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Forums :: NHL Talk :: WHO is in a better situation: LEAFS or SENS?
Author Message
senstroll
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Sens Suck, ON
Joined: 02.22.2008

Aug 17 @ 2:45 PM ET
senstroll
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Sens Suck, ON
Joined: 02.22.2008

Aug 18 @ 7:49 AM ET
Pronman posted his prospect ranking
Top 100

I dont have access and dont see the full list posted somewhere yet.
But from reddit

40) Kasperi Kapanen
43) Timothy Liljegren
73) Travis Dermott
79) Jeremy Bracco

Goalies
7) Joseph Woll


For our Atlantic Division rivals, Tampa Bay had the most prospects in the top 100 with 6, Detroit with 5, Toronto/Buffalo with 4, Ottawa/Montreal/Boston/Florida with 3.


Leafs Ranked 13 overall, kinda surprising they are still that high and have 4 in top 100

If any knows the full list ....<>
spatso
Ottawa Senators
Location: jensen beach, FL
Joined: 02.19.2007

Aug 18 @ 8:01 AM ET
Fishing has been inconsistent all summer. 43 bass caught in 2 days (all small) with three lines in the boat. Next 2 days not even a nibble. Think it has something to do with all the rain. Having difficulty reading the water. None of the hot spots seem to be working.

Huge fog this morning after heavy rain last night. Slow to get going. Will wait for some of it to burn off. Bringing the boat over and going to try Crotch Lake. It is a huge lake with a great reputation.

Training camps starting soon enough.
spatso
Ottawa Senators
Location: jensen beach, FL
Joined: 02.19.2007

Aug 18 @ 8:23 AM ET
Pronman posted his prospect ranking
Top 100

I dont have access and dont see the full list posted somewhere yet.
But from reddit



Leafs Ranked 13 overall, kinda surprising they are still that high and have 4 in top 100

If any knows the full list ....<>

- senstroll


Pronman is about the worst. Never able to figure out his logic. Seeds a lot of name kids, especially US kids that never make NHL. Also does not seem to understand that one huge talent (eg McDavid) can have more value than all the prospects combined from another farm.

It is my belief that nobody does the draft and prospect evaluations better than TSN. Their draft day accuracy is very precise. And their talent assessments seem hot wired to the pros that are making the decisions. Updated list comes in September.

http://www.tsn.ca/test1-1.677389
D0PPELGANGER
Ottawa Senators
Location: Ottawa, ON
Joined: 05.06.2015

Aug 18 @ 8:30 AM ET
I know a lot of Senator fans, who think that Tomas Chabot is going to make the Senators starting roster this season, and will be playing in the "top four".

I've been saying all along that he will be sent to Belleville for all or most of the coming season to develop, and gain experience vs men at the prop level, in the AHL.

Think that the Senators hiring of Paul Boutilier as new Assistant Coach in Belleville pretty much shows this is the case.

However long it takes for him to gain the confidence of the NHL coaching staff, he will stay in the AHL and get called up if he earns it at that level.
Feeling Glucky?
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Tanktown, ON
Joined: 10.08.2008

Aug 18 @ 9:15 AM ET
Pronman is about the worst. Never able to figure out his logic. Seeds a lot of name kids, especially US kids that never make NHL. Also does not seem to understand that one huge talent (eg McDavid) can have more value than all the prospects combined from another farm.

It is my belief that nobody does the draft and prospect evaluations better than TSN. Their draft day accuracy is very precise. And their talent assessments seem hot wired to the pros that are making the decisions. Updated list comes in September.

http://www.tsn.ca/test1-1.677389

- spatso

I'll remember this next time you try and use espn rankings
Tumbleweed
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: everyday i see my dream
Joined: 03.14.2014

Aug 18 @ 9:56 AM ET
Pronman is about the worst. Never able to figure out his logic. Seeds a lot of name kids, especially US kids that never make NHL. Also does not seem to understand that one huge talent (eg McDavid) can have more value than all the prospects combined from another farm.

