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Forums :: Blog World :: Bill Meltzer: Quick Hits: Recchi, Selke, Silly Season Continues (Dumba), TIFH
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Bill Meltzer
Editor
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Joined: 07.13.2006

Jun 19 @ 10:56 AM ET
Bill Meltzer: Quick Hits: Recchi, Selke, Silly Season Continues (Dumba), TIFH
Stayin alive
Joined: 06.10.2021

Jun 19 @ 11:04 AM ET
Dumba 🤮
Stayin alive
Joined: 06.10.2021

Jun 19 @ 11:08 AM ET
Now that coots isn’t the reigning selke winner can we all agree to stop using that as the excuse to give him huge contract? While obviously a good player he is clearly at OR VERY CLOSE to his peak and turning that downward curve. He will get 8+ mil year contract. Can we please stop giving this contracts to 2nd tier good players and throwing our cap out of whack
Stayin alive
Joined: 06.10.2021

Jun 19 @ 11:13 AM ET
If we extend coots at surely 8+ mil year and don’t lose any big contract in Ed or trade in 2 years we will have
G 8+
Jake 8+
Jvr 7
Hayes 7
Coots 8+

About 40 mil basically half cap $ into very underperforming top line players AND extremely over paid 2nd liners 🤮🤮🤮
xShoot4WarAmpsx
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Hamilton, ON
Joined: 06.25.2010

Jun 19 @ 11:17 AM ET
If we extend coots at surely 8+ mil year and don’t lose any big contract in Ed or trade in 2 years we will have
G 8+
Jake 8+
Jvr 7
Hayes 7
Coots 8+

About 40 mil basically half cap $ into very underperforming top line players AND extremely over paid 2nd liners 🤮🤮🤮


Giroux is a UFA at the same time as Coots. JVR is UFA the year after that..... So no we wont have all that tied up because even if re-signed, G and JVR are not going to be making top $ anymore
Bill Meltzer
Editor
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Joined: 07.13.2006

Jun 19 @ 11:19 AM ET
Now that coots isn’t the reigning selke winner can we all agree to stop using that as the excuse to give him huge contract? While obviously a good player he is clearly at OR VERY CLOSE to his peak and turning that downward curve. He will get 8+ mil year contract. Can we please stop giving this contracts to 2nd tier good players and throwing our cap out of whack
- Stayin alive


By that line of thinking, the Bruins should have traded Patrice Bergeron in 2015 after he had a little dip at age 29. How has he worked out in his 30s?

There's no reason that Couturier can't have many fine seasons to come, and he is a very difficult player to replace.
Bob Habib
Philadelphia Flyers
Joined: 08.01.2020

Jun 19 @ 11:37 AM ET
Now that coots isn’t the reigning selke winner can we all agree to stop using that as the excuse to give him huge contract? While obviously a good player he is clearly at OR VERY CLOSE to his peak and turning that downward curve. He will get 8+ mil year contract. Can we please stop giving this contracts to 2nd tier good players and throwing our cap out of whack
- Stayin alive

LoL wut?
DrMidnite
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: False-Positive, Texas
Joined: 12.10.2010

Jun 19 @ 11:40 AM ET
What about signing & trading Coutourier and using the space created to sign Cale Makar?

MJL
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Candyland, PA
Joined: 09.20.2007

Jun 19 @ 11:41 AM ET
By that line of thinking, the Bruins should have traded Patrice Bergeron in 2015 after he had a little dip at age 29. How has he worked out in his 30s?

There's no reason that Couturier can't have many fine seasons to come, and he is a very difficult player to replace.

- bmeltzer


I agree, using the fact that he finished 15th to support that the Flyers should look to trade him doesn't make any sense whatsoever. That's way below the mason/dixon line of making sense. Re-signing Couturier is a no brainer. For the same reasons that you mention here that I have previously mentioned.
MJL
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Candyland, PA
Joined: 09.20.2007

Jun 19 @ 11:41 AM ET
What about signing & trading Coutourier and using the space created to sign Cale Makar?

We get Makar + whatever we get for Coutourier.

- DrMidnite


An offer sheet to Makar would not work.
Levit8
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Gilbert, AZ
Joined: 07.24.2015

Jun 19 @ 11:43 AM ET
What about signing & trading Coutourier and using the space created to sign Cale Makar?

We get Makar + whatever we get for Coutourier.

