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Forums :: Blog World :: Tyler Cameron: Up and down we go
Author Message
scottak
Location: I am serious. And don't call me Shirley!
Joined: 08.06.2010

Jan 10 @ 3:48 PM ET
Murray, Lehner will be coveted. As will Holtby.

Those are your top 3.....Crawford with his age, and concussion issues.....he's not 2....not a chance in hell.

- SteveRain

List from Hockey’s Cap, in order from highest current CAP hit.
mohel
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: IL
Joined: 02.08.2013

Jan 10 @ 3:52 PM ET
Fact they signed Lehner tells me that they still haven't accepted they are rebuilding. Otherwise those kids would have backed up CC, and they would deal CC at the deadline.

This franchise is stuck in the middle....maybe you get some reinforcements on the back end but where are they playing? You have Seabrook ,DeHaan, Murphy Keith all taking 4 spots until the 2022-23 season and Boqvist gets the 5th.....so what? WE have
Mitchell and Beaudin arm wrestle for the 6th spot?

Could be exactly why MItchell hasn't signed yet....doesn't take a rocket sciencetist to see they have a log jam at D still.

- SteveRain


Largely agree. I suspect (conjecture, some may call it) that they know they have to rebuild, but are under orders to make it look competitive each year to keep fans coming. So, you get the CDH and Maata trades, which aren't long term AND too expensive to trade. And they had the cap space for Lehner on a one year deal.
gifman
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Gifland
Joined: 09.17.2015

Jan 10 @ 3:57 PM ET

I am going to disagree with the assessment that it is SB and JC fault for the way the team is playing.

All I need to do is point to Tampa and they started the same way the Blackhawks did. They changed philosophies, they had no offense but they were FORCED to ride out the storm and learn the new system. The front office kept their nose out of it because everyone is on the same page. They didn’t want a repeat of last season, where they should have won the Stanley cup but instead failed miserably.

The disfunction junction for the Blackhawks is the front office. It’s very apparent the team’s chaos is a symbol of the chaos in the front office. One person wants a playoff team and another wants something else.

The blame falls squarely on Rocky Wirtz. You need a cohesive unit from top to bottom. You need a direction and that starts by having a hockey guy as president and not a marketing guy. If you are more worried about marketing campaigns instead of hockey philosophy you get what we have on the ice.

If you make changes, the changes start there. A new president of hockey operations.

tazer_and_diet
Chicago Blackhawks
Joined: 10.29.2012

Jan 10 @ 3:58 PM ET
In the immortal words of soon-to-be Hall of Famer The Hawkaroo, "he gone".
- mohel


Agreed. Paying $10 million for a goalie is stupid (I'd argue paying $10 million for any player is stupid in today's NHL, but for a goalie it's especially dumb). If he won't sign an extension, it's time for Stan to start looking for trade partners.
SteveRain
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Connor Murphy Sucks, IL
Joined: 05.07.2010

Jan 10 @ 4:00 PM ET
Largely agree. I suspect (conjecture, some may call it) that they know they have to rebuild, but are under orders to make it look competitive each year to keep fans coming. So, you get the CDH and Maata trades, which aren't long term AND too expensive to trade. And they had the cap space for Lehner on a one year deal.
- mohel


Eh....it doesn't solve the problem starting next year.....you have 4 veterans/boqvist and until its said otherwise nobody can assume 7 is DONE.

If they aren't signing 40, and they better not sign 50, trade them both next month. Same goes for maata, Smith, Saad....all 3 don't have a purpose for their cap hit and ensuing future cap hit (see saad) on a non playoff team, which they will be again.....next year. All they are doing is taking ice time for younger guys.

Blow it up. Play the kids. Get as many picks and younger Fs as you can and go to town.
Devilish4
New Jersey Devils
Joined: 06.21.2019

Jan 10 @ 4:02 PM ET
Here's a link to the NCAA top 20 ranking and other articles regarding college hockey.

I don't follow closely but I would assume each of the top programs have some NHL prospects.

https://www.ncaa.com/rank...icehockey-men/d1/uschocom

- boilermaker100

Thanks im going to check this out
SteveRain
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Connor Murphy Sucks, IL
Joined: 05.07.2010

Jan 10 @ 4:04 PM ET
I am going to disagree with the assessment that it is SB and JC fault for the way the team is playing.

