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Forums :: NHL Talk :: WHO is in a better situation: LEAFS or SENS?
Author Message
senstroll
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Sens Suck, ON
Joined: 02.22.2008

Nov 21 @ 11:52 AM ET
What are your thoughts on a budget team paying $1.4M for an AHL goalie this year and next?
- Tumbleweed



I dont get those moves at all.

Condon career 59 games .906
Hammond career 51 games .925

Now I dont think either is very good, basically replacement level.
Essentially the Sens paid a 5th to downgrade a goalie?

Is there any money saved in how it turned out? were the Sens hoping someone would claim Hammond on waivers to save them the money?

This feels like Dave Nonis level GM'ing
systemtool
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Real men always have to poo, ON
Joined: 09.12.2007

Nov 21 @ 12:21 PM ET
Been pretty silent around here lately.... Wonder why we haven't seen more pts% lately?
- burn



Silent.
Tumbleweed
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: everyday i see my dream
Joined: 03.14.2014

Nov 21 @ 12:51 PM ET
I dont get those moves at all.

Condon career 59 games .906
Hammond career 51 games .925

Now I dont think either is very good, basically replacement level.
Essentially the Sens paid a 5th to downgrade a goalie?

Is there any money saved in how it turned out? were the Sens hoping someone would claim Hammond on waivers to save them the money?

This feels like Dave Nonis level GM'ing

- senstroll


puemple claimed by nyr.

anytime you can give a former 1st rounder away for nothing, you got to make that move.
prock
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Bobby Ryan + 1st rounder for Clarkson, ON
Joined: 08.30.2007

Nov 21 @ 12:55 PM ET
puemple claimed by nyr.

anytime you can give a former 1st rounder away for nothing, you got to make that move.

- Tumbleweed



There is a long line of hyped up Sens prospects drafted reasonably high (first or second round) that have failed in the past 5 or 6 years. Noesen, Puempel, Prince, Lazar, Ceci, Andreas Englund. Next up, Chabot, White, Gagne, Chlapik.

Chabot and White are just as hyped up by Sens fans as Puempel and Prince were. I remember some idiot yapping about finding the good local boys like Prince (because he played for the 67s). Yup, real gem you found there.
senstroll
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Sens Suck, ON
Joined: 02.22.2008

Nov 21 @ 1:14 PM ET
puemple claimed by nyr.

anytime you can give a former 1st rounder away for nothing, you got to make that move.

- Tumbleweed



No Way!
Is that the last part of the great rebuild of 2011 for the sens 1sts?
Tumbleweed
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: everyday i see my dream
Joined: 03.14.2014

Nov 21 @ 1:31 PM ET
There is a long line of hyped up Sens prospects drafted reasonably high (first or second round) that have failed in the past 5 or 6 years. Noesen, Puempel, Prince, Lazar, Ceci, Andreas Englund. Next up, Chabot, White, Gagne, Chlapik.

Chabot and White are just as hyped up by Sens fans as Puempel and Prince were. I remember some idiot yapping about finding the good local boys like Prince (because he played for the 67s). Yup, real gem you found there.

- prock


senseless.

reality is going to hit them in December.
Tumbleweed
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: everyday i see my dream
Joined: 03.14.2014

Nov 21 @ 1:32 PM ET
No Way!
Is that the last part of the great rebuild of 2011 for the sens 1sts?

- senstroll




can't wait for them to hire nonis after they fire whoever their gm is now.
D0PPELGANGER
Ottawa Senators
Location: Ottawa, ON
Joined: 05.06.2015

Nov 21 @ 2:51 PM ET
What are your thoughts on a budget team paying $1.4M for an AHL goalie this year and next?
- Tumbleweed


What are your thoughts on a team, that is bound to run into mega cap issues in a few years, paying $1.2M for a winger on another teams, this year and the following four seasons?
D0PPELGANGER
Ottawa Senators
Location: Ottawa, ON
Joined: 05.06.2015

Nov 21 @ 2:54 PM ET
I dont get those moves at all.

Condon career 59 games .906
Hammond career 51 games .925

Now I dont think either is very good, basically replacement level.
Essentially the Sens paid a 5th to downgrade a goalie?

Is there any money saved in how it turned out? were the Sens hoping someone would claim Hammond on waivers to save them the money?

This feels like Dave Nonis level GM'ing

- senstroll




Are you forgetting the context, in which they acquired Condon? You're usually not that ignorant of the facts.

