Stamkos is also better than Giroux and Voracek.

Yes, it is revisionist history. Patrick not working out is simply bad luck. There were so many red flags that he was the #1 pick in many scouts eyes. Oh he fell so far, all the way to #2! It's not the facts, it's hyperbole. Based on the information at the time, it was a good choice. Don't tell me your not using the facts that are known now in this.
- MJL

He was the number 1 North American skater by NHL Central scouting, which also had Cale Makar at 9 and Nick Suzuki at 10 to give you an idea of how good NHL central scouting is. They also listed Hiro Heiskanen at the 4th best European skater. However Dallas picked Heiskanen at 3 and Colorado picked Makar at 4 so they obviously new better than central scouting did. In fact, if Patrick was not selected by the Flyers, he might have slipped all the way to 6, because it was clear Vancouver wanted Pettersson at 5. Yes it was bad luck Patrick did not work out, for the Flyers that is. So now its the punch line of a joke.

Their related. Next time we have a discussion on whether to sign a player, I'm going to go on ancestry.com and look at his family tree.
- MJL

But hey, why do you think all these Hughes brothers are being picked high in the draft, the name.

That's when pretty much every player is signed. When they have a year left. That is when a player is eligible to be re-signed.
So when Voracek was resigned, he was what 24 or 25? Coming off a season that he finished 5th in the league in scoring and racked up 59 assists, 3nd only to Backstrom with 60, that you thought it was a bad deal?
- MJL

Yes, I did.

Look at their picks in the past decade past the third round and they've hit on quite a few players--Killorn, Paquette, Palat, etc.
- KGBflyers10

They also knew in 2011 when they drafted Namestikov with their first round pick that they could get a future hall of Famer in Kucherov in the 2nd round with 58th pick. They figured they'd take the lesser player first.

They got lucky with those two players.

He was the number 1 North American skater by NHL Central scouting, which also had Cale Makar at 9 and Nick Suzuki at 10 to give you an idea of how good NHL central scouting is. They also listed Hiro Heiskanen at the 4th best European skater. However Dallas picked Heiskanen at 3 and Colorado picked Makar at 4 so they obviously new better than central scouting did. In fact, if Patrick was not selected by the Flyers, he might have slipped all the way to 6, because it was clear Vancouver wanted Pettersson at 5. Yes it was bad luck Patrick did not work out, for the Flyers that is. So now its the punch line of a joke.
- jd250

At least were on the same page now and you recognize it was bad luck. Scouting is never an exact science.

So if the Flyers had drafted Makar at #2, who would Colorado have taken at #4? If the Flyers had drafted Heiskanen at #2, who would Dallas have taken at #3?

But hey, why do you think all these Hughes brothers are being picked high in the draft, the name.
- jd250

They got picked high because they were a part of the NTDP.

Stamkos was not traded because you don't use a blanket, he's going to be 30 so you trade the player. You evaluate each player individually. Couturier is a top 2 way center that plays in all situations. He is a physical horse who makes everyone he plays with better.
- MJL

Stamkos was not traded because he is a superior goal scorer and was evaluated as such.

He also has a similar contract as Giroux and Voracek while being a superior goal scorer so there is no need to move his cap hit.

They also knew in 2011 when they drafted Namestikov with their first round pick that they could get a future hall of Famer in Kucherov in the 2nd round with 58th pick. They figured they'd take the lesser player first.

They got lucky with those two players.
- MJL

Okay, next you're going to tell me the Flyers have had the better draft history in the past decade.

Stamkos was not traded because he is a superior goal scorer and was evaluated as such.

He also has a similar contract as Giroux and Voracek while being a superior goal scorer so there is no need to move his cap hit.
- Captain_Ahab

You're right. Stamkos was not traded because he was a very good player that they wanted to keep. This renders your Lecavalier point moot. They looked at each player individually and not with the blanket of he's going to be 30 so we better trade him. You look at all the variables involved and not just the generic variables you named.

Okay, next you're going to tell me the Flyers have had the better draft history in the past decade.
- KGBflyers10

You should wait with anticipation.

