James Tanner: What Should the Coyotes First Line Be?

I agree about Soderberg, including playoffs he only had 2 goals in his last 33 games, that goal total last year was all pre-February

Mickey mouse organization that has no fanbase.

A completely irrelevant organization.

Otherwise...things are really looking up!

We need tanner predictions already

It will be interesting to see how Kessel does. Really, they traded a bust for an elite winger. He's got OEL to feed him the puck, and I think he has better centre options than his Bozak days. This could pan out. That or Phil just checks out in a zero pressure market.

The challenge with Phil Kessel is simple. When things are going good he plays good. When things aren't going good he doesn't give a single (frank). In Pittsburgh things were going good so he was playing good.

In that one playoff series with the Leafs against the Bruins he played great. He even pushed a guy in the corner and took the puck. I immediately called my father in shock but his phone line was busy - because he was trying to call me for the same reason.

If the Coyotes start out losing games...if Phil doesn't score points early... it's gonna be a disaster. Phil is not a "best player on the team" type of elite player.

That said, he can be amazing offensively and he is an extremely underrated as a playmaker.

James Tanner: What Should the Coyotes First Line Be?
- James_Tanner

Disagree with you Tanner. Kessel fills a big RW void and puts up 1ppg, all for 6.8M. That is unbelievable. Pair that with Schmaltz and Keller continuing to improve, and you could have plenty of offense. It is your massively overpaid D that are the concern.

The challenge with Phil Kessel is simple. When things are going good he plays good. When things aren't going good he doesn't give a single (frank). In Pittsburgh things were going good so he was playing good.

In that one playoff series with the Leafs against the Bruins he played great. He even pushed a guy in the corner and took the puck. I immediately called my father in shock but his phone line was busy - because he was trying to call me for the same reason.

If the Coyotes start out losing games...if Phil doesn't score points early... it's gonna be a disaster. Phil is not a "best player on the team" type of elite player.

That said, he can be amazing offensively and he is an extremely underrated as a playmaker.
- Njuice

I mean, he created two of the most dangerous lines in the league two years in a row with Bozak and Lupul, then JVR. I never really get that "not a best player on the team" term since nobody succeeds if they're surrounded by at best fringe second liners. Swap Kessel and Crosby on that Leafs team and I don't think they do all that much better. I mean, just look at Edmonton. By your logic, I can say that McDavid just isn't a "best on the team" kind of player.

I mean, he created two of the most dangerous lines in the league two years in a row with Bozak and Lupul, then JVR. I never really get that "not a best player on the team" term since nobody succeeds if they're surrounded by at best fringe second liners. Swap Kessel and Crosby on that Leafs team and I don't think they do all that much better. I mean, just look at Edmonton. By your logic, I can say that McDavid just isn't a "best on the team" kind of player.
- mgriffen

Well Kessel only gives 100 percent when things are going well. If his team isn't winning or if he isn't scoring he absolutely isn't backchecking or battling for pucks.

Put Crosby on those Leaf teams and remove Kessel and they would have been considerably better. For sure.

I mean, he created two of the most dangerous lines in the league two years in a row with Bozak and Lupul, then JVR. I never really get that "not a best player on the team" term since nobody succeeds if they're surrounded by at best fringe second liners. Swap Kessel and Crosby on that Leafs team and I don't think they do all that much better. I mean, just look at Edmonton. By your logic, I can say that McDavid just isn't a "best on the team" kind of player.
- mgriffen

I haven't seen enough Oilers games to know if McDavid backchecks, battles, etc.

I haven't seen enough Oilers games to know if McDavid backchecks, battles, etc.
- Njuice

ummm..... McD is the best player to set foot on the ice. He never stops skating. Yes he back checks and battles with the best of them.

The challenge with Phil Kessel is simple. When things are going good he plays good. When things aren't going good he doesn't give a single (frank). In Pittsburgh things were going good so he was playing good.

In that one playoff series with the Leafs against the Bruins he played great. He even pushed a guy in the corner and took the puck. I immediately called my father in shock but his phone line was busy - because he was trying to call me for the same reason.

If the Coyotes start out losing games...if Phil doesn't score points early... it's gonna be a disaster. Phil is not a "best player on the team" type of elite player.