Do you need someone to remind you?
twiztedmike
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Typical short sighted Laffer not knowing what hockey and development is all about. -Nuck4U
Joined: 10.06.2007

Nov 21 @ 2:54 PM ET
What are your thoughts on a team, that is bound to run into mega cap issues in a few years, paying $1.2M for a winger on another teams, this year and the following four seasons?
- D0PPELGANGER

What are your thoughts on a team that is so poor that they can't afford to spend more than $10 million under the salary cap ?
D0PPELGANGER
Ottawa Senators
Location: Ottawa, ON
Joined: 05.06.2015

Nov 21 @ 2:55 PM ET


Silent.

- systemtool



http://lmgtfy.com/?q=NHL+winning+Percentage
D0PPELGANGER
Ottawa Senators
Location: Ottawa, ON
Joined: 05.06.2015

Nov 21 @ 3:00 PM ET
There is a long line of hyped up Sens prospects drafted reasonably high (first or second round) that have failed in the past 5 or 6 years. Noesen, Puempel, Prince, Lazar, Ceci, Andreas Englund. Next up, Chabot, White, Gagne, Chlapik.

Chabot and White are just as hyped up by Sens fans as Puempel and Prince were. I remember some idiot yapping about finding the good local boys like Prince (because he played for the 67s). Yup, real gem you found there.

- prock



Yes, I remember Spatso calling Prince "the steal of the draft" and I did disagree with him at the time.

Puempel was given a good shot at wining a spot last year, and this year under two different coaches, could not grab the brass ring.

twiztedmike
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Typical short sighted Laffer not knowing what hockey and development is all about. -Nuck4U
Joined: 10.06.2007

Nov 21 @ 3:02 PM ET
Yes, I remember Spatso calling Prince "the steal of the draft" and I did disagree with him at the time.

Puempel was given a good shot at wining a spot last year, and this year under two different coaches, could not grab the brass ring.

- D0PPELGANGER

poor little princess just wanted his Prince
Tumbleweed
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: everyday i see my dream
Joined: 03.14.2014

Nov 21 @ 3:09 PM ET
What are your thoughts on a team, that is bound to run into mega cap issues in a few years, paying $1.2M for a winger on another teams, this year and the following four seasons?
- D0PPELGANGER


I disliked that part of the kessel trade.

It’s part of the reason why I was ecstatic that we were able to dump dion on a team without retaining salary. I figured no one would be dumb enough to take dion at a 100% salary.
prock
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Bobby Ryan + 1st rounder for Clarkson, ON
Joined: 08.30.2007

Nov 21 @ 3:11 PM ET
I disliked that part of the kessel trade.

It’s part of the reason why I was ecstatic that we were able to dump dion on a team without retaining salary. I figured no one would be dumb enough to take dion at a 100% salary.

- Tumbleweed



with a second round pick in return too. F*&king amazing.
D0PPELGANGER
Ottawa Senators
Location: Ottawa, ON
Joined: 05.06.2015

Nov 21 @ 3:16 PM ET
No Way!
Is that the last part of the great rebuild of 2011 for the sens 1sts?

- senstroll


The re-build, it could be argued, was in two stages, with the draft of 2009, when they had nine picks, and the 2011 draft when they had ten picks.

Four of those picks are players now currently with the team, one was traded for (the pick for) Colin White, two were part of the Ryan trade, one was part of the Phaneuf trade and another was traded to Brassard.

So 19 picks, are now seven current roster players, and Colin White.


prock
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Bobby Ryan + 1st rounder for Clarkson, ON
Joined: 08.30.2007

Nov 21 @ 3:25 PM ET
The re-build, it could be argued, was in two stages, with the draft of 2009, when they had nine picks, and the 2011 draft when they had ten picks.

Four of those picks are players now currently with the team, one was traded for (the pick for) Colin White, two were part of the Ryan trade, one was part of the Phaneuf trade and another was traded to Brassard.

So 19 picks, are now seven current roster players, and Colin White.

- D0PPELGANGER


What are your thoughts on all that turning into a contending team?
D0PPELGANGER
Ottawa Senators
Location: Ottawa, ON
Joined: 05.06.2015

Nov 21 @ 3:25 PM ET
I disliked that part of the kessel trade.