It is my belief that nobody does the draft and prospect evaluations better than TSN. Their draft day accuracy is very precise. And their talent assessments seem hot wired to the pros that are making the decisions. Updated list comes in September.

http://www.tsn.ca/test1-1.677389

- spatso


I agree. Pronman got it wrong.


Ranking the sens 12, ahead of the leafs is idiotic.


With no prospect depth, sens should be a lot lower.
spatso
Ottawa Senators
Location: jensen beach, FL
Joined: 02.19.2007

Aug 18 @ 10:24 AM ET
I agree. Pronman got it wrong.


Ranking the sens 12, ahead of the leafs is idiotic.


With no prospect depth, sens should be a lot lower.

- Tumbleweed


Team rankings are silly. Arizona has been top 5 for 10 years. It is the individual players ( as prospects) that matter.

Go back and redo previous drafts based on actual performance. Now, that is interesting.
Tumbleweed
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: everyday i see my dream
Joined: 03.14.2014

Aug 18 @ 10:43 AM ET
Team rankings are silly. Arizona has been top 5 for 10 years. It is the individual players ( as prospects) that matter.

Go back and redo previous drafts based on actual performance. Now, that is interesting.

- spatso


didn't take long to get back to fake news

bottom line, outside of shabot, sens prospects suck ass
senstroll
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Sens Suck, ON
Joined: 02.22.2008

Aug 18 @ 11:20 AM ET
Pronman is about the worst. Never able to figure out his logic. Seeds a lot of name kids, especially US kids that never make NHL. Also does not seem to understand that one huge talent (eg McDavid) can have more value than all the prospects combined from another farm.

It is my belief that nobody does the draft and prospect evaluations better than TSN. Their draft day accuracy is very precise. And their talent assessments seem hot wired to the pros that are making the decisions. Updated list comes in September.

http://www.tsn.ca/test1-1.677389

- spatso



Your go to then is Button?

I am pretty sure everyone knows the Value of McDavid.
For the purpose of these lists though, Mcdavid is on them for about 45 seconds..he is not a Prospect long
senstroll
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Sens Suck, ON
Joined: 02.22.2008

Aug 18 @ 11:35 AM ET
Team rankings are silly. Arizona has been top 5 for 10 years. It is the individual players ( as prospects) that matter.

Go back and redo previous drafts based on actual performance. Now, that is interesting.

- spatso



Well those are 2 separate things

Ranking Past performance Vs Potential future performance

Both are done..you can do both
Tumbleweed
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: everyday i see my dream
Joined: 03.14.2014

Aug 18 @ 2:07 PM ET
craig button's 1st round pick history:

2000 - Brent Krahn #9 Goalie never played a game in the NHL
2001 - Chuck Kobasew #14 RW 210 points in 601 games
2002 - Eric Nystrom #10 LW, 123 points in 593 games (and he's a -73 for his career)

That's a steaming pile by any stretch for 3 first rounders.

The guy has less credibilty than Howard Berger.

thanks @ winsix

lol @ spatso
senstroll
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Sens Suck, ON
Joined: 02.22.2008

Aug 18 @ 3:13 PM ET
A good start to the predictions imo

Lottowa Senators

senstroll
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Sens Suck, ON
Joined: 02.22.2008

Aug 18 @ 3:16 PM ET
The 6th Sens‏ @6thSens

Hypothetically, if the Isles entertain offers on Tavares, would Turris+Brown+Ceci get the Senators close?


No

lol
Tumbleweed
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: everyday i see my dream
Joined: 03.14.2014

Aug 18 @ 3:23 PM ET
A good start to the predictions imo

Lottowa Senators


- senstroll


dorion's presntation to melnyk on the sens upcoming season

#sensummertalk

BINGO!
Carolina Hurricanes
Location: Brian Boyle is better than Patrick Marleau - Dopps, SK
Joined: 09.21.2009

Aug 18 @ 3:52 PM ET
A good start to the predictions imo

Lottowa Senators


- senstroll


No way Vegas is that good.
Tumbleweed
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: everyday i see my dream
Joined: 03.14.2014

