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Forums :: Blog World :: Eklund: Quarantine, Day 26: The NHL's best #26:Wheeler or Dahlin? Buzz@3
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mjones242
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Pretentious Beer Snob, ON
Joined: 06.22.2015

Apr 7 @ 5:54 PM ET
Dahlin also gets less 5-on-5 ice time per game than Henri Jokiharju.
- BINGO!

6 seconds less.
mjones242
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Pretentious Beer Snob, ON
Joined: 06.22.2015

Apr 7 @ 5:55 PM ET
wait Rasmus Dahlin a top 5 defenseman in the NHL today?

hoooooold the (frank) up a minute here.

Kid is good and has a ton of potential, but right now I'm not convinced he's even the best defenseman from his own draft class.

- BINGO!

Well, that's certainly a hot take.

Edit: Forgot about Quinn Hughes. You may have a case there. But no one else is even close.
rmull905
Calgary Flames
Joined: 02.27.2007

Apr 7 @ 6:08 PM ET
Ek doesn't watch hockey.
- gergeswillems


Fixed for accuracy
rmull905
Calgary Flames
Joined: 02.27.2007

Apr 7 @ 6:25 PM ET
Well, that's certainly a hot take.

Edit: Forgot about Quinn Hughes. You may have a case there. But no one else is even close.

- mjones242


Everyone gets wrapped up on their counting stats, so yeah, those guys are far and away the best offensive producers out of that draft. As for best defenceman, Dobson and Boqvist may yet have something to say there.

Hell, Hughes with all the points he's put up is still a -10 with the 'Nucks, and Dahlin is a solid -7. Both guys have a long ways to go as far as proving themselves as capable defencemen that you can rely on in all situations in this league.

There are also guys in Jr that might make similar offensive impacts when they hit the NHL. Merkley, Smith, Bouchard, so the jury is still a long ways out on the best defenceman from the draft, offensively or defensively at this point.
Kooleus
Los Angeles Kings
Location: LA (home of King Alex), CA
Joined: 11.17.2018

Apr 7 @ 6:46 PM ET
Michael Stone is a UFA this summer. His agent should use this article as evidence to ask for Jeff Petry money. My client is a solid 2-way d-man that made the list ahead of Petry. So we'd like a raise from $700,000 to $5,500,000. This healthy scratch thing just means my client is well rested. And just because Petry's 40 points last season is more than Stone has generated in the last 4 years combined, well, that doesn't matter. He's a staple. Pay the man.

gergeswillems
Detroit Red Wings
Location: Malkin wants to be The Man, ON
Joined: 02.01.2016

Apr 7 @ 6:54 PM ET
Michael Stone is a UFA this summer. His agent should use this article as evidence to ask for Jeff Petry money. My client is a solid 2-way d-man that made the list ahead of Petry. So we'd like a raise from $700,000 to $5,500,000. This healthy scratch thing just means my client is well rested. And just because Petry's 40 points last season is more than Stone has generated in the last 4 years combined, well, that doesn't matter. He's a staple. Pay the man.
- Kooleus

I hate to point the Finger...

Komisaurus Rex
Edmonton Oilers
Location: Guhle is already the McJesus of defense , ON
Joined: 06.14.2009

Apr 7 @ 7:35 PM ET
Prayers up for Colby Cave and his family


gergeswillems
Detroit Red Wings
Location: Malkin wants to be The Man, ON
Joined: 02.01.2016

Apr 7 @ 7:42 PM ET
Prayers up for Colby Cave and his family
- Komisaurus Rex

I hope he pulls through. ☹️
Wetbandit1
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Unpopular opinion (i think): The best Die Hard movie is the 4th one- Live free or Die Hard -jdfitz7, NY
Joined: 10.07.2010

Apr 7 @ 8:05 PM ET
Eklund: Quarantine, Day 26: The NHL's best #26:Wheeler or Dahlin? Buzz@3
- Eklund


Right now, Wheeler. 3 years from now? Who knows?
homiedclown
Buffalo Sabres
Location: We want 1, FL
Joined: 02.24.2008

Apr 7 @ 10:30 PM ET
Dahlin also gets less 5-on-5 ice time per game than Henri Jokiharju.
- BINGO!

we have a soccer czar as our hockey coach though
Mahewman
Season Ticket Holder
Boston Bruins
Location: NH
Joined: 07.01.2009

Apr 8 @ 8:13 AM ET
It is Wheeler. Very easily right now.
mjones242
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Pretentious Beer Snob, ON
Joined: 06.22.2015

Apr 8 @ 8:42 AM ET
Everyone gets wrapped up on their counting stats, so yeah, those guys are far and away the best offensive producers out of that draft. As for best defenceman, Dobson and Boqvist may yet have something to say there.

