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Forums :: Blog World :: Ryan Wilson: Is there a plan to deal with Jim Rutherford's plans?
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Ryan Wilson
Pittsburgh Penguins
Location: Rochester, NY
Joined: 06.13.2013

Aug 12 @ 2:46 PM ET
Ryan Wilson: Is there a plan to deal with Jim Rutherford's plans? Is there a plan to deal with Jim Rutherford's plans?
dozerD10
Anaheim Ducks
Location: long beach, CA
Joined: 01.29.2014

Aug 12 @ 3:07 PM ET
Perhaps I'm off base here.

But the way I see it the only guys with the gravitas to tell JR where to go are Sid and Mario.

If one of those said our GM left us out to dry or didn't help us get over the hump I'd like to think he'd shut the hell up and get a little humble.
MacPatty
Pittsburgh Penguins
Joined: 05.21.2015

Aug 12 @ 3:58 PM ET
To the comments on getting younger, I think its more about giving prospects with potential a chance to break through rather than block them with guys who have reached their full potential at a 4th line level. Guys like Simon, ZAR, McCann, Blueger while still relatively young, are what they are now.

So do you block the development of your top prospects for a year to get bottom 6 play or do you free up those roster spots and give the young guns a chance?

I'd rather see guys like Hallinder, Poulin and Legare get an extended look and if they can't cut it pick up a rental at the deadline.
Dr Blob
Pittsburgh Penguins
Joined: 09.30.2018

Aug 12 @ 4:03 PM ET
Great write up. Couldn’t agree more that most of the Pens failings fall on JRs desk. No chance he gets humble; just not his makeup. Look at who he has brought in since the cup run. Look at who has been traded and the return. More losers than winners by a wide margin. Often wonder if there is a disconnect between JR and Mike Sullivan? Firing the coachs today may appease some people but still lots of work to do. I just question whether JR can get it done. Recent history suggests he is not up for the task at hand.
Murphy_Dump
Pittsburgh Penguins
Joined: 07.02.2014

Aug 12 @ 4:18 PM ET
In today's news, confused elderly man yells into clouds.
668710
Pittsburgh Penguins
Location: "Give him a chance" -Barnaby36, PA
Joined: 06.25.2011

Aug 12 @ 4:19 PM ET
Apparently we are keeping the pick, I heard from my cousin. Now I don't think that has anything to do with trading it though, just not giving it to the Wild.
abasin
Pittsburgh Penguins
Joined: 06.27.2018

Aug 12 @ 4:21 PM ET
RW condescending arrogance toward JR is unbearable. Him dismissing all of the good JR has done is disingenuous and the fact he won back-to-back cups makes his tenure wildly successful regardless of what happens in the coming years. Look at other teams in this era, Caps took 13 years with Ovi to get past the second round and win a cup, the Lightning have still yet to win a cup, Sharks failed year after year. While the Blackhawks and Kings won their cups, they both are already in the midst of rebuilds/retools, whereas the Pens have remained contenders almost every year...The team is a new bottom pairing and improved 3rd line away from being serious contenders again, which is not a bad spot to be in all things considered
Tojo.
Pittsburgh Penguins
Location: Aliquippa, PA
Joined: 11.11.2014

Aug 12 @ 4:26 PM ET
Not #15 straight up

We owe Minnesota a pick, we agree to give them #15 this year in a deal around Staal vs keeping #15 this year and giving the Wild #22-25 next year

Not saying #15 for Staal AND giving them a 1st next year

Guerin may be interested in getting the pick this year to get a jump on his rebuild

3C options are limited, especially in guys making 4 million or less

- TheGame316

Well, I think Staal is declining and won't put up near the point totals here as he did on Minnesota's top line and PP so I flat out don't want him. It was a good idea a couple years ago when people started suggesting it, but at 36 that time has passed.

15 overall this draft can get you a future top 6 center, or a speedy power forward, or possibly a RH sniper. These are all things we will need eventually. 20 something next year, you're hoping to get a Colby Armstrong or Brooks Orpik or Oli Maatta. That's the logic behind the Reaves deal that you'll get a similar prospect by dropping several spots. Have to do better than Staal to trade that pick.
pozone
Season Ticket Holder
Pittsburgh Penguins
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Joined: 05.20.2016

Aug 12 @ 4:26 PM ET
JR has won 2 cups with the Pens and one with Carolina. What have YOU ever done Buffalo Boy except be a JERK?
Tojo.
Pittsburgh Penguins
Location: Aliquippa, PA
Joined: 11.11.2014

Aug 12 @ 4:27 PM ET
non player predictions

Botterill is brought back
Laviolette hired as an assistant coach
Velluci promoted to some assistant GM position

- YouMeAndDupuis9

I was wondering if Velluci would be on the new coaching staff. But all those names make sense.
Tojo.
Pittsburgh Penguins
Location: Aliquippa, PA
Joined: 11.11.2014

Aug 12 @ 4:29 PM ET
I agree, that was the team that Tallon built. Which is part of the reason why I would like to see him as the Pens GM.
- Hockey66

Tallon has been really good at building teams up in rebuilds and really bad at fine tuning the roster to make a title run. So this isn't when I'd want him.
Hockey66
Pittsburgh Penguins
Joined: 07.05.2019

Aug 12 @ 4:33 PM ET
Tallon has been really good at building teams up in rebuilds and really bad at fine tuning the roster to make a title run. So this isn't when I'd want him.
- Tojo.