Aug 18 @ 4:08 PM ET
No

lol

- senstroll


as a rental, kovalchuk got Niclas Bergfors, Johnny Oduya, Patrice Cormier, a 1st-round draft pick in 2010 and a 2nd-round draft pick in 2010

a package of junk prospects/players and picks.

so white, ceci, chaplik, a 1st and a 2nd would probably be close for JT purely as a rental.

but i think he stays in NY.
spatso
Ottawa Senators
Location: jensen beach, FL
Joined: 02.19.2007

Aug 18 @ 4:18 PM ET
as a rental, kovalchuk got Niclas Bergfors, Johnny Oduya, Patrice Cormier, a 1st-round draft pick in 2010 and a 2nd-round draft pick in 2010

a package of junk prospects/players and picks.

so white, ceci, chaplik, a 1st and a 2nd would probably be close for JT purely as a rental.

but i think he stays in NY.

- Tumbleweed


No chance Tavares gets dealt as rental. Not in his interest or in the interest of the team acquiring him. My guess is if Tavares is moved we will see a 92m 8 year deal put in place before the deal is finalized.
BetterCallSaul
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Liljegren?
Joined: 05.07.2013

Aug 18 @ 4:23 PM ET
I'll remember this next time you try and use espn rankings
- Feeling Glucky?

Or when the Leafs prospect pool is listed higher than Ottawa's. Which they were. Until last year. When four rookies made an impact at the NHL level.
Tumbleweed
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: everyday i see my dream
Joined: 03.14.2014

Aug 18 @ 4:23 PM ET
No chance Tavares gets dealt as rental. Not in his interest or in the interest of the team acquiring him. My guess is if Tavares is moved we will see a 92m 8 year deal put in place before the deal is finalized.
- spatso


white, ceci, chaplik, a 1st and a 2nd is a pretty minimal price to pay for a rental of JT's quality.

really, the only thing of decent value the sens would be giving up is the 1st. everything else is junk.

though no chance JT would re-up with the sens.
spatso
Ottawa Senators
Location: jensen beach, FL
Joined: 02.19.2007

Aug 18 @ 4:26 PM ET
craig button's 1st round pick history:

2000 - Brent Krahn #9 Goalie never played a game in the NHL
2001 - Chuck Kobasew #14 RW 210 points in 601 games
2002 - Eric Nystrom #10 LW, 123 points in 593 games (and he's a -73 for his career)

That's a steaming pile by any stretch for 3 first rounders.

The guy has less credibilty than Howard Berger.

thanks @ winsix

lol @ spatso

- Tumbleweed


That is silly. Every predraft evaluation is going to miss on some including first rounders. A much more valid question has to do with how well a team has done with the picks they have had. Look at drafts 3,4 and 5 years after the draft and that will give you a better evaluation on a team's drafting.
Tumbleweed
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: everyday i see my dream
Joined: 03.14.2014

Aug 18 @ 4:29 PM ET
That is silly. Every predraft evaluation is going to miss on some including first rounders. A much more valid question has to do with how well a team has done with the picks they have had. Look at drafts 3,4 and 5 years after the draft and that will give you a better evaluation on a team's drafting.
- spatso


that is button's actual nhl draft record as gm, you donkey.



Tumbleweed
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: everyday i see my dream
Joined: 03.14.2014

Aug 18 @ 6:28 PM ET
So the guy who couldn’t draft worth sh!t is now that guy that is the best at ranking prospects.

Lolololomg

thanks for the laughs spazzo.





burn
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Boyle > Marleau :dopes, ON
Joined: 08.02.2006

Aug 18 @ 8:21 PM ET
No

lol

- senstroll



spatso
Ottawa Senators
Location: jensen beach, FL
Joined: 02.19.2007

Aug 18 @ 8:44 PM ET
that is button's actual nhl draft record as gm, you donkey.




- Tumbleweed


don't care about button. saying you need to look at player performance 3 to 5 year post draft to fully evaluate talent choices.

I do like the TSN rankings of players over team rankings as I am not sure how teams drafting records have ever really meant very much. How many years did we watch Edmonton be ranked the top drafting team without it translating to anything on the ice. Same for Arizona
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