I like what Miller is doing, go directly at the source. Bettman is a puppet and an easy target. Bad mouth him all you want, it's what they pay him for. I would have been more impressed if Teemu had called out the Samueli family or if Toews had called out Rocky Wirtz. They are the true source of this mess.

BTW, someone did call out the Samueli's in a national newspaper today.
http://www.usatoday.com/s...l-games-canceled/1613447/
- duxcup07

Yeah, I'd call out my boss too, if I were only making 5-6 million a year.

So you think 57/43 is a good split? 57% of revenue mind you... Not profits.

By get rid of 25% of the teams, do you mean relocate or actually get rid of? Actually getting rid of 25% is not possible.
- laughs2907

The point here is that the OWNERS held a gun to their heads to get this agreement 7 years ago. They (frank)ed up in spectacular fashion and are now holding everyone hostage over their mistakes.

Go back to 24 teams then if you want to be picky. How many teams lose money? The product would be better as well. As far as I'm concerned, if the city doesn't have snow in the winter, they shouldn't have a team if they can't make money. Phoenix? Atlanta twice? Really?

Bettman sucks.

The owners are at fault here. There's no reason to have the fourth stoppage in 20 years. They put a gun to the players heads last time and this time the players seem to have resolve.

How would you like to have your pay reduced 25%, then sign another contract, approved by the owners, only to have them whine that they gave you too much money?

Bettman and the owners are the ones to blame in this. Good for Miller and anybody else that's good enough to make millions a year in the NHL. Anyone whining about what they make have no idea the challenges they overcame to get there and stay there. It's not like a factory job where any idiot can put screws in a dryer for $20 an hour.

The real enemy is the greedy owners who are not getting more franchise money to split up, don't have a decent US tv deal and cannot seem to accept the fact that they alone created this problem by trying to circumvent their own rules. Luongo? Depietro?

Fire Bettman, get rid of about 25% of the teams, dump the damn instigator penalty and get on with it!
- mr-b

how long did it take those players to make up that paycut?

how much has it increased since then?

from what i can tell, the players return has increased by alot more than the return the owners are getting

funny that with the 24% paycut back then they not only made that up but they are averaging close to 50% more now then they did then

are the players really hurting THAT badly that they cant come down from 57%?

The point here is that the OWNERS held a gun to their heads to get this agreement 7 years ago. They (frank)ed up in spectacular fashion and are now holding everyone hostage over their mistakes.

Go back to 24 teams then if you want to be picky. How many teams lose money? The product would be better as well. As far as I'm concerned, if the city doesn't have snow in the winter, they shouldn't have a team if they can't make money. Phoenix? Atlanta twice? Really?

Bettman sucks.
- mr-b

the owners got a lot of what they wanted, but i doubt they or anyone could have realistically predicted the record growth in revenue and the speed it was growing

but let us not forget that just because the owners did get alot that the players got screwed, in fact they made out pretty nicely

The point here is that the OWNERS held a gun to their heads to get this agreement 7 years ago. They (frank)ed up in spectacular fashion and are now holding everyone hostage over their mistakes.

Go back to 24 teams then if you want to be picky. How many teams lose money? The product would be better as well. As far as I'm concerned, if the city doesn't have snow in the winter, they shouldn't have a team if they can't make money. Phoenix? Atlanta twice? Really?

Bettman sucks.
- mr-b

Right, and that CBA is up. As owners, it is within their rights to negotiate a new CBA.

Ideally the league should be 24 teams, but it's not a reality. Cutting 6 teams would cost the NHL too much money. Those 6 teams would have to be bought out. Buying out 6 teams would cost the NHL around 1 billion... Also, do you think the NHLPA would agree to cutting 6 teams? A lot of their members would lose jobs... Not happening. I agree that several teams should be relocated though. Phoenix for sure... That place is nothing but a money sucker.

The owners are at fault here. There's no reason to have the fourth stoppage in 20 years. They put a gun to the players heads last time and this time the players seem to have resolve.

How would you like to have your pay reduced 25%, then sign another contract, approved by the owners, only to have them whine that they gave you too much money?

Bettman and the owners are the ones to blame in this. Good for Miller and anybody else that's good enough to make millions a year in the NHL. Anyone whining about what they make have no idea the challenges they overcame to get there and stay there. It's not like a factory job where any idiot can put screws in a dryer for $20 an hour.

The real enemy is the greedy owners who are not getting more franchise money to split up, don't have a decent US tv deal and cannot seem to accept the fact that they alone created this problem by trying to circumvent their own rules. Luongo? Depietro?