All I need to do is point to Tampa and they started the same way the Blackhawks did. They changed philosophies, they had no offense but they were FORCED to ride out the storm and learn the new system. The front office kept their nose out of it because everyone is on the same page. They didn’t want a repeat of last season, where they should have won the Stanley cup but instead failed miserably.

The disfunction junction for the Blackhawks is the front office. It’s very apparent the team’s chaos is a symbol of the chaos in the front office. One person wants a playoff team and another wants something else.

The blame falls squarely on Rocky Wirtz. You need a cohesive unit from top to bottom. You need a direction and that starts by having a hockey guy as president and not a marketing guy. If you are more worried about marketing campaigns instead of hockey philosophy you get what we have on the ice.

If you make changes, the changes start there. A new president of hockey operations.

- gifman


Last night was rock bottom for me....a team off a firing coach, Rinne said they were mentally fragile, blood in the water....and the hawks show up flat....again.

per usual, they wake up mid part of the game, make it interesting, only to lose again.....and this time in spectacular fashion giving up a ENG to a damn goalie. On home ice.

I feel bad for anyone who went to that game and spent money to see that.

This organization is a damn lucky they aren't in a beloved hockey market with heavy media pressure....instead those suits can hide away and use spin to clami how they are still in "the race" which is hilarious, and yes....I know Bowman isn't going to come out and admit they suck and their season is over.....but show me a media member grilling this team....
SteveRain
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Connor Murphy Sucks, IL
Joined: 05.07.2010

Jan 10 @ 4:06 PM ET
List from Hockey’s Cap, in order from highest current CAP hit.
- scottak


makes sense....

#BlowItUP
Chunk
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Why did I move back here again?, IL
Joined: 11.06.2015

Jan 10 @ 4:08 PM ET
Woof.....what a crap show.

They had a nice 4 game homestand, all winnable games, and so far they are 1-2...and each game they have been down, and 2 of the 3 they have dug themselves a 2 goal hole. Signs of a bad team.

They are 19-20-6....can we stop thinking they are making the playoffs? It's not happening. Cue Jim Mora. THey need 46 points in their last 37 games and that's assuming 90 will be the number to get a wild card spot. Usually it's more. That's a 1.24 points per game pace and they have been on a plateau of 0.98 for some time. So how do you dreamers think that's magically happening? This isn't just a 5, 10, or even 20 game sample size....Nope....this is a nice 45 game sample size and the Hawks are who they are. A mediocre/bad team who teases in spurts but fails miserably at consistently playing at the level that gets them to the postseason.

The return of Saad and strome isn't saving them. Sorry.....Hopefully, Bowman is having talks with other GMs about moving pieces and accumulating what he can. Who cares what I think are"keepers" or anyone else thinks. Nobody here is a GM or in hockey operations so it doesn't matter.

Play the kids. Time for JC to ride his young guys and deal with their mistakes because the veterans are making just as many.

Sikura, Nylander, Highmore, Gilbert all should be playing night in and night out the remainder of the year. See what you have. Hope they can find a consistent game at the pro level.

Saw the quote on Lehner....who can blame him? Hes going to get at least 8 million. So anyone thinking less, not happening. We can debate all day if he's worth 8 and how Crawford deserves to be given the chance to finish his career here but who gives a poop? Crawford is aging and looking worse and worse each time out. It happens. Hell, trade them both at the deadline....

To me its simple....this band aid approach, half ass way of slapping crap veterans around this aging core hasn't worked now for 3 years and we can make fun of LA or other teams, but this team/franchise h hasn't won a playoff game since 2016, hasn't been to the show in 3 years and still hasn't picked a lane.

Rebuild? patch and go? what is THIS?

Ahh....but yes....I digress.....we need to look back at the previous decade and marvel at our championships silly me.

They got waxed by a fragile team, at home, in a game they HAD to have and all the players do is talk big....and then lose.....and then talk big again.

- SteveRain


Outside of a few, I don't think anyone here really thinks this is a playoff team this year.

I wouldn't mind signing Lehner as long as it is 4 years max. If he can get more on the open market, let him.

I've mentioned it before, but this team already is rebuilding. The problem is that they are trying to save face and do it while still being competitive which is just slowing down the process. I still don't understand the point in trading for both Maatta and de Haan. Getting one of them would have been fine to try and get them through. Ultimately, everyone is just frustrated at the effort being displayed every night. If there really is urgency to get to the playoffs this year, then play like it. Don't stand around and watch as the puck just passes you by.
SteveRain
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Connor Murphy Sucks, IL
Joined: 05.07.2010

Jan 10 @ 4:14 PM ET
Outside of a few, I don't think anyone here really thinks this is a playoff team this year.

