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Forums :: NHL Talk :: WHO is in a better situation: LEAFS or SENS?
Author Message
RogerRoeper
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Toronto, ON
Joined: 03.27.2007

Jul 19 @ 9:02 AM ET
Kessel is clearly A much better hockey player than Seguin. There's no debate.
Feeling Glucky?
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Tanktown, ON
Joined: 10.08.2008

Jul 19 @ 9:04 AM ET
I've clearly shown that you injected yourself into a conversation that did not include you, because you claimed something was wrong and super cyberstalker had to correct it.



And yet when asked, you can't explain what was "wrong" and just continue to deflect to cover up your shortcomings.

- Doppleganger

What was wrong was clearly stated. As usual, you just lack the cohones to admit you were mistaken about everything something
Feeling Glucky?
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Tanktown, ON
Joined: 10.08.2008

Jul 19 @ 9:05 AM ET
I don't think there is much left to debate. I have always liked the player but hated the trade. Do not believe Kessel is a Leaf for life. Does not fit into the Leaf centric sports madness of Southern Ontario. For similar reasons, I don't think he could fit in Philadelphia or Montreal.

He is much more suited to the country club or corporate atmosphere of Vancouver, Washington, Carolina, Detroit, LA or San Jose. I would not be surprised if the Leafs were to get an outstanding deal if they were to decide to deal him.

I would do Kessel to Dallas (Detroit Southwest) straight up for Seguin.

- spatso

of course, it makes it much easier for the Sens.
Doppleganger
Ottawa Senators
Location: Reality
Joined: 08.25.2006

Jul 19 @ 10:16 AM ET
What was wrong was clearly stated. As usual, you just lack the cohones to admit you were mistaken about everything something
- Feeling Glucky?



once again, when asked, you lack the cohones, and can't explain what was "wrong" and just continue to deflect to cover up your shortcomings.
Feeling Glucky?
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Tanktown, ON
Joined: 10.08.2008

Jul 19 @ 10:22 AM ET
once again, when asked, you lack the cohones, and can't explain what was "wrong" and just continue to deflect to cover up your shortcomings.
- Doppleganger

For someone who loves pulling up year-old comments, it's amazing how poor your memory/backreading skills are.

How about this?

1) Younger players who didn't immediatedly light up the league will have their numbers skewed by their early years, and a career PPG doesn't illustrate the level of competition the player is currently at..


2) if either of you had bothered to read the link, you'd see that Kessel, along with any other player that hasn't hit 500 points yet(think Hall, Stamkos, Eberle, Giroux, Tavares- all of whom anybody in their right mind would take over Spezza) is excluded from that list.

3) deal with those facts
Doppleganger
Ottawa Senators
Location: Reality
Joined: 08.25.2006

Jul 19 @ 10:36 AM ET
For someone who loves pulling up year-old comments, it's amazing how poor your memory/backreading skills are.
- Feeling Glucky?



So with Kessel's approximately .75 P/PG career average making him a "superstar" in somel leaf fans eye's.....................what was wrong in pointing out that Spezza's career average of 1.016 P/PG , and suggesting that if one player is a "superstar" then why not the other?

Please we all want to know what is wrong with these facts?
Feeling Glucky?
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Tanktown, ON
Joined: 10.08.2008

Jul 19 @ 10:47 AM ET
So with Kessel's approximately .79 P/PG career average making him a "superstar" in somel leaf fans eye's.....................what was wrong in pointing out that Spezza's career average of 1.016 P/PG , and suggesting that if one player is a "superstar" then why not the other?

Please we all want to know what is wrong with these facts?

- Doppleganger
'

It's like you can'tdon't even read what was posted...

citing a guy's stats after he's broken out, rather than letting his younger age stats hold him back isn't cherry picking either, it's taking a more accurate look at the player he currently is. Looking two seasons back is fairly common practice, to make sure you're not just looking at a lucky season, and aren't looking too far back at years that aren't relevant.


again, I wasn't arguing Kessel was a superstar. I was just pointing out how nauseatingly idiotic your argument was.

