Fire and Ice reporting?
- Chieppa1

Only people reporting (as usual) is the NY post.

You would think so...
Yet Nashville made 2nd round and are hurting...
Yotes made 3rd round and are hurting BAD...
Devils made SCF and are hurting...

Leafs haven't made playoffs in 8 years and make the most money out of any team by far...
- BoBBeR56

Devils made money last year.

However, it is the previous debt that is hurting all those teams. Coyotes from years of mediocracy, Nashville from building a market finally, and the Devils from taking out a loan to build Prudential Center.

Todd Cordell: Report: New Jersey Devils in More Financial Trouble
- Todd.Cordell

I'm curious what Jeff_121 has to say on the matter

Devils news: Henrique goal used in NBCsports promo. Yeah, we're important now.
- Pomegrant

They're going to cg a Quebec jersey on him

I'm curious what Jeff_121 has to say on the matter
- shvingter88

Devils made money last year.

However, it is the previous debt that is hurting all those teams. Coyotes from years of mediocracy, Nashville from building a market finally, and the Devils from taking out a loan to build Prudential Center.
- _Zippy_

Did they?
Forbes said they lost $6.1mil...
Preds lost $7.5mil...
Yotes lost $24.4mil...

- bobert836

Guy has been a devils fan for 20 years. That must have been a rough 20.

He should do himself a favor and become a rags fan.

http://www.funnieststuff.net/viewmovie.php?id=2998

Did they?
Forbes said they lost $6.1mil...
Preds lost $7.5mil...
Yotes lost $24.4mil...
- BoBBeR56

Regular season.

Did they?
Forbes said they lost $6.1mil...
Preds lost $7.5mil...
Yotes lost $24.4mil...
- BoBBeR56

Regular season. Devils made 30 mil + in playoff revenue.

Edit: Sorry RM didnt see your post.

Oh, you understand economics. I'm dumb.
- Pomegrant

Regular season. Devils made 30 mil + in playoff revenue.

Edit: Sorry RM didnt see your post.
- Kovaltron

Huh?

Huh?
- Atomic Wedgie

Been a long time?

It's because Canada doesn't have enough people. Yes, Canada made hockey and they are obviously extremely passionate about hockey but that doesn't make professional hockey viable everywhere in Canada. The US has many more large markets than Canada and without expansion to non-traditional markets we wouldn't have successful franchises in the southern and south western states. Yes, the Coyotes franchise blows but look at Dallas, Nashville, Tampa, San Jose, Anaheim, and Carolina. These are teams that took time to cultivate a fan base which is a long process but it worked. Atlanta, Florida, and Phoenix might not be working but so far the NHL has had more success in non-traditional markets than failures.
- Pomegrant

I'm going to stick up for the NHL here.

Atlanta has a team because Ted Turner wanted one, and promised to put games on TBS. That's a no-brainer.

Florida has a team because Wayne Huizenga wanted one, and he owned Blockbuster, which at the time was a huge media powerhouse (my, how things have changed).

Phoenix has a team because someone bought the team and moved it there. People seem to forget this.

And in both Florida and Phoenix, I would argue that a huge contributing problem would be the fact that they moved the teams to the middle of nowhere.

Been a long time?
- bobert836

I know people with shorter sentences for manslaughter.

Congratulations - every "fact" except for saying that the US has more people than Canada was wrong. There are no succesful franchises in the southern and south western US and all the successful teams that you listed are losing money.

The "fact" is that hockey has only limited, interest in the US focused in a few markets. To try to build a national league out of niche market is simply bad business.

As a hockey fan who happens to be Canadian, I don't have any concerns about there being more American than Canadian teams. What I do want is more financially viable teams and if teams have to be moved because they can't make it work, I don't really care where they end up as long as they have a chance to make money. I do know that new teams in Toronto, Quebec City, Hamilton would all make money.
- Canada Cup

You are judging a long term plan on its short term results.

Would quebec city make money? Winnipeg lost over 5 million, and only made more than the Islanders and Coyotes in revenue. Moving 2 more teams to the GTA is not a sound long term plan.

I'm going to stick up for the NHL here.

Atlanta has a team because Ted Turner wanted one, and promised to put games on TBS. That's a no-brainer.

Florida has a team because Wayne Huizenga wanted one, and he owned Blockbuster, which at the time was a huge media powerhouse (my, how things have changed).

Phoenix has a team because someone bought the team and moved it there. People seem to forget this.

And in both Florida and Phoenix, I would argue that a huge contributing problem would be the fact that they moved the teams to the middle of nowhere.
- Atomic Wedgie

Huh?
- Atomic Wedgie

I'm going to stick up for the NHL here.

