so:

Weber long term
Doan on an over 35 deal for 4 years
1, potentially 2 1st rounders over the next four years

vs

Weber long term(call their damn bluff)
Jake(22 yr old future 1st liner)
Mezzy(top 4 D man)
Read(cap hit made of gold, 47 point rookie year)
No 1st rounder for 4 years

It's a tough call to make. I call their bluff though. I'd be a lot more willing to consider the deal if Read isnt included tho. Doan in for Jake and Read(and Jagr too if you think about it) leaves a LOT of offense to replace. Would they take Laughton over Read? If we arent trading Schenn or Coots another center is a little superfluous, no?
- hereticpride

Has there been an increase in the cap that I am unaware of?

Someone please explain this popular thought that the Flyers can acquire Weber for the 4 firsts and then turn around and sign Jake...

That is financially impossible.

The Flyers currently have somewhere between 7-8 mill in cap space. Acquiring Weber evaporates that cap space immediately.

How do you sign Voracek?
- Flyers2821

It's not financially impossible. It's very possible to do.

It's not financially impossible. It's very possible to do.
- MJL

Not without moving additional salary via trade it isn't.

If they acquire Weber for the 4 firsts, they can not sign Jake without moving salary via trade.

I think the CBA uncertainty is why he signed the offer sheet. I agree Weber will be content in either Nashville or Philadelphia. But I think if the CBA wasn't coming up, he probably would have been less likely to sign a sheet.
- Jsaquella

Agree totally.

Prongs said it best: ".....well does he play??"

Dammnit I miss him

I agree that the Flyers have the bargaining power with any type of trade. Nashville is the team who has to say yes or no to signing the deal, but the Flyers know the financial situation saying yes would put Nashville in. So when it comes to sitting down at the negotiating table to "compensate" Nashville for not saying yes to the offer sheet, I definitely feel as though Philly has the bargaining power.
- Flyers2821

If the Flyers have the power, then Nashville will decline matching the offer sheet and there will be no trade. I honestly think that is the least likely scenario.

That's exactly my point. Read to me can play a top 6 role. In a perfect world, you'd also get Doan.

With Doan

Hartsy - G - Doan
Read/Simmonds - Briere - Schenn
Wellwood / Rusty - Coots - Simmonds/Read
Wellwood / Rusty - Talbot - Sestito/Rinaldo


Without Doan

Hartsy - G - Schenn
Simmonds - Briere - Read
Rusty - Coots - Wellwood (shut-down defensive line)
Sestito/Rinando - Talbot - Holmstrom

Still a little bit of an issue, but much better than without Read.
- TheGreat28

Trading Read makes no sense to me. Every team that spends up to the cap needs guys with low cap hits to produce. Read is a 20 goal scorer, who can kill penalties and plays a solid two way game. If you take cap hit into consideration Read is one of the most valuable Flyers on the roster.

Not without moving additional salary via trade it isn't.
- Flyers2821

Absolutely it is.

so:

Weber long term
Doan on an over 35 deal for 4 years
1, potentially 2 1st rounders over the next four years

vs

Weber long term(call their damn bluff)
Jake(22 yr old future 1st liner)
Mezzy(top 4 D man)
Read(cap hit made of gold, 47 point rookie year)
No 1st rounder for 4 years

It's a tough call to make. I call their bluff though. I'd be a lot more willing to consider the deal if Read isnt included tho. Doan in for Jake and Read(and Jagr too if you think about it) leaves a LOT of offense to replace. Would they take Laughton over Read? If we arent trading Schenn or Coots another center is a little superfluous, no?
- hereticpride

I would try to keep Laughton and offer Cousins and/or MAB. Cousins is likely to be a gritty agitator with a little scoring in the NHL The Flyers have other players like that on the roster. Laughton would add more value as shut-down 3rd line center for Flyers.

I'd prefer Gusty to compete vs. Gervais for 6th dman vs. MAB. Even without Mesz they'd have decent size, and can probably use a puck mover.

Main problem is Nashville has a surplus of D that are comparable to MAB, so they probably want forwards.

have to feel for the players and the students. something needs to be done, but not sure if massive penalties are going to make this situation any better.
- hammarby31

It certainly isn't going to make anything that happened go away. But it sends a clear message that what went on, will not be tolerated.

Doan isn't a lock, but there are other options. I like Voracek, Read and Meszaros, but I'd still move all three for Weber. Three nice, solid player for one Elite player is a move I'd make. Especially given the Flyers past track record of finding scoring through the draft and free agency
- Jsaquella

It is certainly a fair perspective, tho last night some would have accused you of raping the horses and riding off on the women.

In terms of other options, you have a much better knowledge of what they may be than I do. Who would you suggest they look at?

Absolutely it is.
- MJL

How??

Absolutely it is.
- MJL

Please explain.

Fair points. I didn't want Suter at those numbers anyway, and it would have been a mistake giving him that type of contract imo. Parise, I would have liked to see him with Giroux, but he decided to play at home where his Dad played. Can't fault him for that. I'm glad Parise is out of the division. That's the positive I take from that.

I'm hoping the Flyers get Weber for the 4 first rounders, and sign Voracek. And go to war with that team. That is best case scenario, and a likely one imo.
- PLindbergh31

That absolutely is the best case scenario, and while I agree it is possible, I think that a Gratton situation is the most likely outcome.