Fair point. I still want a new GM, even if it isn't Tallon.
Hockey66
Pittsburgh Penguins
Joined: 07.05.2019

Aug 12 @ 4:36 PM ET
On the one hand, GMing is hard. On the other hand, Sully and JJ absolutely, positively have to go, but JR won't make it happen.

Good write-up. Hard to argue with any of it. JR has made some good moves and every GM has his warts, but still... it's time for JR to go.
Tojo.
Pittsburgh Penguins
Location: Aliquippa, PA
Joined: 11.11.2014

Aug 12 @ 4:39 PM ET
See, now you're back to saying we're pretty much there with minor changes. Well, I disagree with that, but I agree with the rest. I'm not sold on Blueger as a 3C, at least not on a Cup team. I'd rather use the potential cap space to get a stud RW and a stud 3C. Try to overwhelm the opposition, not just eke by.
- Hockey66

I've never wavered. This team's talent level is such that they should be one of the top teams. They have 5 top 6 forwards, top 4 defense, an great shutdown line and starting goalie.

Better coaching. Better play from the core guys. Getting rid of the guys who drag the team down. I feel all 3 of those are more important than adding new talent.

Get me a forward to round out that top 6. Look for bargains late in free agency with the flat cap. Give guys lime POJ and Poulin a good chance to make the roster. Leave some tradable assets for the deadline in case you have an injury or Jarry sucks.

I give McCann another shot. Honestly feel McCann and Jarry had similar seasons. Both looked great in the first half, plummeted the 2nd, yet the confidence level in them is dramatically different. Plus goalies are voodoo.
OfManNotMachine
New Jersey Devils
Location: PA
Joined: 05.29.2020

Aug 12 @ 4:39 PM ET
I feel this GM does everything he possibly can to try and make this team worse, and so far he's doing a good job of that. I fully expect him to ruin this franchise this off season if he isn't fired before it's to late.
Tojo.
Pittsburgh Penguins
Location: Aliquippa, PA
Joined: 11.11.2014

Aug 12 @ 4:42 PM ET
Fair point. I still want a new GM, even if it isn't Tallon.
- Hockey66

I wouldn't have a problem with that. It's just why people don't want Tallon. If you're rebuilding, you should get him, then fire him when you start to get good.
Victoro311
Pittsburgh Penguins
Location: San Diego, CA
Joined: 06.17.2014

Aug 12 @ 4:49 PM ET
Apparently we are keeping the pick, I heard from my cousin. Now I don't think that has anything to do with trading it though, just not giving it to the Wild.
- 668710

Good.
abasin
Pittsburgh Penguins
Joined: 06.27.2018

Aug 12 @ 4:58 PM ET
I've never wavered. This team's talent level is such that they should be one of the top teams. They have 5 top 6 forwards, top 4 defense, an great shutdown line and starting goalie.

Better coaching. Better play from the core guys. Getting rid of the guys who drag the team down. I feel all 3 of those are more important than adding new talent.

Get me a forward to round out that top 6. Look for bargains late in free agency with the flat cap. Give guys lime POJ and Poulin a good chance to make the roster. Leave some tradable assets for the deadline in case you have an injury or Jarry sucks.

I give McCann another shot. Honestly feel McCann and Jarry had similar seasons. Both looked great in the first half, plummeted the 2nd, yet the confidence level in them is dramatically different. Plus goalies are voodoo.

- Tojo.


Exactly. This team is not that far away from being good, even this year, had Price not frustrated them early and zapped their confidence, I think they would've been fine. Felt reminiscent of 2013 vs Rask and they couldn't buy a goal when needed and everything spiraled out of control.
Hockey66
Pittsburgh Penguins
Joined: 07.05.2019

Aug 12 @ 5:01 PM ET
I've never wavered. This team's talent level is such that they should be one of the top teams. They have 5 top 6 forwards, top 4 defense, an great shutdown line and starting goalie.

Better coaching. Better play from the core guys. Getting rid of the guys who drag the team down. I feel all 3 of those are more important than adding new talent.