- DrMidnite


You're hilarious!
wcorvette
Season Ticket Holder
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Boynton Beach, FL
Joined: 10.03.2010

Jun 19 @ 12:01 PM ET
Now that coots isn’t the reigning selke winner can we all agree to stop using that as the excuse to give him huge contract? While obviously a good player he is clearly at OR VERY CLOSE to his peak and turning that downward curve. He will get 8+ mil year contract. Can we please stop giving this contracts to 2nd tier good players and throwing our cap out of whack
- Stayin alive


Lol

Let’s imagine coots between Marchand and pasta, how many more great seasons?
mr4tno
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: PA
Joined: 06.29.2017

Jun 19 @ 12:04 PM ET
Thank you! I have been touting this for over a year. Of course JVR and G will have expited except you know they are going to resign G at 6+, easy.
hello it's me 2050
Location: AR
Joined: 05.14.2021

Jun 19 @ 12:06 PM ET
By that line of thinking, the Bruins should have traded Patrice Bergeron in 2015 after he had a little dip at age 29. How has he worked out in his 30s?

There's no reason that Couturier can't have many fine seasons to come, and he is a very difficult player to replace.

- bmeltzer

Not talking about the Bruins however.

There are reasons why he cant have many fine seasons when he signed his new contract at 30 years old.

Where the flyers are as team contention wise help me understand why it would be better to sign him then trade him in your opinion.
Captain_Ahab
Philadelphia Flyers
Joined: 03.23.2017

Jun 19 @ 12:25 PM ET
There are a lot of reasons why resigning Couturier can be a negative.

Let me preface this by saying I'm leaning towards trading him to help turn this roster over. His value is the highest it will ever be. Yet, with him, the Flyers have missed the playoffs or lost in the 1st round 8 of the last 9 seasons.

And....since bill spoke about Recchi today.....who did the Flyers get for trading Recchi? And did that trade help the FLyers?.......trades can be great and necessary for a team to change chemistry and turn the roster over, which this team desperately needs and is exactly what the Recchi trade did for the Flyers.

He will turn 30 in the 1st year of his new contract. 30 is not old. But it is not young either.

Wayne Simmonds was 29 when he lost a step his last year as a Flyer.

Vincent Lecavelier was 33 his 1st year as a Flyer and he clearly had lost a step.

Couturier has a lot of miles on him. 10 years and 692 games played.

He has played 70 games or more in 5 of 10 years(This past season he played 45 of 56 games. That's a pace to put him in the 60's games played again)

He is not known for being a naturally quick or fast skater. Players like that may have difficulty in their 30's as they lose a step.

Flyers have salary cap issues involving younger players needing to be resigned and to bring in Vets to help out the defense.

Yes, Couturier can be good for another 5 years. He also may struggle in a year or two since everyone ages differently.

We have not been winning with him and this team needs to turn the roster over and change chemistry. My vote is to trade him.

Also, the Flyers got Recchi by trading away Rick Tocchet. A fan favorite and Captain of the FLyers.

Fortune favors the bold. Go for it!
Stayin alive
Joined: 06.10.2021

Jun 19 @ 12:40 PM ET
By that line of thinking, the Bruins should have traded Patrice Bergeron in 2015 after he had a little dip at age 29. How has he worked out in his 30s?

There's no reason that Couturier can't have many fine seasons to come, and he is a very difficult player to replace.

- bmeltzer

Apples and oranges. Bergy has two hall of famer wingers on his line. Had hall of fame dman. And a great goalie.
Stayin alive
Joined: 06.10.2021

Jun 19 @ 12:41 PM ET
Giroux is a UFA at the same time as Coots. JVR is UFA the year after that..... So no we wont have all that tied up because even if re-signed, G and JVR are not going to be making top $ anymore
- xShoot4WarAmpsx

G has 2 years left on contract. This is coots last year on current deal. So in 2 years g will be in last year of deal and coots starting new deal
Stayin alive
Joined: 06.10.2021

Jun 19 @ 12:42 PM ET
What about signing & trading Coutourier and using the space created to sign Cale Makar?
- DrMidnite

Lmao. I mean that’s a no brained. Probably no scenario it could happen but sure
Stayin alive
Joined: 06.10.2021

Jun 19 @ 12:43 PM ET
I agree, using the fact that he finished 15th to support that the Flyers should look to trade him doesn't make any sense whatsoever. That's way below the mason/dixon line of making sense. Re-signing Couturier is a no brainer. For the same reasons that you mention here that I have previously mentioned.
- MJL


No the reason to trade him is to not pay that contract. Middling team. They will never win with coots
Captain_Ahab
Philadelphia Flyers
Joined: 03.23.2017

Jun 19 @ 12:46 PM ET
G has 2 years left on contract. This is coots last year on current deal. So in 2 years g will be in last year of deal and coots starting new deal
- Stayin alive



Giroux has 1 year remaining with a $8.275 cap hit.