Nashville can get more for the picks they receive from the Flyers, because in that trade the Flyers are trading them for a guarantee that the Preds won't match the offer sheet. That's why I still see that as the most likely outcome. I can see the Preds matching, but have no idea how the ice a competitive team with the money due to Weber and Rinne.

Trading Read makes no sense to me. Every team that spends up to the cap needs guys with low cap hits to produce. Read is a 20 goal scorer, who can kill penalties and plays a solid two way game. If you take cap hit into consideration Read is one of the most valuable Flyers on the roster.
- PLindbergh31

hahahahaha

I guess you forgot about #28? even couturier is more valuable at his cap hit. he shut down the best player in the league during an extremely high scoring playoff series.

Read is a nice player, your drastically overrating him. Even taking his cap hit into consideration.

What if the Rangers decide to step up and meet Anaheim's demands on Ryan as a pre-emptive counter to Weber landing here? If the Rangers agree to the price and say now or never, does Anaheim ignore a bird in hand for the potential of two in the bush?
- Jsaquella

then i say call their bluff. who else are they in the market for? if that's their guy anaheim can make them wait.

Trading Read makes no sense to me. Every team that spends up to the cap needs guys with low cap hits to produce. Read is a 20 goal scorer, who can kill penalties and plays a solid two way game. If you take cap hit into consideration Read is one of the most valuable Flyers on the roster.
- PLindbergh31

I completely agree with you. Including Read (with Mesz and Jake) is probably the line where I take the gamble and let them match.

Jsaq is willing to put him in the deal. That's a completely legit argument too.

hahahahaha

I guess you forgot about #28?
- Flyers2821

He said ONE OF dude....relax

And for what its worth, I wholeheartedly agree with him

Damn right I'm concerned about next year. How many prime years do you think Bryzgalov has left? You want to make hay at the front end of his contract. Not hope you catch lightning in a bottle when he is 36-37
- PLindbergh31

Bryzgalov has a lot of prime years left. Goaltenders frequently play, and play well, into their late 30's.

so:

Weber long term
Doan on an over 35 deal for 4 years
1, potentially 2 1st rounders over the next four years

vs

Weber long term(call their damn bluff)
Jake(22 yr old future 1st liner)
Mezzy(top 4 D man)
Read(cap hit made of gold, 47 point rookie year)
No 1st rounder for 4 years

It's a tough call to make. I call their bluff though. I'd be a lot more willing to consider the deal if Read isnt included tho. Doan in for Jake and Read(and Jagr too if you think about it) leaves a LOT of offense to replace. Would they take Laughton over Read? If we arent trading Schenn or Coots another center is a little superfluous, no?
- hereticpride

If you call their bluff and they match, then you don't have Weber.

I'm fine with any outcome, really, except a vast overpayment for Weber. And if I get a deal for Weber where I can keep Couturier, both Schenn, Simmonds, Coburn, Giroux and keep two of the 4 picks in hand, I'm good.

Please explain.
- Flyers2821

Capgeek is your friend!


CAPGEEK.COM USER GENERATED ROSTER
My Custom Lineup
FORWARDS
Scott Hartnell ($4.200m) / Danny Briere ($6.500m) / Wayne Simmonds ($1.750m)
Ruslan Fedotenko ($1.750m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Matt Read ($0.900m)
Jody Shelley ($1.100m) / Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Jakub Voracek ($4.000m)
Eric Wellwood ($0.580m) / Maxime Talbot ($1.750m) / Sean Couturier ($1.375m)
Zac Rinaldo ($0.544m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Kimmo Timonen ($6.333m) / Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m)
Braydon Coburn ($4.500m) / Nicklas Grossmann ($3.500m)
Luke Schenn ($3.600m) / Andreas Lilja ($0.738m)
Bruno Gervais ($0.825m) / Shea Weber ($7.850m)
GOALTENDERS
Ilya Bryzgalov ($5.667m)
Michael Leighton ($0.900m)
BUYOUTS
Oskars Bartulis ($0.100m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $70,200,000; CAP PAYROLL: $69,321,944; BONUSES: $2,705,000
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $878,056

It certainly isn't going to make anything that happened go away. But it sends a clear message that what went on, will not be tolerated.
- MJL

without a doubt. the collateral damage is enormous, and i dont' know if the punishment fits the crime.

then i say call their bluff. who else are they in the market for? if that's their guy anaheim can make them wait.
- hammarby31

The Rangers could also move for Nash. It's not Ryan or bust for them.

That absolutely is the best case scenario, and while I agree it is possible, I think that a Gratton situation is the most likely outcome.

Nashville can get more for the picks they receive from the Flyers, because in that trade the Flyers are trading them for a guarantee that the Preds won't match the offer sheet. That's why I still see that as the most likely outcome. I can see the Preds matching, but have no idea how the ice a competitive team with the money due to Weber and Rinne.
- Jsaquella

We will probably have to wait until Wednesday evening to find out. I'm not thrilled with trading a fairly large package because I'm not sure how those holes will be filled. If Nashville is willing to match, I would prefer they do so, and the Flyers to re-sign Jake and get Doan. That would still be a very solid team.

hahahahaha

I guess you forgot about #28? even couturier is more valuable at his cap hit. he shut down the best player in the league during an extremely high scoring playoff series.

Read is a nice player, your drastically overrating him. Even taking his cap hit into consideration.
- Flyers2821

A rookie that scored 25 goals, and can play in all situations. Has speed and is a solid 2 way player. For a 900K Cap hit. He's not drastically overrating him at all.