I wouldn't mind signing Lehner as long as it is 4 years max. If he can get more on the open market, let him.

I've mentioned it before, but this team already is rebuilding. The problem is that they are trying to save face and do it while still being competitive which is just slowing down the process. I still don't understand the point in trading for both Maatta and de Haan. Getting one of them would have been fine to try and get them through. Ultimately, everyone is just frustrated at the effort being displayed every night. If there really is urgency to get to the playoffs this year, then play like it. Don't stand around and watch as the puck just passes you by.

- Chunk


its almost like they are catering to a very small % of their fan base while pissing off everyone else who has a brain. that's the issue.

Agreed.....and by acquiring Dehaan they have 4 veterans and now boqvist so 5 slots entering 2020-21....if they extend Gus, then Bowman should be launched into the sun with Mohel pushing the button on catapult.
mohel
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: IL
Joined: 02.08.2013

Jan 10 @ 4:15 PM ET
Eh....it doesn't solve the problem starting next year.....you have 4 veterans/boqvist and until its said otherwise nobody can assume 7 is DONE.

If they aren't signing 40, and they better not sign 50, trade them both next month. Same goes for maata, Smith, Saad....all 3 don't have a purpose for their cap hit and ensuing future cap hit (see saad) on a non playoff team, which they will be again.....next year. All they are doing is taking ice time for younger guys.

Blow it up. Play the kids. Get as many picks and younger Fs as you can and go to town.

- SteveRain


Not trying to convince you it's the right way to go. Just my take - conjecture - on what they're doing.
Scott1977
Season Ticket Holder
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Yorkville, IL
Joined: 08.30.2012

Jan 10 @ 4:17 PM ET
Sharp's age 21 season he played 3 games with no points. Age 22 season was 41 games with seven points. Age 23 season was 72 games, 31 points. Age 24 season was 80 games, 35 points. Age 25 season was 80 games with 62 points.

Not saying Nylander will be Sharp, but wetting the bed because a 21 year old is not producing is risky.

- mohel

The kid only 21 and buffalo screw up his development and he is starting over on a sense. The tools are their the question is does he want to become a regular top 6 forward in the nhl for years to come or not. Its up to nylander to figure it out. Lets see next year how he does after having adversity this year. I would not move him.
mohel
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: IL
Joined: 02.08.2013

Jan 10 @ 4:19 PM ET
its almost like they are catering to a very small % of their fan base while pissing off everyone else who has a brain. that's the issue.

Agreed.....and by acquiring Dehaan they have 4 veterans and now boqvist so 5 slots entering 2020-21....if they extend Gus, then Bowman should be launched into the sun with Mohel pushing the button on catapult.

- SteveRain


If they re-sign Gus, I'll be pissed. CDH, Maata, etc., can all be easily moved if/when a kid pushes them out. Not an issue.
SteveRain
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Connor Murphy Sucks, IL
Joined: 05.07.2010

Jan 10 @ 4:22 PM ET
If they re-sign Gus, I'll be pissed. CDH, Maata, etc., can all be easily moved if/when a kid pushes them out. Not an issue.
- mohel


If they resign Gus, Bowman should be fired on the spot. That isn't even up for debate. That would be a catastrophic failure of epic proportions.
mohel
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: IL
Joined: 02.08.2013

Jan 10 @ 4:23 PM ET
Last night was rock bottom for me....a team off a firing coach, Rinne said they were mentally fragile, blood in the water....and the hawks show up flat....again.

per usual, they wake up mid part of the game, make it interesting, only to lose again.....and this time in spectacular fashion giving up a ENG to a damn goalie. On home ice.

I feel bad for anyone who went to that game and spent money to see that.

This organization is a damn lucky they aren't in a beloved hockey market with heavy media pressure....instead those suits can hide away and use spin to clami how they are still in "the race" which is hilarious, and yes....I know Bowman isn't going to come out and admit they suck and their season is over.....but show me a media member grilling this team....

- SteveRain


How does a guy who wants a gut rehab get to rock bottom at this point. Someone holding out hope? I get them having rock bottom moments. Not so much for someone who acknowledges that they are not playoff contenders and is okay with a rebuild.
SteveRain
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Connor Murphy Sucks, IL
Joined: 05.07.2010

Jan 10 @ 4:23 PM ET
Not trying to convince you it's the right way to go. Just my take - conjecture - on what they're doing.
- mohel


its a half ass, scared way of operating....and its just pushing the window to win further away with this approach.

