without calling that Wild fan a name, i do agree that those two contracts, even for two star players, are an example of the problem.

just for the sheer amount and term, for two guys. NHL can't sustain itself with cash like that being doled out.
- Fountain-San

I think you have to look at the team structure, and what is in their system, before really looking at how viable these contracts are - things are not apples to apples across teams.

I do think, in all honesty, those contracts are much too long. anything over 6-7 years is too long, as far as I am concerned (and those long-term contracts should be rare, not the norm).

But the fact that Heatly and a few other expensive contracts come off the books after this year, likely meaning they are not playing near the cap for a while, plus a loaded prospect pool, maybe this works for a team like the Wild financially, as well as on the ice.

Who knows.

Maybe it blows up, too.

All I know is that just like you can't paint every owner with the same brush as a free-spending Snyder, just like you can't paint every team with the same impact of their long-term contracts.

Unfortunately, players look at these deals and think they should get the same, regardless of the situation - and I get why they see that.

Says the guy who is a fan of the team whose owner and GM is the epitomy of hipocracy due to the Parise and Suter signings.
- rebel

And the dealings of the team that I'm a fan of have WHAT to do with me? Make jokes all you want, but the fans inevidibly have the final say and if there is no fan revenue, the joke would be on the NHL and the NHLPA....

But the NHL want nothing to do with this proposal
- Symba.007

Whoopsie!

The NHL's offer.

Fold the league and start over again!

"I implore the NHL and NHLPA to take note of this blog"
- LeftCoaster

Way to go Gary Bettman and owners, bring these players to their knees!

so wheres that optomism meter?

Screw the NHL and NHLPA. Cancel the season and get it over with.

I'll just enjoy the ECHL.

The Player is wrong, Bettman isn't a smart man, Hes a Idiot, So is Fehr, They waiting until 45 days to Sept 15th to actually start talking. At least in the NFL they talked all through the off season.

Hell they were even talking on super bowl weekend.

The difference between the NHL and the NFL and NBA is that the players hired Donald Fehr I think most of us on this website and most experts knew that this was going to happen because Fehr was involved.

The only thing that saves this season from being totally cancelled is if there is a Owner in Hockey like Robert Kraft that can bridge the gap between the players and owners.
- Leafsfan9329

not only did they hire Fehr, but they essentially dissolved the NHLPA multi-tier structure. there's no PA president, no executive committee. there's no Trevor Linden this time around. the players put all of the power in Fehr's hands. they deserve absolutely every inch of the ass-pounding they will eventually take on this deal.

i'm sure 99% of the Wild fans were thrilled with those signings.
- Fountain-San

fans are always thrilled in the summer...a guy like Suter getting a contract like that is ridiculous

Does any of you actually care about this stupid league anymore?

We all love the sport of hockey, but the NHL is a joke

This is baseball of the 90's, its gone into the toilet. No cares to see the opinions of players, I dont care if theyre standing together behind Fehr and his puke brother in every news conference, both sides just need to shut up and stop talking to the media.

I'm about done.

A point not lost on the PA when Craig Leipold was part of the owners group that tabled a proposal calling for a roll back of the salaries on those two contracts
- Canada Cup

You're right the point was not lost, in fact Parise spoke up about it last week more or less criticizing the owners (Leopold) for conducting last minute deals knowing they didn't intend to honor those deals, although when asked he claimed he wasn't pointing fingers.

I'll admit I was shocked when the signings were announced, and I've defended the signings themselves, but was never in favor of the deals they were given... Wild have a bevy of up and coming talent, those future contracts should be the ones paving the way for the Wild, not ridiculous 13 year deals worth that much... I think Leopold has his tit in a ringer now if somehow those deals are in deed rolled back. It'll be seen as a cheap and devious ploy to lure and trap the 2 top free agents to the Wild and will most certainly hurt the Wilds future free agent signings... It's not going to do much good to have 2 disgruntled star players on the team who haven't even donned a Wild sweater yet...

You're right the point was not lost, in fact Parise spoke up about it last week more or less criticizing the owners (Leopold) for conducting last minute deals knowing they didn't intend to honor those deals, although when asked he claimed he wasn't pointing fingers.