Get me a forward to round out that top 6. Look for bargains late in free agency with the flat cap. Give guys lime POJ and Poulin a good chance to make the roster. Leave some tradable assets for the deadline in case you have an injury or Jarry sucks.

I give McCann another shot. Honestly feel McCann and Jarry had similar seasons. Both looked great in the first half, plummeted the 2nd, yet the confidence level in them is dramatically different. Plus goalies are voodoo.

- Tojo.

Ok, I was thinking when you said:

"One more big trade doesn't change this team's fortunes if the best players aren't capable of elevating in the playoffs anymore."

"This last playoff was pretty jarring. I'm not going there yet, but next off-season Geno, Letang, and Rust have one year left. Dumo and Zucker to. That would be a good time to start getting value and rebuilding IF they have another 1st round like the last 2. Id they do, I think I'll admit the window is closed."

So I guess you qualified it by the performance of the best players - that makes sense.

I want to be more aggressive and try to overwhelm the opposition, futures be damned. You would rather get good, not necessarily great complementary players while dropping the dead weight which you think will suffice if the best players elevate their play for the playoffs, thus keeping some futures. We have different approaches and I think we're further off from the competition, but we both agree the dead weight has to be dropped or the whole endeavor is moot.
Victoro311
Pittsburgh Penguins
Location: San Diego, CA
Joined: 06.17.2014

Aug 12 @ 5:06 PM ET
I've never wavered. This team's talent level is such that they should be one of the top teams. They have 5 top 6 forwards, top 4 defense, an great shutdown line and starting goalie.

Better coaching. Better play from the core guys. Getting rid of the guys who drag the team down. I feel all 3 of those are more important than adding new talent.

Get me a forward to round out that top 6. Look for bargains late in free agency with the flat cap. Give guys lime POJ and Poulin a good chance to make the roster. Leave some tradable assets for the deadline in case you have an injury or Jarry sucks.

I give McCann another shot. Honestly feel McCann and Jarry had similar seasons. Both looked great in the first half, plummeted the 2nd, yet the confidence level in them is dramatically different. Plus goalies are voodoo.

- Tojo.

I do think we need a scoring 3rd line. I think it’s awesome that we have a legitimate shutdown 4th line that are actually capable of shutting down top lines, but that doesn’t replace the need for depth scoring. We’re not gonna win if we expect Crosby and Malkin to do all the scoring for us.

Now how do you address that? I don’t know. I think I am disposed to giving McCann another shot. I am definitely concerned he can’t do it, but there were also shades of Reilly Sheahan’s second year of not getting a good shake on wingers. There was a revolving door on his flanks and during the playoffs he had a corpse on his left and a specialist on his right. McCann simply isn’t good enough to handle Hornqvist and facilitate what Hornqvist needs at 5v5 to be successful. Factor in that Marleau can’t ply hockey anymore and forget about it. That wasn’t going to work.

If Poulin makes the team out of camp, McCann would have every opportunity to succeed with a versatile scorer like Poulin and and a secondary puck carrier like Simon on his flanks. The issue is, if McCann still can’t cut it, we’re in the middle of the season without a center. What the hell do we do?
Hockey66
Pittsburgh Penguins
Joined: 07.05.2019

Aug 12 @ 5:15 PM ET
I do think we need a scoring 3rd line. I think it’s awesome that we have a legitimate shutdown 4th line that are actually capable of shutting down top lines, but that doesn’t replace the need for depth scoring. We’re not gonna win if we expect Crosby and Malkin to do all the scoring for us.

Now how do you address that? I don’t know. I think I am disposed to giving McCann another shot. I am definitely concerned he can’t do it, but there were also shades of Reilly Sheahan’s second year of not getting a good shake on wingers. There was a revolving door on his flanks and during the playoffs he had a corpse on his left and a specialist on his right. McCann simply isn’t good enough to handle Hornqvist and facilitate what Hornqvist needs at 5v5 to be successful. Factor in that Marleau can’t ply hockey anymore and forget about it. That wasn’t going to work.

If Poulin makes the team out of camp, McCann would have every opportunity to succeed with a versatile scorer like Poulin and and a secondary puck carrier like Simon on his flanks. The issue is, if McCann still can’t cut it, we’re in the middle of the season without a center. What the hell do we do?

- Victoro311

Agree with this. I would look at Soderberg (or a similarly talented 3C) and move McCann to wing.

McCann - Soderberg - Horny

That line probably gets sh!t done.
123Kid
Pittsburgh Penguins
Location: PA
Joined: 07.03.2017

Aug 12 @ 5:27 PM ET
I feel like it is a tough off-season. In reality we have a great team where JR can sign our RFAs and fill most gaps. Our only true gaps as I have stated in the past would be our 3rd/4th line (depends on where you rank the bluegar line), and bottom pairing defender.