Next summer, most of that money could be spent to resign Farabee.

If Farabee hits the 20 goal mark again, he will be in a similar situation that Konecny was when entering RFA.

So expect Farabee to get a similar deal as Konecny which is a $5.5 cap hit.

Stayin alive
Joined: 06.10.2021

Jun 19 @ 12:50 PM ET
Lol

Let’s imagine coots between Marchand and pasta, how many more great seasons?

- wcorvette


Too bad we don’t have that talent. Let’s play devils advocate and put Bergy between the flavor of the week of flyers top line. Exactly…. People complain to change the core of team … yes that’s needed but that’s not gonna do much. You still need to add to the real core of team which should be the youth. Coots at 29 getting 7 years is just flat out dumb. For example say he gets his payday (which he will) it’ll be 7/56 probably a little more. He’ll be turning 30 when contract starts. So in 3-4 years when the current youth plus others still coming by time they hopefully good enough to contend you got a 33-34 year 8+ mil aging definitely downside of career hindered contract. You can easily sign a vet for a few years at less money to play that role.
Stayin alive
Joined: 06.10.2021

Jun 19 @ 12:51 PM ET
Not talking about the Bruins however.

There are reasons why he cant have many fine seasons when he signed his new contract at 30 years old.

Where the flyers are as team contention wise help me understand why it would be better to sign him then trade him in your opinion.

- hello it's me 2050


It’s not better. Other than to play status quo
Stayin alive
Joined: 06.10.2021

Jun 19 @ 12:57 PM ET
Giroux has 1 year remaining with a $8.275 cap hit.

Next summer, most of that money could be spent to resign Farabee.

If Farabee hits the 20 goal mark again, he will be in a similar situation that Konecny was when entering RFA.

So expect Farabee to get a similar deal as Konecny which is a $5.5 cap hit.

- Captain_Ahab


Even better if g going into last year… I thought he had 2. Time to wave bye ye to g. Turn this team over. Hey I love g as much as the next guy but it’s time. Idc if he would take league minimum. It’s time to put to bed the g era. It’s about the youth. There’s still a few really good prospects coming plus draft and who knows what. G Jake Jvr coots. The time has come. The only one with value is coots. Move him at draft. His value goes down everyday after the draft
Captain_Ahab
Philadelphia Flyers
Joined: 03.23.2017

Jun 19 @ 1:07 PM ET
Even better if g going into last year… I thought he had 2. Time to wave bye ye to g. Turn this team over. Hey I love g as much as the next guy but it’s time. Idc if he would take league minimum. It’s time to put to bed the g era. It’s about the youth. There’s still a few really good prospects coming plus draft and who knows what. G Jake Jvr coots. The time has come. The only one with value is coots. Move him at draft. His value goes down everyday after the draft
- Stayin alive



Agree.

The Flyers have reached the 2nd round only once in the last 9 years.

Giroux, Courturier, and Voracek have been here the entire 9 years.

It's time to move on. They are getting older. If they couldn't carry the team in their prime, then don't expect them to do so as older players.
Stayin alive
Joined: 06.10.2021

Jun 19 @ 1:52 PM ET
Agree.

The Flyers have reached the 2nd round only once in the last 9 years.

Giroux, Courturier, and Voracek have been here the entire 9 years.

It's time to move on. They are getting older. If they couldn't carry the team in their prime, then don't expect them to do so as older players.

- Captain_Ahab


It’s a new era. It’s a young mans game now. Players coming up earlier and hitting prime earlier. Prime years (except goalies generally) are between 24-28. I know the tools on hb will disagree and state players can excel beyond that age and not saying they can’t still be really good. From about 28-31/32 is more than likely the end of the curve of production where any real $ should be spent.

Look at Ov career stats for example his prime years the 3 highest points years. That was 10 years ago. He was 24-26. Yes he still great after but to show the point and obviously most aren’t on his level. People need to start thinking like the patriots did in football. Obviously Brady maybe greatest ever was the only exception but how many very good players they let go in supposed prime or ending prime? In a cap world it’s not about loyalty it’s about production in relation to cost. Sucks that it’s that way but it is what it is. What would we have gotten. For simmer at age 28? Instead of keeping him the couple extra years and getting nothing for him.
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