- Feeling Glucky?
Doppleganger
Ottawa Senators
Location: Reality
Joined: 08.25.2006

Jul 19 @ 2:36 PM ET
'

It's like you can'tdon't even read what was posted...

- Feeling Glucky?



When I compare Kessel's career stats with Spezza's career stats it's apples to apples, a fair comparison......................I guess you don't think so though.


The list quite clearly states >> Qualifying criterion: At least 500 career points

Current season NHL stats last updated: June 25, 2013


Perhaps I gave some of you leaf fans to much credit, thinking you'd read that.

Kessel career stats has him at around .75 P/PG..................and this somehow makes him a superstar in some leaf fans eyes.

- Doppleganger




It's like you don't even understand the English language.
Feeling Glucky?
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Tanktown, ON
Joined: 10.08.2008

Jul 19 @ 2:42 PM ET
When I compare Kessel's career stats with Spezza's career stats it's apples to apples, a fair comparison......................I guess you don't think so though.






It's like you don't even understand the English language.

- Doppleganger

No. But that's only because I can think logically.

PS. I like how you pretend that you knew that criterion was there, when your initial post makes it quite clear that you did not:

So despite the fact that Spezza is ranked 6th among active NHLers in P/PG
http://www.quanthockey.co...nts-per-game-leaders.html
Sidney Crosby.......................1.415
Alexander Ovechkin...............1.223
Evgeni Malkin........................1.223
Jaromír Jágr..........................1.214
Teemu Selänne.....................1.031
Jason Spezza.......................1.016


Your logic is that he (Spezza) is NOT a superstar............but Kessel, who is not even ranked in the top 50 among active NHLers in P/PG somehow is a superstar????

Is this is what you call "leaf fan logic"?

- Doppleganger


Doppleganger
Ottawa Senators
Location: Reality
Joined: 08.25.2006

Jul 19 @ 2:47 PM ET
No. But that's only because I can think logically.
- Feeling Glucky?



So instead of comparing Kessel's career stats to Spezza's career stats.....................you think it more logical to compare Kessel's cherry picked stats from the past two or three seasons, to Spezza's career stats??


And what would pass for a level playing field in your world?
Feeling Glucky?
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Tanktown, ON
Joined: 10.08.2008

Jul 19 @ 2:47 PM ET
So instead of comparing Kessel's career stats to Spezza's career stats.....................you think it more logical to compare Kessel's cherry picked stats from the past two or three seasons, to Spezza's career stats??


And what would pass for a level playing field in your world?

- Doppleganger

nope
nightmare3020
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Windsor Area, ON
Joined: 08.23.2006

Jul 19 @ 2:52 PM ET
you guys are obviously missing the most important stats

Wellwood was much more successful in Junior than spezza.. so hes a better player right now!
spezza http://www.hockeydb.com/i...ts/pdisplay.php?pid=42311

wellwood http://www.hockeydb.com/i...ts/pdisplay.php?pid=50104
Feeling Glucky?
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Tanktown, ON
Joined: 10.08.2008

Jul 19 @ 2:54 PM ET
you guys are obviously missing the most important stats

Wellwood was much more successful in Junior than spezza.. so hes a better player right now!
spezza http://www.hockeydb.com/i...ts/pdisplay.php?pid=42311

wellwood http://www.hockeydb.com/i...ts/pdisplay.php?pid=50104

- nightmare3020

senstroll
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Sens Suck, ON
Joined: 02.22.2008

Jul 19 @ 3:06 PM ET
So instead of comparing Kessel's career stats to Spezza's career stats.....................you think it more logical to compare Kessel's cherry picked stats from the past two or three seasons, to Spezza's career stats??


And what would pass for a level playing field in your world?

- Doppleganger



I covered that 2 pages ago.
I dont think its fair to compare 25 year old Kessel to 30 year old Spezza


here is the quote

Spezza has 4 pro seasons on Kessel, Lets compare in 4 years when Kessel plays his prime seasons also age 25-29


Doppleganger
Ottawa Senators
Location: Reality
Joined: 08.25.2006

Jul 26 @ 3:42 PM ET
The question is "WHO is in a better situation: LEAFS or SENS?"

