I was just thinking today that he wasn't given any bonuses to minimize money the Leafs have to spend on him on the cap so they can upgrade him at the TDL.
- Santo_44

Cap doesn't work that way.

They should have given him money up front - making him easier to trade at the TDL, as the cap hit would be the same, but a poor team would take him since they have less actual money to shell out.

That is a drastic improvement for us.
- Aetherial

Kinda sad how accurate that is.

CBJ is thinking the same thing.
- Santo_44

I am holding out hope that they continue to lose games and trade off players for picks/prospects.

Cap doesn't work that way.

They should have given him money up front - making him easier to trade at the TDL, as the cap hit would be the same, but a poor team would take him since they have less actual money to shell out.
- Atomic Wedgie

Are you sure?

There is alot I feel as fans we don't understand about the cap.

I know its not so cut and dry.

If JT was put on LTIR they would of had a bit more money at the TDL.

I am holding out hope that they continue to lose games and trade off players for picks/prospects.
- PatC80

Josh Anderson is a guy any team would covet.

He has a lot of his career left in him.

I would like Dubas to move Petan the way St.Louis moved Fabbri.
- Aaron_85

precisely.

and someone needs to tell Dubas that he doesn't always have to take the smaller player in the trade

I would have liked them to grab Perlini from Chicago in that fashion

Cap doesn't work that way.

They should have given him money up front - making him easier to trade at the TDL, as the cap hit would be the same, but a poor team would take him since they have less actual money to shell out.
- Atomic Wedgie

A lot of people have wondered this.

The only logical thing *I* can think of is that Ceci's camp simply didn't want it. I think this is Ceci's last chance to prove he's a $4m defenseman, and playing on a good team with a good partner is his chance to show that he's better than his reputation.

I don't know if it will work out for him - it sure doesn't seem like it - but I honestly think that his agent knew that if the Leafs front-loaded his contract, he'd be traded to a poor team (and likely one that's not playoff bound) and that would hurt Ceci's future marketability.

A lot of people have wondered this.

The only logical thing *I* can think of is that Ceci's camp simply didn't want it. I think this is Ceci's last chance to prove he's a $4m defenseman, and playing on a good team with a good partner is his chance to show that he's better than his reputation.

I don't know if it will work out for him - it sure doesn't seem like it - but I honestly think that his agent knew that if the Leafs front-loaded his contract, he'd be traded to a poor team (and likely one that's not playoff bound) and that would hurt Ceci's future marketability.
- Monkeypunk

Maybe(extremely likely) Dubas talked to all other 30 GMs in the league about trading for Ceci and they all said "Not now, talk to me in January."

Then what is the point in giving bonuses?

The weird thing to me about all of this is I think the team can be better with a smaller roster.

I think a player will respond better to being in the lineup every night, rather than getting in every 2nd game (12 minutes as a defenceman) and being constantly terrified that one frank up will get him back in the pressbox.
- Atomic Wedgie

I agree - to a point.

Having the 4th line guys fighting for ice is a good thing - keeps them fresh and focused.

Having the defense core they had at the beginning of the season - it was a necessity to have spares.

Are you sure?

There is alot I feel as fans we don't understand about the cap.

I know its not so cut and dry.

If JT was put on LTIR they would of had a bit more money at the TDL.
- Santo_44

my thoughts also.

we pretend to be cap experts on here

A lot of people have wondered this.

The only logical thing *I* can think of is that Ceci's camp simply didn't want it. I think this is Ceci's last chance to prove he's a $4m defenseman, and playing on a good team with a good partner is his chance to show that he's better than his reputation.

I don't know if it will work out for him - it sure doesn't seem like it - but I honestly think that his agent knew that if the Leafs front-loaded his contract, he'd be traded to a poor team (and likely one that's not playoff bound) and that would hurt Ceci's future marketability.
- Monkeypunk

kind of interesting - to me anyway - that Holl seems to be emerging as better than expected with more responsibility - while Ceci seems to be regressing... also seems interesting to me that Babcock actually praised Holl the other day in an interview... stating he seems strong than previously.

I wonder how long until we see Holl paired from the start of the game with Rielly. There's been a few instances of it... but nothing consistent to date.

Are you sure?

There is alot I feel as fans we don't understand about the cap.

I know its not so cut and dry.

If JT was put on LTIR they would of had a bit more money at the TDL.
- Santo_44

That would only be true if the Leafs weren't operating in LTIR. Because the Leafs are operating strictly over the cap and in LTIR, LTIR space doesn't pool or accumulate. So any player on LTIR for us can be replaced at an equivalent salary for the duration of the injury, but no more.

As an exercise, if we had a player who suffered a season-ending injury (and let's hope it doesn't happen), then that residual salary is available because it's in the LTIR pool. But if you don't use it, it doesn't pool. It's available for use.

Now there was one theoretical exercise that's interesting. I believe that if you acquire a player who is already on LTIR, then that would create LTIR pool room for you to use. Tumbleweed had suggested that we couldn't make the acquisition because you still need to have cap space to fit the player, but I don't think that applies here - because the player is on LTIR. There are no rules (other than a marginal attempt at circumvention, so it's dicey) that explicitly prohibit a team operating in LTIR from acquiring more LTIR space.

Are you sure?

There is alot I feel as fans we don't understand about the cap.

I know its not so cut and dry.

If JT was put on LTIR they would of had a bit more money at the TDL.
- Santo_44

how long would JT (pinkie - hilarious btw) have had to be out before he would have qualified for LTIR...

its 3 weeks or more I believe?

precisely.

and someone needs to tell Dubas that he doesn't always have to take the smaller player in the trade

I would have liked them to grab Perlini from Chicago in that fashion
- BorjeFan4Ever

Lets compare heights
http://www.nhltradetracke...list_by_GM/Kyle_Dubas/303

That would only be true if the Leafs weren't operating in LTIR. Because the Leafs are operating strictly over the cap and in LTIR, LTIR space doesn't pool or accumulate. So any player on LTIR for us can be replaced at an equivalent salary for the duration of the injury, but no more.