They also knew in 2011 when they drafted Namestikov with their first round pick that they could get a future hall of Famer in Kucherov in the 2nd round with 58th pick. They figured they'd take the lesser player first.

They got lucky with those two players.
- MJL

In the end, Tampa still drafted those two players. So, it's not really luck. Its called good scouting.

In the end, Tampa still drafted those two players. So, it's not really luck. Its called good scouting.
- KGBflyers10

It was complete luck that they turned out to be as good as they are. If TB had known that or thought that, they would've taken both players sooner in the draft. Absolute luck. When looking at the facts and who they took in earlier picks, players that didn't pan out, it tells you it's luck. Not superior scouting.

You're right. Stamkos was not traded because he was a very good player that they wanted to keep. This renders your Lecavalier point moot. They looked at each player individually and not with the blanket of he's going to be 30 so we better trade him. You look at all the variables involved and not just the generic variables you named.
- MJL

Lecavalier was evaluated individually.

Tampa Bay saw his decline at around age 29-30.

He was still scoring 22 -25 goals a season. But they knew he was aging.

This is why Tampa Bay bought out his contract at age 32-33. He wasn't worth the cap hit.

The variables I named were not generic. I pointed out his games played. His skating. His trade value is at its highest. Salary cap issues the FLyers are dealing with. The need to turn the roster over and change chemistry. They are not generic.

Lecavalier was evaluated individually.

Tampa Bay saw his decline at around age 29-30.

He was still scoring 22 -25 goals a season. But they knew he was aging.

This is why Tampa Bay bought out his contract at age 32-33. He wasn't worth the cap hit.

The variables I named were not generic. I pointed out his games played. His skating. His trade value is at its highest. Salary cap issues the FLyers are dealing with. The need to turn the roster over and change chemistry. They are not generic.
- Captain_Ahab

Now we're getting somewhere. They saw the decline. They may have known he had a back issue. Your reasoning is generic and is not about Couturier as an individual player. Is Couturier declining? You don't have to trade your top #1 center who is one of the best two centers in the league to turn over the roster. To change chemistry. More than any other player on the team, Couturier builds chemistry. He makes every player he plays with better.

He was the number 1 North American skater by NHL Central scouting, which also had Cale Makar at 9 and Nick Suzuki at 10 to give you an idea of how good NHL central scouting is. They also listed Hiro Heiskanen at the 4th best European skater. However Dallas picked Heiskanen at 3 and Colorado picked Makar at 4 so they obviously new better than central scouting did. In fact, if Patrick was not selected by the Flyers, he might have slipped all the way to 6, because it was clear Vancouver wanted Pettersson at 5. Yes it was bad luck Patrick did not work out, for the Flyers that is. So now its the punch line of a joke.
- jd250

NHL central scouting does a decent job of ranking players but it’s not a video game…. it’s up to the scouting departments and GM to get it right.
Some organizations do a better job then others at drafting. Obviously when one guy is up for the Norris trophy and the other is looking like a complete miss it’s easy to see when it’s only 4 years ago. I laugh when guys say it’s “revisionist history”….how else are draft picks supposed to be judged. Hextall has been portrayed as a ‘draft whisperer” by some but as we now see he perhaps has been over sold as this team really is a mess and a lot of it is the result of Hextall’s work. I’m just happy the Flyers moved on from him before he could continue to lead this club into further irrelevance.
That being said I’m not sold on Fletcher yet…but it’s pretty obvious he didn’t inherit all these amazing draft picks I kept hearing about…..
Some make it sound like the Flyers are the only team drafting guys that actually make the NHL…beleive it or not every team in the league has guys on their team that they drafted.

I'm not sure why this needs to be explained but apparently it does. You can look back at any pick in hindsight and rate the pick. Whether it turned out to be a good pick or a bad pick. Hell that's easy. However when looking at the pick and stating Hextall made a dumb pick and pick that had no justification for it, well that's revisionist history using the current fact that he hasn't worked that was unknown at the time. Pretty basic.
Hextall's drafting was strong. We'll see that in the coming seasons.