I'll admit I was shocked when the signings were announced, and I've defended the signings themselves, but was never in favor of the deals they were given... Wild have a bevy of up and coming talent, those future contracts should be the ones paving the way for the Wild, not ridiculous 13 year deals worth that much... I think Leopold has his tit in a ringer now if somehow those deals are in deed rolled back. It'll be seen as a cheap and devious ploy to lure and trap the 2 top free agents to the Wild and will most certainly hurt the Wilds future free agent signings... It's not going to do much good to have 2 disgruntled star players on the team who haven't even donned a Wild sweater yet...
- MnGump

Yeah, cause $25M in signing bonuses (each) to be paid out regardless of games played is a cheap and devious ploy....

You're right the point was not lost, in fact Parise spoke up about it last week more or less criticizing the owners (Leopold) for conducting last minute deals knowing they didn't intend to honor those deals, although when asked he claimed he wasn't pointing fingers.

I'll admit I was shocked when the signings were announced, and I've defended the signings themselves, but was never in favor of the deals they were given... Wild have a bevy of up and coming talent, those future contracts should be the ones paving the way for the Wild, not ridiculous 13 year deals worth that much... I think Leopold has his tit in a ringer now if somehow those deals are in deed rolled back. It'll be seen as a cheap and devious ploy to lure and trap the 2 top free agents to the Wild and will most certainly hurt the Wilds future free agent signings... It's not going to do much good to have 2 disgruntled star players on the team who haven't even donned a Wild sweater yet...
- MnGump

They would have gotten something pretty similar elsewhere....

"I implore the NHL and NHLPA to take note of this blog. "
If the NHL or the NHLPA are reading this blog, then they are clearly wasting time and not focusing on coming to a resolution. Wait, seems like that's what they are already doing.

The greed in this league is breathtaking. These players should be well paid, they are the elite at what they do, but now the average Joe can't afford to take a family of 4 to a game, and the majority of seats are corporately owned.

I really hope they cancel the season, both sides lose a ton of money, NBC cancels their TV agreement, and the league has to contract some loser teams because of the loss of so many previously loyal fans.


- we_are_all_canucks

Remember that NBC Sports is owned in part by Comcast who own the Flyers. NBC is also underwriting some of the owner losses this year by still paying the $200 million due to the league. NBC Sports will not be dropping the NHL in the near future...

"Record revenues" means absolutely nothing without comparing it to expenses.

If revenues went up by 200%, but expenses went up 2000%, do the record revenues matter?



Players in Europe are making a small fraction of what they would be making in the NHL. Factor in the fact that they have to pay their own insurance, and many of them will barely break even.

The owners won't suffer. The owners will not declare bankruptcy (which a majority of professional athletes will do after they retire).

As for the players, the average NHL salary in 2004-05 was $1.46 million.

The average NHL salary in 2011-12 was $2.4 million.

The players don't mind the cycle continuing.
- Atomic Wedgie

It's all about supply and demand. If the owners can't control themselves and are willing to doll out those sums, then would you turn it down?

And if you believe the NHL, there are several teams on the verge of bankruptcy including those beloved Coyotes.

But we can continue to throw stones all day. At the end of it all, players earn what the market will bear, and stupid owners who continue to make bad decisions will be a recipe for disaster. But like I said, if your boss gave you a 25%, or 50%, or 100% raise, would you turn it down? No! And if you took it, would you be OK if he or she then came the following year to tell that despite the raise, your salary was being reduce 15-20% despite the company doing well and profiting? I don't think so and if you were honest about this, you wouldn't be happy about it either. That's reality.

The players have agreed to a 50-50 split, it's just in the way that is accomplished. But the problem is that neither side has truly negotiated a deal. The NHL says take this , or else. The players say we'll accept that, or else. So if both parties actually could sit at a table and negotiate with no bull, then a deal could be made. But the owners want another grand slam, and players are doing everytihng to avoid it. So nothing happens except time ticks away.

Yeah, cause $25M in signing bonuses (each) to be paid out regardless of games played is a cheap and devious ploy....
- JDJ

The signing bonuses are not in addition to each of their contracts. Their deals are structured to pay out that monetary portion of their deals in the first 2 years, so yes, they get that money regardless, but that doesn't mean the rest of their contracts couldn't be completely revamped and lowered considerably depending on what the language of the new CBA says.

So I certainly see your point, but in the court of public opinion, Leopold will be labeled a con-man. It seems pretty clear his intent was to do just that, con these guys into big long term deals knowing he would be in favor of reducing or eliminating those exact types of high dollar long term deals.

I think you have to look at the team structure, and what is in their system, before really looking at how viable these contracts are - things are not apples to apples across teams.