Fire Bettman, get rid of about 25% of the teams, dump the damn instigator penalty and get on with it!
- mr-b

LOL THIS MADE ME LAUGH!!

Especially from a Leafs fan. He talks about players working their butts off to be there and how they deserve it. Then says they should get rid of 25% of the teams. DO YOU REALLY THINK THE PLAYERS WANT 1/4 OF THE TEAMS TO SHUTDOWN? Where do you think these players will play? you think the if the PA had a vote players, 50% probably whose jobs could be in jeopardy would vote to get rid of teams for more money? LMAO.

Garth, I've been reading quite a few of your posts over the course of the last month or so. I truly do appreciate your enthusiasm for the sport of hockey, and in fact, flat out love it. but i've found myself struggling with a rather stark reality after i finish virtually every blog of yours. you appear completely incapable of calling out both sides on anything that's related to the lockout. the owners have remained intent on grabbing as much cash as possible throughout the entire CBA process. on that point, i'm confident we'd agree. the issue here is that you have consistently failed to recognize the inherent greed that is also present within the NHLPA. Why do you find it necessary to trot out blog after blog completely endorsing the players side, when they also have to be held accountable for the childish antics they've displayed thus far through this negotiating process? As Bob Mckenzie noted in a terrific post on TSN a few weeks back,-- "the NHL spent $1.873 billion on player salaries last season and the NHLPA proposed that number be INCREASED by 2 per cent in the coming season, 4 per cent in year two and 6 per cent in year three. "-- That doesn't exactly paint a picture of a group of victims, being bullied by the NHL to me. I feel like this type of analysis on your part does nobody any good.... brings us no closer to the truth. speaking with contempt for the NHL side while giving the players a free pass is the very definition of hypocrisy. It's critical we hold everyone to the same standards. If not, it's all nothing more than a PR circus in the end.

Miller is full of BS and so is Pegula. And you know what, there is nothing wrong with that. They both want a piece of what is best for them and there is nothing wrong with that. I know that I feel the same way...
- rmiethaner

BINGO!!!! Both are rich wanting more. Its a freaking joke. How about they let people attend a game for less than $500 bucks for a family that doesn't make 6 7 or 8 figures. How about they ALL make concessions to the only people that truly care about the game,,, The fans.

The owners are at fault here. There's no reason to have the fourth stoppage in 20 years. They put a gun to the players heads last time and this time the players seem to have resolve.

How would you like to have your pay reduced 25%, then sign another contract, approved by the owners, only to have them whine that they gave you too much money?

Bettman and the owners are the ones to blame in this. Good for Miller and anybody else that's good enough to make millions a year in the NHL. Anyone whining about what they make have no idea the challenges they overcame to get there and stay there. It's not like a factory job where any idiot can put screws in a dryer for $20 an hour.

The real enemy is the greedy owners who are not getting more franchise money to split up, don't have a decent US tv deal and cannot seem to accept the fact that they alone created this problem by trying to circumvent their own rules. Luongo? Depietro?

Fire Bettman, get rid of about 25% of the teams, dump the damn instigator penalty and get on with it!
- mr-b

Where is this factory job you speak of? $20 an hour would make me Buffalo rich.

The owners are at fault here. There's no reason to have the fourth stoppage in 20 years. They put a gun to the players heads last time and this time the players seem to have resolve.

How would you like to have your pay reduced 25%, then sign another contract, approved by the owners, only to have them whine that they gave you too much money?

Bettman and the owners are the ones to blame in this. Good for Miller and anybody else that's good enough to make millions a year in the NHL. Anyone whining about what they make have no idea the challenges they overcame to get there and stay there. It's not like a factory job where any idiot can put screws in a dryer for $20 an hour.The real enemy is the greedy owners who are not getting more franchise money to split up, don't have a decent US tv deal and cannot seem to accept the fact that they alone created this problem by trying to circumvent their own rules. Luongo? Depietro?

Fire Bettman, get rid of about 25% of the teams, dump the damn instigator penalty and get on with it!
- mr-b

You are an idiot.


1) I had MY pay reduced by 15% 3 1/2 years ago, and haven't seen a cent of that back, and don't think I ever will. Yeah, it sucks, and I cannot afford to pay my bills, BUT I'M NOT MAKING MILLIONS OF DOLLARS, JERK. It's easier to absorb a hit like that when you're making stupid money. Wake up.