Hell, Hughes with all the points he's put up is still a -10 with the 'Nucks, and Dahlin is a solid -7. Both guys have a long ways to go as far as proving themselves as capable defencemen that you can rely on in all situations in this league.

There are also guys in Jr that might make similar offensive impacts when they hit the NHL. Merkley, Smith, Bouchard, so the jury is still a long ways out on the best defenceman from the draft, offensively or defensively at this point.

- rmull905

+/- is a terrible, terrible stat to bring into a serious debate about hockey players.
rmull905
Calgary Flames
Joined: 02.27.2007

Apr 8 @ 10:15 AM ET
+/- is a terrible, terrible stat to bring into a serious debate about hockey players.
- mjones242


Sure, I agree that +- isn't a great stat. But when you factor that into everything else, it might sum up their play in the most real way:

Both guys, Dahlin (66%) and Hughes (58%) have zone starts skewed towards the offensive end of the rink. Smart coaches. They are offense first guys, their coaches know it and play these guys to their strengths.

Both guys Dahlin (58) and Hughes (53) have Corsi's that appear favorable. Corsi is a flawed stat in its own right though and should be weighted based on zone starts.

So yeah, +/- isn't great, but when you consider that these guys have a weighting of zone starts skewed so heavily towards the other end of the rink, I'd be pretty worried about those +/- stats.
Tonybere
New York Rangers
Location: ON
Joined: 02.04.2016

Apr 8 @ 10:27 AM ET
MUCH better.
Propp for sure

- Hesh_


Yeah, Propp was awesome and on the list of best #26's. But, even as a Rangers fan I would put Elias in second behind papa Stasny. The guy was quietly as consistent and effective as anyone you could name for the vast majority of his career.
sbroads24
Buffalo Sabres
Location: We are in 30th place. It's 2017 , NY
Joined: 02.12.2012

Apr 8 @ 12:00 PM ET
Dahlin also gets less 5-on-5 ice time per game than Henri Jokiharju.
- BINGO!

Well you should definitely make something that is totally out of his control a knock against him.
BINGO!
Carolina Hurricanes
Location: I'll always remember the last words my grandfather ever told me. He said, "A Truck!", SK
Joined: 09.21.2009

Apr 8 @ 12:25 PM ET
Well you should definitely make something that is totally out of his control a knock against him.
- sbroads24


okay i will
mjones242
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Pretentious Beer Snob, ON
Joined: 06.22.2015

Apr 8 @ 6:43 PM ET
Sure, I agree that +- isn't a great stat. But when you factor that into everything else, it might sum up their play in the most real way:

Both guys, Dahlin (66%) and Hughes (58%) have zone starts skewed towards the offensive end of the rink. Smart coaches. They are offense first guys, their coaches know it and play these guys to their strengths.

Both guys Dahlin (58) and Hughes (53) have Corsi's that appear favorable. Corsi is a flawed stat in its own right though and should be weighted based on zone starts.

So yeah, +/- isn't great, but when you consider that these guys have a weighting of zone starts skewed so heavily towards the other end of the rink, I'd be pretty worried about those +/- stats.

- rmull905

+/- is not a worthy complementary stat in any estimation. Please stop.

If you can present a case how Dahlin and Hughes aren't the best defenceman of their class I'm all ears. Trying to predict the future is as pointless an exercise as denying current, objective facts because the future is still unwritten.

The only thing that matters, right now, is how these players are playing... right now.
mjones242
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Pretentious Beer Snob, ON
Joined: 06.22.2015

Apr 8 @ 6:43 PM ET
okay i will
- BINGO!

6 seconds difference between both players 5v5. You didn't make much of it, did you?
rmull905
Calgary Flames
Joined: 02.27.2007

Apr 9 @ 12:39 PM ET
+/- is not a worthy complementary stat in any estimation. Please stop.

If you can present a case how Dahlin and Hughes aren't the best defenceman of their class I'm all ears. Trying to predict the future is as pointless an exercise as denying current, objective facts because the future is still unwritten.

The only thing that matters, right now, is how these players are playing... right now.

- mjones242


They still aren't great defencemen (yet), no matter whether you use +/-, Corsi or any other stat. They are gifted offensive players who are provided cherry-picked zone starts and despite that, 5v5, are still on the ice for more goals against than for. That isn't good - whether you like +/- or not. That isn't good.

So I will grant you this, they are the best out of their drafts, but only because there is no one else to compare them to. And ignoring all the stats which point to their less than stellar defensive play is almost worse than your desire to compare them to literally 0 other players.

You might as well just anoint Heinola the best defenceman in the 2019 draft - because, you know, he played 5 games more than any other defenceman and put up 5 more points than any other defenceman out of that draft class. And Dach is clearly better than Hughes.
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