Atlanta has a team because Ted Turner wanted one, and promised to put games on TBS. That's a no-brainer.

Florida has a team because Wayne Huizenga wanted one, and he owned Blockbuster, which at the time was a huge media powerhouse (my, how things have changed).

Phoenix has a team because someone bought the team and moved it there. People seem to forget this.

And in both Florida and Phoenix, I would argue that a huge contributing problem would be the fact that they moved the teams to the middle of nowhere.
- Atomic Wedgie

And the vast potential given the size of the markets and the metropolitan areas? That has to be put into serious consideration. Had Phoenix not moved to the middle of (frank)ing nowhere, their situation would be better right now. They moved 30 miles outside of Phoenix, compared to their old arena which was in the center of Phoenix.

Now people who might've said, the Coyotes play 10 minutes away, let's go catch a game, and potentially start seeing the team regularly look at it and say, I don't feel like driving 30-40 minutes there and back from Glendale.

You are judging a long term plan on its short term results.

Would quebec city make money? Winnipeg lost over 5 million, and only made more than the Islanders and Coyotes in revenue. Moving 2 more teams to the GTA is not a sound long term plan.
- rmdevil313

Moving 2 more teams to the GTA is never going to happen - the Leafs have territorial rights, and they aren't going to give them up. It's a non-starter.

Quebec City is very, very small. I can't help but think that the majority of people who support a move there haven't actually been there. Unless the owner is willing to lose money (Carling was OK with it the last time), it's going to be an uphill battle.

And by the way, someone earlier suggested that Canadian fans are just dying to see more teams in Canada.

Let me assure you: TROC (the rest of Canada) won't be upset if Quebec City doesn't get a team.

And the vast potential given the size of the markets and the metropolitan areas? That has to be put into serious consideration. Had Phoenix not moved to the middle of (frank)ing nowhere, their situation would be better right now. They moved 30 miles outside of Phoenix, compared to their old arena which was in the center of Phoenix.

Now people who might've said, the Coyotes play 10 minutes away, let's go catch a game, and potentially start seeing the team regularly look at it and say, I don't feel like driving 30-40 minutes there and back from Glendale.
- _Zippy_

Yeah, maybe, but in the end, I just don't see it working.

I think the big problem is the lack of hockey players in these markets. It just stands to reason that if you play the game, you'll probably like it more.

I just don't see any business model whereby the Coyotes are ever successful. If that's the case, why are we continuing to try to keep them there?

Oddly enough, it's probably this and the other franchises that will ultimately help the Devils' financial situation. If the owner can't come up with the $20 million by next week, the creditors are probably still better off working with him. It's not like they can simply take the team and sell it - nobody wants it. Nobody wants the Coyotes. Nobody wanted the Stars. Nobody wants Florida.

Supply is high, and demand is non-existent.

Moving 2 more teams to the GTA is never going to happen - the Leafs have territorial rights, and they aren't going to give them up. It's a non-starter.

Quebec City is very, very small. I can't help but think that the majority of people who support a move there haven't actually been there. Unless the owner is willing to lose money (Carling was OK with it the last time), it's going to be an uphill battle.

And by the way, someone earlier suggested that Canadian fans are just dying to see more teams in Canada.

Let me assure you: TROC (the rest of Canada) won't be upset if Quebec City doesn't get a team.
- Atomic Wedgie

Its a shame. Those nordiques jerseys were awesome.

Its a shame. Those nordiques jerseys were awesome.
- rmdevil313

Hartford it is

Yeah, maybe, but in the end, I just don't see it working.

I think the big problem is the lack of hockey players in these markets. It just stands to reason that if you play the game, you'll probably like it more.

I just don't see any business model whereby the Coyotes are ever successful. If that's the case, why are we continuing to try to keep them there?

Oddly enough, it's probably this and the other franchises that will ultimately help the Devils' financial situation. If the owner can't come up with the $20 million by next week, the creditors are probably still better off working with him. It's not like they can simply take the team and sell it - nobody wants it. Nobody wants the Coyotes. Nobody wanted the Stars. Nobody wants Florida.

Supply is high, and demand is non-existent.
- Atomic Wedgie

It takes time to develop a love for the game, and often times a long playoff run. We are starting to see quite a few players from the LA area. I know the Dallas owner built a number of rinks to help spread the game, and I believe one of the upcoming top prospect played his youth hockey in texas.

Pheonix is a lost cause at this point.

Hartford it is
- shvingter88

They have some nice jerseys too.