2) "Challenges they overcame to get there"?!?!?!? Many (I didn't say ALL) professional hockey players have been told since they were 7 years old that they were "awesome", "the best", "kid's got a bright future in sports", blah blah blah. And that's fine. If they're good enough to make it, good for them. But these "Idiots" putting "screws in a dryer for $20 an hour" are real people with real financial problems who...wait for it...WAIT FOR IT...PAY THE SALARIES OF ALL THESE JERKS IN PROFESSIONAL SPORTS that you put so high on their pedestals. I know I can't afford tickets to hockey games, but like thousands of real people who live in the real world, I manage to find a way to go to these games.

You obviously need a reality check, and I hope you get one.

And after making such idiotic comments (are you secretly an NHL player?), I know that if you and I were on the ice, I'd wish for an abolishment of the instigator rule, too.

shut up Ryan Miller

If the players really want to partner with the league, then they should share the losses not just the profits. No business can survive with 57% payroll expense.

I think it's kind of ironic how after the last lockout everyone thought the owners won by a mile. Now looking back the players were the real winners of the last 7 years. They recouped the rollback in 1 year and almost doubled the average salary over the length of the deal at the owners expense.

Not sure how anyone can blame the League for wanting to change the CBA for a 50/50 split. I understand the owners need to take responsibility for the contracts they handed out, but the market parameters just don't make sense anymore.
- Oglethorpe

i approve of this sentence.. The owners should (in a way to make them think about it) draft a proposal that has them taking 85% of the profits after all teams have broke even. Make them do the math and see how it turns out for them.. the players (like many workers in their respective fields) don't know everything that gets paid besides their salaries..

I like what Miller is doing, go directly at the source. Bettman is a puppet and an easy target. Bad mouth him all you want, it's what they pay him for. I would have been more impressed if Teemu had called out the Samueli family or if Toews had called out Rocky Wirtz. They are the true source of this mess.

BTW, someone did call out the Samueli's in a national newspaper today.
http://www.usatoday.com/s...l-games-canceled/1613447/
- duxcup07

I agree with you. Throwing jabs at Bettman is the lazy way out. I'll know the players are serious when they call their own owners out by name.

The owners are at fault here. There's no reason to have the fourth stoppage in 20 years. They put a gun to the players heads last time and this time the players seem to have resolve.

How would you like to have your pay reduced 25%, then sign another contract, approved by the owners, only to have them whine that they gave you too much money?

Bettman and the owners are the ones to blame in this. Good for Miller and anybody else that's good enough to make millions a year in the NHL. Anyone whining about what they make have no idea the challenges they overcame to get there and stay there. It's not like a factory job where any idiot can put screws in a dryer for $20 an hour.

The real enemy is the greedy owners who are not getting more franchise money to split up, don't have a decent US tv deal and cannot seem to accept the fact that they alone created this problem by trying to circumvent their own rules. Luongo? Depietro?

Fire Bettman, get rid of about 25% of the teams, dump the damn instigator penalty and get on with it!
- mr-b

Really? C'mon now... when will the players wake up? FEAR THE FEHR!!! I mean, when the last deal was done what happened next? The Owners went on a spending splurge, Player's salaries went through the roof. The Players will never:
1) Get the money back they are losing, by missing games.
2) Realize how good they have it, and had it.
3) Understand that if it weren't for the "Owners", they wouldn't have a job, or worse... may be playing hockey in the warm climate of Russia!

You are an idiot.


1) I had MY pay reduced by 15% 3 1/2 years ago, and haven't seen a cent of that back, and don't think I ever will. Yeah, it sucks, and I cannot afford to pay my bills, BUT I'M NOT MAKING MILLIONS OF DOLLARS, JERK. It's easier to absorb a hit like that when you're making stupid money. Wake up.

2) "Challenges they overcame to get there"?!?!?!? Many (I didn't say ALL) professional hockey players have been told since they were 7 years old that they were "awesome", "the best", "kid's got a bright future in sports", blah blah blah. And that's fine. If they're good enough to make it, good for them. But these "Idiots" putting "screws in a dryer for $20 an hour" are real people with real financial problems who...wait for it...WAIT FOR IT...PAY THE SALARIES OF ALL THESE JERKS IN PROFESSIONAL SPORTS that you put so high on their pedestals. I know I can't afford tickets to hockey games, but like thousands of real people who live in the real world, I manage to find a way to go to these games.

You obviously need a reality check, and I hope you get one.

And after making such idiotic comments (are you secretly an NHL player?), I know that if you and I were on the ice, I'd wish for an abolishment of the instigator rule, too.