At least were on the same page now and you recognize it was bad luck. Scouting is never an exact science.

So if the Flyers had drafted Makar at #2, who would Colorado have taken at #4? If the Flyers had drafted Heiskanen at #2, who would Dallas have taken at #3?
- MJL

I don't know what would have happened. All I know is I don't think Hextall did his due diligence in this draft and now the Flyers are paying for it. I give Cam Neely credit for one thing, in a recent interview he said the team was not prepared properly in the 2015 draft and his franchise is paying for it. I wish Hextall would come out and admit the same thing, but I won't hold my breath. All pie in the sky now, but I can't help but turn my stomach when I see how good Makar is on Colorado.

NHL central scouting does a decent job of ranking players but it’s not a video game…. it’s up to the scouting departments and GM to get it right.
Some organizations do a better job then others at drafting. Obviously when one guy is up for the Norris trophy and the other is looking like a complete miss it’s easy to see when it’s only 4 years ago. I laugh when guys say it’s “revisionist history”….how else are draft picks supposed to be judged. Hextall has been portrayed as a ‘draft whisperer” by some but as we now see he perhaps has been over sold as this team really is a mess and a lot of it is the result of Hextall’s work. I’m just happy the Flyers moved on from him before he could continue to lead this club into further irrelevance.
That being said I’m not sold on Fletcher yet…but it’s pretty obvious he didn’t inherit all these amazing draft picks I kept hearing about…..
Some make it sound like the Flyers are the only team drafting guys that actually make the NHL…beleive it or not every team in the league has guys on their team that they drafted.
- landros 2

A lot of teams in the same period draft better players than the Flyers. That is always my only point, that Hextall was not as good as some make him to be. I am also not sold on Fletcher, this off season will tell me a lot of whether he is the right man for the job.

I don't know what would have happened. All I know is I don't think Hextall did his due diligence in this draft and now the Flyers are paying for it. I give Cam Neely credit for one thing, in a recent interview he said the team was not prepared properly in the 2015 draft and his franchise is paying for it. I wish Hextall would come out and admit the same thing, but I won't hold my breath. All pie in the sky now, but I can't help but turn my stomach when I see how good Makar is on Colorado.
- jd250

Not sure what the draft whisperer did or didn’t do….but I’m glad we don’t get to see him do it again for the Flyers….

I don't know what would have happened. All I know is I don't think Hextall did his due diligence in this draft and now the Flyers are paying for it. I give Cam Neely credit for one thing, in a recent interview he said the team was not prepared properly in the 2015 draft and his franchise is paying for it. I wish Hextall would come out and admit the same thing, but I won't hold my breath. All pie in the sky now, but I can't help but turn my stomach when I see how good Makar is on Colorado.
- jd250

In a previous post you said Patrick might have slipped all the way to 6th. Now it's you don't know what would have happened. There is no factual information that you can use to support that Hextall did not do his due diligence. Why would Hextall saying anything now do for the team? It wouldn't do squat. It was simple bad luck.

A lot of teams in the same period draft better players than the Flyers. That is always my only point, that Hextall was not as good as some make him to be. I am also not sold on Fletcher, this off season will tell me a lot of whether he is the right man for the job.
- jd250

Hextall cleared out the cap and set this team up with a bunch of highly talented players. It's really a shame that management panicked.

A lot of teams in the same period draft better players than the Flyers. That is always my only point, that Hextall was not as good as some make him to be. I am also not sold on Fletcher, this off season will tell me a lot of whether he is the right man for the job.
- jd250

Your correct. It’s takes a bit to be able to judge a teams draft….we now can see some of the misses or hits for Hextall. I keep watching Caufield look like a legit young sniper and wonder if the Flyers missed on him ….but I still think York could turn out to be a really good d man as well…time will tell. (For Fletchers draft)

Dumba 🤮
- Stayin alive

They could do a lot worse than Dumba.

But hey, why do you think all these Hughes brothers are being picked high in the draft, the name.
- jd250

How do you figure? Quinn's actually better than Jack. Who knows, Luke could be better than Jack too, lol.