I do think, in all honesty, those contracts are much too long. anything over 6-7 years is too long, as far as I am concerned (and those long-term contracts should be rare, not the norm).

But the fact that Heatly and a few other expensive contracts come off the books after this year, likely meaning they are not playing near the cap for a while, plus a loaded prospect pool, maybe this works for a team like the Wild financially, as well as on the ice.

Who knows.

Maybe it blows up, too.

All I know is that just like you can't paint every owner with the same brush as a free-spending Snyder, just like you can't paint every team with the same impact of their long-term contracts.

Unfortunately, players look at these deals and think they should get the same, regardless of the situation - and I get why they see that.
- JDJ

Seriously? do players have a gun to owner's heads to pay them that. If the owners don't think the contract is worth it, then just don't sign it. Again, if another company tries to hire you and offers you twice your salary with double your bonus to come work for them, and do the same work, would you say "oh no, that's too much, i can't take that, i'm so humble, so embarrased to accept that large compensation package"? of course not, you take it in 2 seconds. so the issue is Craig Leopold offers these two ridiculous contracts, and did he do so with the full knowledge that teh NHL was going to propose rolling back salaries in the deal, and therefore he wouldn't have to pay as much as 25% or so it? If he did, that is collusion. And I think that is illegal is it not? And who was the head of the MLB PA when the collusion issue hit the fan in baseball??? Don Fehr. Do you not think he doesn't suspect the same thing?

They would have gotten something pretty similar elsewhere....
- Symba.007

And that's the players fault how?

Yeah, cause $25M in signing bonuses (each) to be paid out regardless of games played is a cheap and devious ploy....
- JDJ

The owner signed it, with full disclosure, no ploy at all. All in the contract in black and white. Total transparency. Blame the owner, not the player.

I would be too, even if I think they were much too long.

Star players / impact players should always be getting the cash, I have zero issue with that. It is these tier 3 type players getting $4.5-5M a year on a long-term deal that is just stupid
- JDJ

ville leino for 1. yes the sabres paid it but a team will lose more if they dont try to remain competitive.

The owner signed it, with full disclosure, no ploy at all. All in the contract in black and white. Total transparency. Blame the owner, not the player.
- rebel

I am not blaming anyone.

I am stating as it is... players played teams against one another until an owner blinked and gave them the contract they wanted.

Good for them.

And if you don't think they have similar offers from other teams, then you are insane.

The owners are just as culpable as the players... if the players did not expect a lockout or a roll back, there would not have been a ridiculous amount of signing bonuses over the summer, much more than we have seen in the lat 2-3-4 years.

ville leino for 1. yes the sabres paid it but a team will lose more if they dont try to remain competitive.
- joshs

So you blame and lambasted the owners for signing long-term ridiculous contracts, and now you say they need to do that to remain competitive.

I don't understand.

I am not blaming anyone.

I am stating as it is... players played teams against one another until an owner blinked and gave them the contract they wanted.

Good for them.

And if you don't think they have similar offers from other teams, then you are insane.

The owners are just as culpable as the players... if the players did not expect a lockout or a roll back, there would not have been a ridiculous amount of signing bonuses over the summer, much more than we have seen in the lat 2-3-4 years.
- JDJ

You are missing my point completely. all i'm saying is a player goes in, asks for the world, and the moon, and the supermodel wife to boot. And the stupid owner gives it to him! don't blame the player, blame the guy who overpaid for him. That's what i am saying.

and please do not get personal. We've having a sensible, and reasonable conversation here on a difference of opinion. Not cool

So you blame and lambasted the owners for signing long-term ridiculous contracts, and now you say they need to do that to remain competitive.

I don't understand.
- JDJ

no im not lambasting the owners. just saying that the way the last CBA was, was causing a bidding war every year. jacking up salaries. sure superstars will make tons regardless but then guys like ville leino making 4.5. if owners (who have cap room) dont go after these guys it projects (to the fans) the image of the team not competiting for the cup. under last CBA the cap kept rising every year so everyteam was able to be active in FA. supply remained the same but demand went way up.

You are missing my point completely. all i'm saying is a player goes in, asks for the world, and the moon, and the supermodel wife to boot. And the stupid owner gives it to him! don't blame the player, blame the guy who overpaid for him. That's what i am saying.

and please do not get personal. We've having a sensible, and reasonable conversation here on a difference of opinion. Not cool
- rebel

the last CBA caused demand to go way up while supply remained the same from the cap rising every year. who wants to follow a hockey team that has cap room but chooses not to compete in FA?