If Crosby never played for the Penguins do you think the city of Pittsburgh would root for him?

Its all about the jersey. You may have favorite players in the league, but you are not going to stop watching your team if a player no longer plays there.
- ImThatGuy

it is but if the Bruins jerseys i root for are filled by guys who should be playing for the Alaska Aces then i might have to think long and hard about being a Bruins fan.

it is but if the Bruins jerseys i root for are filled by guys who should be playing for the Alaska Aces then i might have to think long and hard about being a Bruins fan.
- Fountain-San

That point I understand completly. If the product is no good then why pay for it? (It seems some games are like that now with the current players)

My point was strictly on current NHL'ers

If Boston Traded Seguin
If Toronto traded Kessel
If Buffalo Traded Myers

Fans would be upset, but would not stop wathcing.

I disagree completely about you description of the process currently. What your describing is simply not the case. There was real progress made between the two sides in the last week.
- MJL

I just dont' think the Owners will move much further... the current contracts have to take the hit or the deal won't happen. I didn't say they didn't make progress... the Owner's finally gave their close to their final offer which is progress.

You realise Bettman is a "Figurehead" right? He is employed by the owners of this league. He is the owners spokeperson. You can take the players side, I haev bo problem with that, but at least get your hate pointed in the right direction.
- ImThatGuy

Bettman is far from a figurehead. Him and his group handle negotiations.. Which was clearly what my comment was about. They work the economics and make recommendations to the owners. Right, an 8 million dollar a year figurehead. He's about as symbolic as fehr is for the players. You think the players are negotiating CBA details and fehr just takes the press conferences?

If Crosby never played for the Penguins do you think the city of Pittsburgh would root for him?

Its all about the jersey. You may have favorite players in the league, but you are not going to stop watching your team if a player no longer plays there.
- ImThatGuy

Right, not going to disagree with that completely. My point was that the players aren't near as meaningless as the replacement theorists would suggest. You may be sweater first, but the players have an impact. Without the ones who've worn it over the years, the sweater doesnt have near the meaning it does today.

it is but if the Bruins jerseys i root for are filled by guys who should be playing for the Alaska Aces then i might have to think long and hard about being a Bruins fan.
- Fountain-San

I worked with a guy who played for the Aces ... they called him Ramrod ... true story.

Im sure some of you can help me with this. The NHL's offer was for 50/50 and all monies owed for current contracts would be paid. The players "3rd" proposal yesterday supposedly stated 50/50 as long as all current contracts are honored. These are the same things, so why isnt that being used to finish this up? Where is the falsehood? Daly states that the NHLPA was not really 50/50 in that offer. So, that would lead me to believe that if it actually was, then both sides would actually be on the same page and offering the same thing as far as that sticking point is concerned.
- Donnie27J

The NHLs offer on Tuesday was 50/50 that includes a 12% reduction on current contracts which would be re-paid in the future (I don't understand that part Escrow yada yada) plus a lot of transition language and new limits to contracts etc... I thought the NHLPA's offer did not include the 12% reduction in current contracts and the Owner's should honour past contracts. John Shannon said that would be the sticking point.

it is but if the Bruins jerseys i root for are filled by guys who should be playing for the Alaska Aces then i might have to think long and hard about being a Bruins fan.
- Fountain-San

Two thoughts on replacement players:

1) Everyone needs to keep in mind that the idea of replacement players is not to permanently replace the best in the world. It's strictly to force the players' hands - to get them to break their solidarity.

2) The consensus on the boards here seems to be that replacement players would turn off casual fans. I'm going to argue the exact opposite. For casual fans, going to NHL games is about the total experience: riding the subway to the game, buying a hot dog, wearing your team's jersey, cheering, drinking beer, watching a fight, yelling at the other team. That wouldn't change with replacement players.

It's probably the hard core fans who would notice the difference in skill level. And I'm guessing the hard core fans (myself included) would probably give the league a bit of a grace period, as we would just be happy to be watching NHL hockey.