Maybe this offseason they'll sign Kovalchuk.
-Doh-
Location: VA
Joined: 10.05.2015

Jan 10 @ 4:25 PM ET
Unless your Forwards and Defenseman are good enough to compete in the playoffs, it is a complete waste to have an elite goaltender. You're wasting salary that could be spent better elsewhere.

Look no further that this year's goaltending situation. There is no reason to spend 11 million in goaltending with a C+ roster.

I understand Crawford was unreliable yaddya yaddya yaddya. However, you have Delia and Lankinen that could've used those games to develop if Corey went down again.

Lehner took a risk signing here and we made him look silly.

- catrisc


I disagree that goaltending is a complete waste on weak teams. I think one of the mistakes rebuilding teams make is shoddy goaltending. Look at teams like Edmonton, Buffalo, Toronto. I am not saying you need $11 mil tied up in goaltending. But if you have an elite goalie rebuilding is easier. It gives you a chance to win almost every night and it is easier to assess your dmen. I think either Crow or Lehner are back next year with Lankinen as a backup. If Crow $6mil for a couple of years. If Lehner $7 mill for 3 years. I would not sign any goalie to a contract that will expire after Toews, Kane, Keith and ADB contracts expire in the summer of 23.
SteveRain
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Connor Murphy Sucks, IL
Joined: 05.07.2010

Jan 10 @ 4:27 PM ET
How does a guy who wants a gut rehab get to rock bottom at this point. Someone holding out hope? I get them having rock bottom moments. Not so much for someone who acknowledges that they are not playoff contenders and is okay with a rebuild.
- mohel


I want a gut rehab, but will never get it because the organization is too scared that Johnny t shirt jersey wont show up and they'll drop down to 10k fans again...something Im sure McDonough and his never ending 1 goal campaign even can't survive....

so id like to see some sort of effort......I can take effort and losses. At least they tried but they are lacking the personnel.

What I saw last night was a quit....they had zero interest.....for a large portion of the game....and that's why I am hell bent and would beg Stan if I ever spoke to him to launch some of these veterans....

I hate the talk....talk, talk, talk.....that's all these veterans do...cliché after cliché after cliché and that's why Lehner is so refreshing.
-Doh-
Location: VA
Joined: 10.05.2015

Jan 10 @ 4:27 PM ET
I disagree that goaltending is a complete waste on weak teams. I think one of the mistakes rebuilding teams make is shoddy goaltending. Look at teams like Edmonton, Buffalo, Toronto. I am not saying you need $11 mil tied up in goaltending. But if you have an elite goalie rebuilding is easier. It gives you a chance to win almost every night and it is easier to assess your dmen. I think either Crow or Lehner are back next year with Lankinen as a backup. If Crow $6mil for a couple of years. If Lehner $7 mill for 3 years. I would not sign any goalie to a contract that will expire after Toews, Kane, Keith and ADB contracts expire in the summer of 23.
- -Doh-


They are probably talking to agents of Crow and Lehner now. They will come to an agreement with one and trade the other. They probably will not announce the signing until after the trade.
-Doh-
Location: VA
Joined: 10.05.2015

Jan 10 @ 4:29 PM ET
If they resign Gus, Bowman should be fired on the spot. That isn't even up for debate. That would be a catastrophic failure of epic proportions.
- SteveRain


I am ok with Bowman for the most part, but I agree with you on this. Unless it is less than a $1 mil contract. He needs a change of scenery.
Savetheembers33
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Chicago, IL
Joined: 01.23.2017

Jan 10 @ 4:31 PM ET
Unless your Forwards and Defenseman are good enough to compete in the playoffs, it is a complete waste to have an elite goaltender. You're wasting salary that could be spent better elsewhere.

Look no further that this year's goaltending situation. There is no reason to spend 11 million in goaltending with a C+ roster.

I understand Crawford was unreliable yaddya yaddya yaddya. However, you have Delia and Lankinen that could've used those games to develop if Corey went down again.

Lehner took a risk signing here and we made him look silly.

- catrisc


I disagree. If anything Lehner came out on top coming here. Not only has he continued his stellar play, he's done so with a WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAYYY worse defense in front of him. Teams will see that and think to themselves, "Well s#!t! If he can play that well in front of that defense imagine what he could do in front of an even better one!" and he will get the contract he wants.

