with it.

I am up for AHL to replace the greedy NHLers. It would last about 15 days of hockey before the first NHLers cross the picket line. Within 2 months, the whole NHL would be back. The ones who arnt happy could stay in Russia for all I care.

How exactly is Gary Bettman to blame for teams relocating?


I've got a bit of a newsflash for you, Skippy:

To date, Gary Bettman has fought every inch of the way to keep exactly five teams where they are:

Pheonix
Ottawa
Calgary
Edmonton
Vancouver.

Yeah, Bonerbuck.

Vancouver.
- Atomic Wedgie

Obama should provide every team in bold with a bailout...

You sir are an idiot, the blues have new ownership and will be in the black if they were playing. But your idiotic solution is Fold everyone losing money.

You cannot make that kind of statement without taking intangibles into account.
- sycsam

like sarcasm?

We should have a Canadian Hockey League like the CFL and let the US fight for themselves if they want hockey that bad.

Bring back Quebec and add teams in Halifax and perhaps Saskatoon or Regina and have a nice 10 team Canadian league that'll make money and be great for Canadian hockey fans.

Who knows, in a 10 team league, the Leafs MAY even make the playoffs.
- tmlfan69

nice. 35 grand a year to play pro hockey. should work.