It’s part of the reason why I was ecstatic that we were able to dump dion on a team without retaining salary. I figured no one would be dumb enough to take dion at a 100% salary.

- Tumbleweed



I figured no one would be dumb enough to take Cowen, Greening and Michalek.

The leafs are paying those three, plus Gleason & Laich (in addition to Kessel) a total of $18.23M this season.

Kessel gets paid another $4.8M in the future ......... that's just over $23 Million for players, that will not play for the leafs ............ ever.

That's
D0PPELGANGER
Ottawa Senators
Location: Ottawa, ON
Joined: 05.06.2015

Nov 21 @ 3:29 PM ET
What are your thoughts on all that turning into a contending team?
- prock


A contending team, is not in the near future, and those picks/prospects that you've already written off, have yet to develop, make the team and show that they can, or cannot play in the NHL.


the leafs also are years away from becoming a contending team, so maybe you should check you smugness and see if your current crop of rookies and your "starting goaltender" develop.
Tumbleweed
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: everyday i see my dream
Joined: 03.14.2014

Nov 21 @ 3:30 PM ET
I figured no one would be dumb enough to take Cowen, Greening and Michalek.

The leafs are paying those three, plus Gleason & Laich (in addition to Kessel) a total of $18.23M this season.

Kessel gets paid another $4.8M in the future ......... that's just over $23 Million for players, that will not play for the leafs ............ ever.

That's

- D0PPELGANGER


Agreed. The leafs leveraged their salary cap to buy assets to expedite the rebuild. Salary cap space they didn’t need during this year and last. Lacih, michalek etc. all came with picks/prospects.

In 5 years when the sens finally start a rebuild, you’ll look back and wish melynk could model his rebuild after the leafs.
senstroll
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Sens Suck, ON
Joined: 02.22.2008

Nov 21 @ 3:31 PM ET
The re-build, it could be argued, was in two stages, with the draft of 2009, when they had nine picks, and the 2011 draft when they had ten picks.

Four of those picks are players now currently with the team, one was traded for (the pick for) Colin White, two were part of the Ryan trade, one was part of the Phaneuf trade and another was traded to Brassard.

So 19 picks, are now seven current roster players, and Colin White.

- D0PPELGANGER



sure..argued by someone grasping at straws
prock
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Bobby Ryan + 1st rounder for Clarkson, ON
Joined: 08.30.2007

Nov 21 @ 3:34 PM ET
A contending team, is not in the near future, and those picks/prospects that you've already written off, have yet to develop, make the team and show that they can, or cannot play in the NHL.


the leafs also are years away from becoming a contending team, so maybe you should check you smugness and see if your current crop of rookies and your "starting goaltender" develop.

- D0PPELGANGER


There is no question what the Sens have "built" will never be a contender.

What do you think, the Leafs are 2-3 years out?

By my math, that makes the Sens about 8 to 10 years out, minimum. 2 years to clean house, 4 to 5 years to get to the same point as the Leafs have, in terms of gathering top youth, then another 2-3 according to you. Plus this year to tread water (if you can call being under water "treading").
twiztedmike
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Typical short sighted Laffer not knowing what hockey and development is all about. -Nuck4U
Joined: 10.06.2007

Nov 21 @ 3:38 PM ET
LEAVE d0pps ALONE PLEASE HE IS MY FRIEND
senstroll
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Sens Suck, ON
Joined: 02.22.2008

Nov 21 @ 3:44 PM ET
Are you forgetting the context, in which they acquired Condon? You're usually not that ignorant of the facts.

Do you need someone to remind you?

- D0PPELGANGER


nope I know what happened... a panic move by a team what has to win now
prock
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Bobby Ryan + 1st rounder for Clarkson, ON
Joined: 08.30.2007

Nov 21 @ 3:55 PM ET
nope I know what happened... a panic move by a team what has to win now
- senstroll



I'm not sure what he's getting at. That Anderson was out for personal reasons? I suppose they could have used their AHL guy.

I don't know though, Hammond was a fluke run for them. Condon has been better. Maybe he falls off the map just like Hammond.

I mean, I know what you're getting at, but given that they're not going to give up for the time being, they needed a goalie to plug a hole. Giving up a 5th to do so isn't a big deal.

They've done lots of stupid things, that are going to bite them in the ass in the future. But picking up Condon isn't really one of them.

If they ran out and picked up Ryan Miller or something, THAT would be a (frank) up of colossal proportions.
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