Which honestly resigning Rodrigues, McCann, Simon, and Lafferty allows for a jam of talent to fill roles on the 3rd/4th line. I assume Murray gets traded. I think they will put Simon with Crosby on the 1st line again. Which only leaves us with a FA talent or trade to fill the 3rd pairing D.

It all depends on JR's plans though. I assume trades will be made. He could potentially watch tape from the previous few years and trade a bunch of our guys out for under performing during the play offs and we could be looking at a whole new squad next year entirely. It should be an interesting off-season. I would assume JR, Toronto, and Edmonton will all be talking frequently since all 3 teams need a shake up to take it to the next level.
123Kid
Pittsburgh Penguins
Location: PA
Joined: 07.03.2017

Aug 12 @ 5:29 PM ET
Side note think of how different this team would be if the trade for Kessel went down with Minnesota (JJ and Kessel going for Zucker and Rask).
Tojo.
Pittsburgh Penguins
Location: Aliquippa, PA
Joined: 11.11.2014

Aug 12 @ 5:32 PM ET
I do think we need a scoring 3rd line. I think it’s awesome that we have a legitimate shutdown 4th line that are actually capable of shutting down top lines, but that doesn’t replace the need for depth scoring. We’re not gonna win if we expect Crosby and Malkin to do all the scoring for us.

Now how do you address that? I don’t know. I think I am disposed to giving McCann another shot. I am definitely concerned he can’t do it, but there were also shades of Reilly Sheahan’s second year of not getting a good shake on wingers. There was a revolving door on his flanks and during the playoffs he had a corpse on his left and a specialist on his right. McCann simply isn’t good enough to handle Hornqvist and facilitate what Hornqvist needs at 5v5 to be successful. Factor in that Marleau can’t ply hockey anymore and forget about it. That wasn’t going to work.

If Poulin makes the team out of camp, McCann would have every opportunity to succeed with a versatile scorer like Poulin and and a secondary puck carrier like Simon on his flanks. The issue is, if McCann still can’t cut it, we’re in the middle of the season without a center. What the hell do we do?

- Victoro311

That's how I address it actually. In a way we're stuck at wing because I think we still need to keep Hornqvist for the PP and I want to give Poulin a shot at that spot and think he has a better chance to have an impact than a UFA and would be cheaper too.

I use Simon as the placeholder and thought that was a good line earlier, though not as good as with Kahun. Could use Sheary instead for more offense if he'd come real cheap, I prefer Simon a little more but it's close.

Leaves center for McCann since I don't want him blocking Poulin. I can be talked into swapping him, but not for the guys I'm hearing suggested. He showed alot first half though so I'd kind of like to try it again.

Whether it's McCann, Jarry, an injury, etc, there's always the deadline provided we still have assets to trade. Also, you never know who will be available for a bargain since almost everyone has cap issues. I just don't see a need for a major add yet when a bounce back from McCann and Poulin might solve it internally.
Victoro311
Pittsburgh Penguins
Location: San Diego, CA
Joined: 06.17.2014

Aug 12 @ 5:42 PM ET
That's how I address it actually. In a way we're stuck at wing because I think we still need to keep Hornqvist for the PP and I want to give Poulin a shot at that spot and think he has a better chance to impact than a UFA and would be cheaper to.

I use Simon as the placeholder and thought that was a good line earlier, though not as good as with Kahun. Could use Sheary instead for more offense if he'd come real cheap, I prefer Simon a little more but it's close.

Leaves center for McCann since I don't want him blocking Poulin. I can be talked into swapping him, but not for the guys I'm hearing suggested. He showed alot first half though so I'd kind of like to try it again.

Whether it's McCann, Jarry, an injury, etc, there's always the deadline provided we still have assets to trade. Also, you never know who will be available for a bargain since almost everyone has cap issues. I just don't see a need for a major add yet when a bounce back from McCann and Poulin might solve it internally.

- Tojo.

I guess I also keep forgetting about Rodrigues as a natural C option, but I’m not at all thrilled about a guy who got press boxed in Buffalo filling in at 3C.

I agree that Hornqvist makes the PP so much better, but the 5 on 5 reality is that it’s tough to fit him in on this roster. Usually I’d say give him 12 minutes of ice time on the 4th line but we have a really specific 4th line that does a really specific thing, and Hornqvist can’t do that or go there. Third liners aren’t good enough to support his game at 5 on 5 and like I’ve already said, this year made it very apparent how important it is to have a functional third line that can score. So I think to keep Hornqvist we need to put him in the top 6. I don’t love the idea, but that’s really the only place for him. It’s tough to say good bye to the PP production, but do we capitalize on his productive year this year and try to extract value for him? Isn’t that the conversation we had when getting rid of Kessel?
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