Big factor is he's going to be 29 going into next season. Right in his "prime" and even on a five year deal he would be signed til he's 33 which he would/should still be in his "prime". A guy like Holtby will be going in his age 31 season next year and will be on the tail end of his "prime" and will want a deal that extends past it thus making Lehner a more attractive option.

I'm on the fence when it comes to Lehner. I'd love to have him on this team with a capable defense in front of him, but at the same time I don't wanna be stuck paying a goalie on a team that can't win. I guess you could always move him (unless he gets the Stan special) for pieces if you continue to struggle, but you risk losing depth elsewhere. Gonna be interesting to follow
SteveRain
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Connor Murphy Sucks, IL
Joined: 05.07.2010

Jan 10 @ 4:31 PM ET
How does a guy who wants a gut rehab get to rock bottom at this point. Someone holding out hope? I get them having rock bottom moments. Not so much for someone who acknowledges that they are not playoff contenders and is okay with a rebuild.
- mohel



So when people say "all these core guys deserve to retire hawks...." my blood pressure rises because all those guys have won, and are fat, and truthfully....even you said it earlier....mail it in....why did it take 19 to FINALLY move his @ss and start playing like he should when if he did earlier this season....hell they may be sniffing a playoff spot.

Yet, the apologists claimed his back was jacked up, or whatever cute excuse they could fine......and that's the captain. A guy who is looked to and SHOULD BE busting his @ss 110% of every shift and set the example.

Toews has failed at that way too much since Nashville exposed them in April of 2017.

I love that they won...but that was last decade. Time to look forward, and not back. Stop paying guys based on yesterday, and time to start making hockey trades that expedite your ability to win before 88 is one.

And yes, 88 is the 1 veteran I'd cater to...followed by 2 who is a bionic human.

Savetheembers33
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Chicago, IL
Joined: 01.23.2017

Jan 10 @ 4:37 PM ET
Outside of a few, I don't think anyone here really thinks this is a playoff team this year.

I wouldn't mind signing Lehner as long as it is 4 years max. If he can get more on the open market, let him.

I've mentioned it before, but this team already is rebuilding. The problem is that they are trying to save face and do it while still being competitive which is just slowing down the process. I still don't understand the point in trading for both Maatta and de Haan. Getting one of them would have been fine to try and get them through. Ultimately, everyone is just frustrated at the effort being displayed every night. If there really is urgency to get to the playoffs this year, then play like it. Don't stand around and watch as the puck just passes you by.

- Chunk


I think he pulled the trigger on the Maatta deal because it filled the need that this team needed and then Carolina made it known de Haan was available Stan doubled down because he knew they need the help. Plus they got him for pennies on the dollar because of his injury history.
mohel
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: IL
Joined: 02.08.2013

Jan 10 @ 4:48 PM ET
I think he pulled the trigger on the Maatta deal because it filled the need that this team needed and then Carolina made it known de Haan was available Stan doubled down because he knew they need the help. Plus they got him for pennies on the dollar because of his injury history.
- Savetheembers33


Maybe injuries and illness for both is a reason they acquired both. And maybe because they had 2/3 openings on the blue line, and each has a decent cap hit that should be tradeable without a sweetener if a kid pushes one out. And, if Rocky says he doesn't want to go back to 10K fans during the rebuild.
mohel
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: IL
Joined: 02.08.2013

Jan 10 @ 4:51 PM ET
So when people say "all these core guys deserve to retire hawks...." my blood pressure rises because all those guys have won, and are fat, and truthfully....even you said it earlier....mail it in....why did it take 19 to FINALLY move his @ss and start playing like he should when if he did earlier this season....hell they may be sniffing a playoff spot.

Yet, the apologists claimed his back was jacked up, or whatever cute excuse they could fine......and that's the captain. A guy who is looked to and SHOULD BE busting his @ss 110% of every shift and set the example.

Toews has failed at that way too much since Nashville exposed them in April of 2017.

I love that they won...but that was last decade. Time to look forward, and not back. Stop paying guys based on yesterday, and time to start making hockey trades that expedite your ability to win before 88 is one.

And yes, 88 is the 1 veteran I'd cater to...followed by 2 who is a bionic human.

- SteveRain


Do you realize that you (and most of us posters) are VERY different than 95% of the fans?
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