I don't think it is ever going to happen, but fun to talk about (we do have to kill some time here).

Why hasn't the Optimist-meter moved since yesterday afternoon?

Come on Ek move the meter! move the meter! Move the Meter!

Why hasn't the Optimist-meter moved since yesterday afternoon?

Come on Ek move the meter! move the meter! Move the Meter!
- HuileHab

Oh trust me, he will. Can't wait for the update myself!

INteresting article:

http://www.star-telegram....n-to-nba-players-its.html

You do know that the NHL invited the PA to the table multiple times since JANUARY right? You do know that the negotiations were so late because the PA refused to meet right?

Some players (ROFL) are going on about how Bettman should have made this offer in June/July ... Oh, I see, when you were refusing to meet?

This is the depth of idiocy we are seeing on the NHLPA side.
- NightTrain_AlMo

this^
says it all people. bring in the replacements. see how quick Crysby and Co. take what they get. Bunch of bums

Let's recruit the KHL players as replacement players. Let the millionaires go play in Europe.

Here's a good article.

http://www.theglobeandmai...ot-matter/article4622895/

here's a good article.

http://www.infoplasticsur...implants/silicone-saline/

The NHLs offer on Tuesday was 50/50 that includes a 12% reduction on current contracts which would be re-paid in the future (I don't understand that part Escrow yada yada) plus a lot of transition language and new limits to contracts etc... I thought the NHLPA's offer did not include the 12% reduction in current contracts and the Owner's should honour past contracts. John Shannon said that would be the sticking point.
- HipHopisDead

More or less correct. Basically that 12% would be repaid in the future, BUT would be subtracted from the revenues in those future years. So they would get the money they are owed today but would have less available money later on. So instead of an immediate rollback it amounts to a delayed rollback

do it again and be banned :

:du :



( :aah : :ur :yu :du : :y :m :mad :mad :aah : :ur :yu :du : :y :m :mad :mad :y :aah : :ur :yu :du : :y :m :mad :mad :yu :aah : :ur :yu :du : :y :m :mad :mad :aahck: :aahuck: :aah :aahh: :aah : :ur :yu :du : :y :m :mad :mad : : ad: uck: :yu ck: yuck: h: ck: g: urg: :
- ploubo

:aah : :ur :yu :du : :y :m :mad :mad : :aah : :ur :yu :du : :y :m :mad :mad :aa :aah : :ur :yu :du : :y :m :mad :mad :aahh: :aahaah: :aah

Here's a good article.

http://www.theglobeandmai...ot-matter/article4622895/
- HipHopisDead

:ma... :aah

Let's recruit the KHL players as replacement players. Let the millionaires go play in Europe.
- ganou60

... :aah

The NHL offered a 50/50 deal. The Union said that it would except the deal if the owners honor the agreements already in place. Some of these deals were made recently, by teams who are asking for a salary roll back. The only other choice is to allow the players out of the contracts and become free agents. So give individual players the option of accepting a cut on their contract, or become a free agent at the end of the season. It seems reasonable.

I just dont' think the Owners will move much further... the current contracts have to take the hit or the deal won't happen. I didn't say they didn't make progress... the Owner's finally gave their close to their final offer which is progress.
- HipHopisDead

Middle ground on where they need to get to, has for the first time been talked about. Now it's just a question of agreeing on exactly what that is, and how to get there. Real negotiation has just begun.

this^
says it all people. bring in the replacements. see how quick Crysby and Co. take what they get. Bunch of bums
- Mahoney87

And if the owners do that see how quickly fans say bye bye to their tickets. I won't pay owners to see crappy hockey.

Middle ground on where they need to get to, has for the first time been talked about. Now it's just a question of agreeing on exactly what that is, and how to get there. Real negotiation has just begun.
- MJL

So they are off by 100 mil a year so you're saying they will make it 50mil a year and call it a day.