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Forums :: NHL Talk :: WHO is in a better situation: LEAFS or SENS?
Author Message
nightmare3020
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Windsor Area, ON
Joined: 08.23.2006

Nov 28 @ 1:09 PM ET
the thing is jordan, they wont trade the guys that will give them assets. They are happy living in the status quo
D4nY
Montreal Canadiens
Location: Canada
Joined: 08.11.2007

Nov 28 @ 3:14 PM ET
the thing is jordan, they wont trade the guys that will give them assets. They are happy living in the status quo
- nightmare3020

exaclty! they are where the leaf were 2-3 years ago, trying to convice themself that they can still be contender!
D4nY
Montreal Canadiens
Location: Canada
Joined: 08.11.2007

Nov 28 @ 3:22 PM ET

The present
Don't forget it wasn't that long ago they were an elite team.

- jordan456789
yeah they were an elite team but theres only 3 elites players left from that team
jordan456789
Joined: 10.27.2007

Nov 28 @ 3:31 PM ET
yeah they were an elite team but theres only 3 elites players left from that team
- D4nY


They have three elite but still have some other good players on the team. They are better than the leafs now and i would hope that if by the deadline they are out of it they would pull the trigger. They don't even have to go to a full rebuild. They can try to trade one or two to bring in some pieces they need or depth. I just think they have more valuable assets which means they would be in a better situation.
RogerRoeper
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Toronto, ON
Joined: 03.27.2007

Nov 28 @ 5:59 PM ET
BTW just to point out that "the last 12 months" as you put it, is a bit of a stretch..........they had the best start of any NHL club in history to the 30 point mark, at 15-2-0 last year at this time.
- Doppleganger



Yes, and that great start was over 12 months ago. I was just pointing out how awful they've been over the last year. This isn't simply a slump. The team is a mess.
RogerRoeper
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Toronto, ON
Joined: 03.27.2007

Nov 28 @ 6:01 PM ET
If Bryan Burke blows this team up more (Which is what he'll do) the Leafs have the inside track on the #1 pick next June, plus whatever they get for guys like Kaberle+Kubina. Things will be looking pretty good for the Leafs.

And yes, I do believe they will waive their NTC's this time.
Sp00nz
Location: Ottawa, ON
Joined: 08.29.2006

Nov 28 @ 6:06 PM ET
we all agree that they are 3 amazing players... but theres more to a team then 3 players
depth, prospects, coaching,

When it comes to top end talent ottawa wins hands down, but the rest of your team is friggin garbage. Its not being biased its being realistic

your not gonna trade anyone of substance to get a ton of prospects. You will stay status quo and rot in it

- nightmare3020


Being realistic eh?

I think you're right tho, its not like any other team in the league would want players like Fisher, Volchenkov, Phillips, Kuba, Kelly or Ruutu.

They dont have a single good propsect either. Lee, Karhlson, O'brian, Bass, Zubov and Elliot should all just retire.
Doppleganger
Ottawa Senators
Location: Reality
Joined: 08.25.2006

Nov 29 @ 12:03 AM ET
I seriously believed that with Bryan Murray replacing John Muckler as GM, that they would get back on track...but sadly for Sens fans, it hasn't happened. Siginig Martin Gerber as a starting goalie would not have been such a big mistake had they focused on strengthening their defense - since they failed in that regard, Gerber looks like the main problem in Ottawa,
- Discofunk


Uh, John Muckler was the GM of the Senators who signed Gerber in the summer of 2006.
Doppleganger
Ottawa Senators
Location: Reality
Joined: 08.25.2006

Nov 29 @ 12:05 AM ET
They have three elite but still have some other good players on the team. They are better than the leafs now and i would hope that if by the deadline they are out of it they would pull the trigger. They don't even have to go to a full rebuild. They can try to trade one or two to bring in some pieces they need or depth. I just think they have more valuable assets which means they would be in a better situation.
- jordan456789



How many "elite" players do the Habs have?
sniper12
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Canada, ON
Joined: 09.27.2006

Nov 29 @ 12:06 AM ET
How many "elite" players do the Habs have?
- Doppleganger


0 - lots that could be if they wanted too.....well markov is very good at what he does.
D4nY
Montreal Canadiens
Location: Canada
Joined: 08.11.2007

Nov 29 @ 1:00 PM ET
How many "elite" players do the Habs have?
- Doppleganger

based on last night game 0
Leafer_84
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Ottawa
Joined: 08.14.2007

Nov 29 @ 1:53 PM ET
How many "elite" players do the Habs have?
- Doppleganger


Maybe Markov. Maybe Price (eventually).

I think you're missing the point though: The reason that the habs are so successful is because they don't rely one one or two guys to carry the team they have incredible depth throughout their lineup. The Sens, on the other hand, rely on Heatley, Spezza and Alfie every game. If they have a night off the team loses. Period.

Having an elite player or two on your team isn't a bad thing...but when they are your team then you're in trouble. You're supposed to build a team around elite players not on them, which is exactly what the Sens have done (much like Tampa before them).