- Powerslave

Right on.

I don't get how Garth thinks Pegula is somehow above the rest of the owners and doesn't support the lockout, if he was then there wouldn't have been a unanimous vote by the owners to support it. If you don't think both sides are in this to stuff their pockets and nothing else, you're very naive.

In what other business are the 'employees' also the product?
- DeanoTPS

No business can run without employees. Why should players make more than their bosses?

Right on.

I don't get how Garth thinks Pegula is somehow above the rest of the owners and doesn't support the lockout, if he was then there wouldn't have been a unanimous vote by the owners to support it. If you don't think both sides are in this to stuff their pockets and nothing else, you're very naive.
- Bozzy

Unanimous doesn't mean 100%. It means more for than against. I'll bet Pegula was not part of that unanimous vote.

Unanimous doesn't mean 100%. It means more for than against. I'll bet Pegula was not part of that unanimous vote.
- sippyd

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/unanimous

Unanimous doesn't mean 100%. It means more for than against. I'll bet Pegula was not part of that unanimous vote.
- sippyd

Actually that's exactly what Unanimous means.

i approve of this sentence.. The owners should (in a way to make them think about it) draft a proposal that has them taking 85% of the profits after all teams have broke even. Make them do the math and see how it turns out for them.. the players (like many workers in their respective fields) don't know everything that gets paid besides their salaries..
- SabresFaninIndiana

Yep, that's just my point. If running a business was so easy then everyone would be doing it. The owners carry the majority of the risk and have a right to make a profit. Players (and most employees at any company) don't really see everything it takes to keep a business moving forward. There's a lot more to it than punching the clock and taking a paycheck on Friday.

Yep, that's just my point. If running a business was so easy then everyone would be doing it. The owners carry the majority of the risk and have a right to make a profit. Players (and most employees at any company) don't really see everything it takes to keep a business moving forward. There's a lot more to it than punching the clock and taking a paycheck on Friday.
- Oglethorpe

my favorite is the kids that say you charge $35/hr for me to go to a job-site so why don't i make like $30? makes me smile everytime

Right on.

I don't get how Garth thinks Pegula is somehow above the rest of the owners and doesn't support the lockout, if he was then there wouldn't have been a unanimous vote by the owners to support it. If you don't think both sides are in this to stuff their pockets and nothing else, you're very naive.
- Bozzy

OK, maybe Pegula takes his 1 vote against the rest of the league. Pegula is the new guy in the owners ring. He has a small market team that is not responsible for a huge chunk of revenue. How much pull do you think he has. Plus, maybe he agrees with what the owners are trying to do because he is a good businessman. The one thing that can never be said of Pegula is that he is using his team for ANY type of money grab.

The owners are at fault here. There's no reason to have the fourth stoppage in 20 years. They put a gun to the players heads last time and this time the players seem to have resolve.

How would you like to have your pay reduced 25%, then sign another contract, approved by the owners, only to have them whine that they gave you too much money?

Bettman and the owners are the ones to blame in this. Good for Miller and anybody else that's good enough to make millions a year in the NHL. Anyone whining about what they make have no idea the challenges they overcame to get there and stay there. It's not like a factory job where any idiot can put screws in a dryer for $20 an hour.

The real enemy is the greedy owners who are not getting more franchise money to split up, don't have a decent US tv deal and cannot seem to accept the fact that they alone created this problem by trying to circumvent their own rules. Luongo? Depietro?

Fire Bettman, get rid of about 25% of the teams, dump the damn instigator penalty and get on with it!
- mr-b

Hmm...I don't think you'll find an Islanders' fan alive who would say DiPietro's contract is not a horrible, horrible thing, but how is it circumvention? It's the same actual salary in year 1 as in year 15...which makes it even more idiotic, but not circumvention.

Are you guys serious what business does the the employees (labour) make more than the owner? Uhh a ton of them do. Whenever a contractor of any type bids on a job, by far the biggest expense is routinely labour.

To the point so where sometimes, with set backs the labour costs end up coming in over your bid and you take the job at a loss. This happens all the time.

Are you guys serious what business does the the employees (labour) make more than the owner? Uhh a ton of them do. Whenever a contractor of any type bids on a job, by far the biggest expense is routinely labour.

To the point so where sometimes, with set backs the labour costs end up coming in over your bid and you take the job at a loss. This happens all the time.
- Blazed

Pretty sure those businesses don't last long. Plus, I'll bet if you poll those contractors, they would vote to change that structure if they could.