So as of today I would suggest that Ottawa has the better Goal-tending duo.

I see the Forwards as pretty much even, although they each have different tools in their respective tool boxes.

I give a bit of an edge to Ottawa's defensive corp.


With the head coach being nominated for the Jack Adams two years in a row, and winning it once, I'll also dive a nod to Ottawa's coaching staff over toronto's.


But I still see both teams in the hunt for the bottom two playoff spots in the Conference. (I see five teams from the Atlantic Division making the playoffs)


senstroll
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Sens Suck, ON
Joined: 02.22.2008

Jul 29 @ 3:34 PM ET
The question is "WHO is in a better situation: LEAFS or SENS?"

So as of today I would suggest that Ottawa has the better Goal-tending duo.

I see the Forwards as pretty much even, although they each have different tools in their respective tool boxes.

I give a bit of an edge to Ottawa's defensive corp.


With the head coach being nominated for the Jack Adams two years in a row, and winning it once, I'll also dive a nod to Ottawa's coaching staff over toronto's.


But I still see both teams in the hunt for the bottom two playoff spots in the Conference. (I see five teams from the Atlantic Division making the playoffs)

- Doppleganger


False

Please reevaluate
daeth
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Drink full, and descend, ON
Joined: 09.15.2005

Jul 29 @ 3:38 PM ET
I put a healthy Ottawa above the Leafs for sure.
senstroll
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Sens Suck, ON
Joined: 02.22.2008

Jul 29 @ 3:50 PM ET
I put a healthy Ottawa above the Leafs for sure.
- daeth


Karlsson had his foot cut off..will never be the same
Doppleganger
Ottawa Senators
Location: Reality
Joined: 08.25.2006

Jul 29 @ 9:04 PM ET
I put a healthy Ottawa above the Leafs for sure.
- daeth


Not by much though. Both teams, if healthy, should end up fighting for the 4th<>6th spots in the division.
daeth
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Drink full, and descend, ON
Joined: 09.15.2005

Jul 29 @ 10:16 PM ET
Not by much though. Both teams, if healthy, should end up fighting for the 4th<>6th spots in the division.
- Doppleganger

I won't be surprised if Ottawa battles for the division this season. I don't think that's even a possibility for the Leafs. Ottawa impressed the hell out of me last year with their depth.
daeth
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Drink full, and descend, ON
Joined: 09.15.2005

Jul 29 @ 10:17 PM ET
Karlsson had his foot cut off..will never be the same
- senstroll

That would be a shame. I'm hoping he can be 100% again. Don't like seeing guys that are fun to watch leave their prime that early even if they're on a team I want to see lose.
Doppleganger
Ottawa Senators
Location: Reality
Joined: 08.25.2006

Jul 30 @ 4:18 PM ET
I won't be surprised if Ottawa battles for the division this season. I don't think that's even a possibility for the Leafs. Ottawa impressed the hell out of me last year with their depth.
- daeth


They gave up some of that depth with the Ryan deal, and they've lost their captain..........so I don't see them battling for the Division this season.
daeth
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Drink full, and descend, ON
Joined: 09.15.2005

Jul 30 @ 4:39 PM ET
I hope you're right.

RogerRoeper
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Toronto, ON
Joined: 03.27.2007

Jul 31 @ 9:17 AM ET
The biggest question about Ottawa is, can they possibly have as good goaltending as last season? It,s doubtful for me. .941 from Anderson. it can't be matched
Mr_Squeaks
Ottawa Senators
Location: Location: Location: Glitch in
Joined: 06.26.2006

Jul 31 @ 12:20 PM ET
The biggest question about Ottawa is, can they possibly have as good goaltending as last season? It,s doubtful for me. .941 from Anderson. it can't be matched
- RogerRoeper


Anderson, in a full season, tends to have down-periods that bring his stats back to earth. This season, already shortened, was shortened further by injury - he basically didn't have time to suck. I'd expect that .941 to drop, but at the same time my hope is that our overall team health and defensive quality will improve to compensate...
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