Joined: 12.31.1969

Nov 29 @ 2:16 PM ET
Uh, John Muckler was the GM of the Senators who signed Gerber in the summer of 2006.

- Doppleganger


I never said Murray signed Gerber...

I was just going over Ottawa's player management history over the past few years, and I figured people on this site would know who did what & when.
Sp00nz
Location: Ottawa, ON
Joined: 08.29.2006

Nov 29 @ 3:25 PM ET
Maybe Markov. Maybe Price (eventually).

I think you're missing the point though: The reason that the habs are so successful is because they don't rely one one or two guys to carry the team they have incredible depth throughout their lineup. The Sens, on the other hand, rely on Heatley, Spezza and Alfie every game. If they have a night off the team loses. Period.

Having an elite player or two on your team isn't a bad thing...but when they are your team then you're in trouble. You're supposed to build a team around elite players not on them, which is exactly what the Sens have done (much like Tampa before them).

- Leafer_84


Ottawa used to have depth, the salary cap saw to that.

It'll happen to the Habs too. One thing the cap does is ensure that a window for success is only open for a short time, unless management is flat out incredible.
Doppleganger
Ottawa Senators
Location: Reality
Joined: 08.25.2006

Nov 29 @ 11:46 PM ET
I never said Murray signed Gerber...

I was just going over Ottawa's player management history over the past few years, and I figured people on this site would know who did what & when.

- Discofunk


this is what you posted verbatim............. "I seriously believed that with Bryan Murray replacing John Muckler as GM, that they would get back on track...but sadly for Sens fans, it hasn't happened. Siginig Martin Gerber as a starting goalie would not have been such a big mistake"

I think you can see where someone would see that you pinned the Gerber signing on Murray.
Big T
Montreal Canadiens
Location: Please ref, please I am beggin, BC
Joined: 07.11.2006

Nov 29 @ 11:50 PM ET
Ottawa used to have depth, the salary cap saw to that.

It'll happen to the Habs too. One thing the cap does is ensure that a window for success is only open for a short time, unless management is flat out incredible.

- Sp00nz


The Salary Cap is what keeps the Sens in the NHL.

Joined: 12.31.1969

Nov 30 @ 2:48 AM ET
this is what you posted verbatim............. "I seriously believed that with Bryan Murray replacing John Muckler as GM, that they would get back on track...but sadly for Sens fans, it hasn't happened. Siginig Martin Gerber as a starting goalie would not have been such a big mistake"

I think you can see where someone would see that you pinned the Gerber signing on Murray.

- Doppleganger


I do. I suppose I should have been more specific.
Sp00nz
Location: Ottawa, ON
Joined: 08.29.2006

Nov 30 @ 7:14 AM ET
The Salary Cap is what keeps the Sens in the NHL.
- Big T


Having an owner with deep pockets and a desire to win keeps the Senators in the NHL.

Try thinking before you speak
kulemin13
St Louis Blues
Location: Richmond Hill, ON
Joined: 02.14.2008

Nov 30 @ 11:09 AM ET
Having an owner with deep pockets and a desire to win keeps the Senators in the NHL.

Try thinking before you speak

- Sp00nz


Try thinking before you TYPE
Doppleganger
Ottawa Senators
Location: Reality
Joined: 08.25.2006

Nov 30 @ 11:41 AM ET
Try thinking before you TYPE
- kulemin13

kulemin13
St Louis Blues
Location: Richmond Hill, ON
Joined: 02.14.2008

Nov 30 @ 12:48 PM ET

- Doppleganger


scotty
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Calgary, AB
Joined: 06.27.2006

Nov 30 @ 12:51 PM ET
Ottawa used to have depth, the salary cap saw to that.

It'll happen to the Habs too. One thing the cap does is ensure that a window for success is only open for a short time, unless management is flat out incredible.

- Sp00nz

The Sens window is about to close.
Big T
Montreal Canadiens
Location: Please ref, please I am beggin, BC
Joined: 07.11.2006

Nov 30 @ 1:39 PM ET
Having an owner with deep pockets and a desire to win keeps the Senators in the NHL.

Try thinking before you speak

- Sp00nz


The Cap has helped most of the teams not named the Rangers, Canadiens and Maple Leafs. Yes is makes it difficult to manage, but if these teams could spend to the limit, you would have lost Spezza, Heatley and Alfie long ago.
Sp00nz
Location: Ottawa, ON
Joined: 08.29.2006

Nov 30 @ 1:42 PM ET
The Cap has helped most of the teams not named the Rangers, Canadiens and Maple Leafs. Yes is makes it difficult to manage, but if these teams could spend to the limit, you would have lost Spezza, Heatley and Alfie long ago.
- Big T


You're mistaking Eugene Melnyk for Rod Bryden
Big T
Montreal Canadiens
Location: Please ref, please I am beggin, BC
Joined: 07.11.2006

Nov 30 @ 1:45 PM ET
You're mistaking Eugene Melnyk for Rod Bryden
- Sp00nz


Deep pockets can only hang on so long, once the financial losses pile up, the pockets get a little shallow.
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