As an exercise, if we had a player who suffered a season-ending injury (and let's hope it doesn't happen), then that residual salary is available because it's in the LTIR pool. But if you don't use it, it doesn't pool. It's available for use.

Now there was one theoretical exercise that's interesting. I believe that if you acquire a player who is already on LTIR, then that would create LTIR pool room for you to use. Tumbleweed had suggested that we couldn't make the acquisition because you still need to have cap space to fit the player, but I don't think that applies here - because the player is on LTIR. There are no rules (other than a marginal attempt at circumvention, so it's dicey) that explicitly prohibit a team operating in LTIR from acquiring more LTIR space.
- Monkeypunk

(frank)

this cap stuff is confusing.

with social media, a lot of this info is coming out for the general public...but it still confuses the (frank) out of me.

Maybe(extremely likely) Dubas talked to all other 30 GMs in the league about trading for Ceci and they all said "Not now, talk to me in January."

Then what is the point in giving bonuses?
- Santo_44

Because it increases the market for him.

If $3m of his $4.5 salary were paid in an initial signing bonus, then Ceci is only making $1.5m in actual dollars for the season. Which would mean that in January, you'd still be on the nut for his cap hit, but his actual salary would only be about $750k at that point vs. $2.25m. It's an easier sell to poorer teams who have cap room.

Lets compare heights
http://www.nhltradetracke...list_by_GM/Kyle_Dubas/303
- senstroll

Would have been nice if we could have kept Fedor Gordeev, too bad we couldn't sign him.

Because it increases the market for him.

If $3m of his $4.5 salary were paid in an initial signing bonus, then Ceci is only making $1.5m in actual dollars for the season. Which would mean that in January, you'd still be on the nut for his cap hit, but his actual salary would only be about $750k at that point vs. $2.25m. It's an easier sell to poorer teams who have cap room.
- Monkeypunk

I think Dubas' plan all along was to keep Ceci..

We rag on him a lot here, but overall, he has been better than I thought he would be.. Has to stop making those mental errors though

here is a fun site https://nhles.com/

The NHLe Player Comparison Tool has every skater drafted, in the first seven rounds, from 1990 to 2019 as well as a few select undrafted star players and 1980s drafted Hall of Famers

You can compare players when they were drafted and how good they were (nhle), so a Biggs was a 13 and Kucherov a 41 in thier draft years in 2011

Stuart percy was also 13

obv not perfect, but I feel like you could avoid some bad picks using something like that

(frank)

this cap stuff is confusing.

with social media, a lot of this info is coming out for the general public...but it still confuses the (frank) out of me.
- Santo_44

Me too. I actually asked Mirtle for clarification in one of his Athletic articles a couple of weeks ago.

LTIR is bizarre. One of the key things to remember with it is that it's not a contract state at all; it's application for relief that is contingent upon 3 conditions being met: (1) The player is out for 24 or more days, (2) the player is out for 10 or more games and (3) A player has been acquired or called up to replace that player.

So if you look at that, the acquisition of Clarkson and Horton happening prior to the signing of Marner was good, because it meant that they could allocate most of Marner's salary to Clarkson and Horton's collective LTIR pool. because he was the "acquired" player.

Me too. I actually asked Mirtle for clarification in one of his Athletic articles a couple of weeks ago.

LTIR is bizarre. One of the key things to remember with it is that it's not a contract state at all; it's application for relief that is contingent upon 3 conditions being met: (1) The player is out for 24 or more days, (2) the player is out for 10 or more games and (3) A player has been acquired or called up to replace that player.

So if you look at that, the acquisition of Clarkson and Horton happening prior to the signing of Marner was good, because it meant that they could allocate most of Marner's salary to Clarkson and Horton's collective LTIR pool. because he was the "acquired" player.
- Monkeypunk

There were some great articles after the Leafs reacquired Clarkson - basically saying, "OK, Why the Frank did the Leafs do This? Here's Why!"

Anyone else getting a huge increase in frequency of robo-calls from scam artists?

I've been getting 1-2 a day on my work phone - in Chinese no less.

But now I'm getting 2 or more a day on my personal phone - the Tax Office of Canada is going to have me arrested unless I take action.

Anyone else getting a huge increase in frequency of robo-calls from scam artists?

I've been getting 1-2 a day on my work phone - in Chinese no less.

But now I'm getting 2 or more a day on my personal phone - the Tax Office of Canada is going to have me arrested unless I take action.
- Atomic Wedgie

YEESSS!!

Anyone else getting a huge increase in frequency of robo-calls from scam artists?

I've been getting 1-2 a day on my work phone - in Chinese no less.

But now I'm getting 2 or more a day on my personal phone - the Tax Office of Canada is going to have me arrested unless I take action.
- Atomic Wedgie

I get calls that tell me that I'm on the magistrate's radar and that I need to talk to a rep or else I'll go to jail.

I hope the magistrate doesn't know where I live

I think Dubas' plan all along was to keep Ceci..

We rag on him a lot here, but overall, he has been better than I thought he would be.. Has to stop making those mental errors though
- PatC80

I think if you take a look at most of his gaffes, they fall right into that category that I presume is the "being hard on the puck" type. Yesterday he's making that play - hit the puck like it punched your mom. Whack it to the boards. A soft play in front is not going to help. You're in danger and you're pressed - ice the puck - don't try and chip it to a tired stationary teammate in the D-Zone. Hit the puck like it drank your last beer.