That said, he can be amazing offensively and he is an extremely underrated as a playmaker.
- Njuice

I would temper my expectation on Kessel. He will be 32 when the season starts. He plays most games, yet has only scored more than 30 goals ONCE over the last 5 years....and this while playing with Crosby, Malkin and the Pens potent PP.

On Arizona I think Kessel will "check-out" more than he did in Pittsburgh. I expect on opportunity alone he will still put up 25goals and 60points. But, that's about it. I like the guy. A strange but likable personality. Sadly though, his best hockey is behind him and I don't think the desert will fix that!

As a Coyotes fan, I agree we didn't get more scoring but many of the players where injured. And a few are in their sophomore years. This is a make or break season. If we stay out of the injuries and the younger players step it up. They will have enough to score. But I still would have loved to get a couple more scorer's.

Mickey mouse organization that has no fanbase.

A completely irrelevant organization.

Otherwise...things are really looking up!
- bruceflyers

Hahahahaha. They’re a bargain bin team with a blogger to match.

Ill be honest Tanner, I stopped reading after you said that you have to stack lines. Do Crosby and Malkin play together? Kane and Toews? JT, Marner and Matthews? Do Draisatl and McDavid always play together?

Heck, even look at the Penguins. Often times they’re at their best when Phil was playing well on a third line because he wasn’t playing well with Malkin. There is no one size fits all

Let’s keep things in perspective too. Certain players only want to play in certain markets, can we agree on that? Players with offensive talent who are desired usually also have desired destinations.

Soderberg was brought in on the 25th of June. Chayka could talk to free agents on the 23rd. Isn’t it entirely possible that he spoke with free agents and they told him they weren’t interested? I certainly think so

3 good articlles in a rows, pretty impressive now !

I do think the same ways, they should at least stack one line keller, nick schmalt,kessel

and i would really like hayton making the club and playing on 2nd line that would make at least 2 line that can compete for goals and they do have a solid defense/goaltending behind

Ill be honest Tanner, I stopped reading after you said that you have to stack lines. Do Crosby and Malkin play together? Kane and Toews? JT, Marner and Matthews? Do Draisatl and McDavid always play together?

Heck, even look at the Penguins. Often times they’re at their best when Phil was playing well on a third line because he wasn’t playing well with Malkin. There is no one size fits all
- WSCTeton17

Don't do the "I stopped reading when I found something I disagreed with" it's annoying, but also, everyone who has every claimed to have stopped reading, read to the end. That's just a fact.

And stacking players is the right to do it, regardless of how other teams have done it in the past.

You should know just for example that while McDavid and Draisaitle played together they were the best players in the NHL, but when separated they were both sub-50% players.

Don't do the "I stopped reading when I found something I disagreed with" it's annoying, but also, everyone who has every claimed to have stopped reading, read to the end. That's just a fact.

And stacking players is the right to do it, regardless of how other teams have done it in the past.

You should know just for example that while McDavid and Draisaitle played together they were the best players in the NHL, but when separated they were both sub-50% players.
- James_Tanner

You and I have different definitions for “fact” then because I did stop reading there and it’s a fact. Based off what you’ve seen from Tocchet thus far does he seem like the kind of coach to stack one line permanently or the type to spread the wealth? He certainly didn’t stack Strome very well while he had him, although he was a treat to watch whilst he was here

Don't do the "I stopped reading when I found something I disagreed with" it's annoying, but also, everyone who has every claimed to have stopped reading, read to the end. That's just a fact.

And stacking players is the right to do it, regardless of how other teams have done it in the past.

You should know just for example that while McDavid and Draisaitle played together they were the best players in the NHL, but when separated they were both sub-50% players.
- James_Tanner

As strange as this is for me to say, I actually agree with you here. Stacking a top line gives the Yotes the best chance to win. They should also double shift here and there to give top players some added ice time.

Tanner was pumped before last season and they sucked. This year he's much more tempered so possibly it reverses itself? I would not bet any of my own jack on this happening though.

Don't do the "I stopped reading when I found something I disagreed with" it's annoying, but also, everyone who has every claimed to have stopped reading, read to the end. That's just a fact.

And stacking players is the right to do it, regardless of how other teams have done it in the past.

You should know just for example that while McDavid and Draisaitle played together they were the best players in the NHL, but when separated they were both sub-50% players.
- James_Tanner

Despite your usual ridiculousness, if you're talking specifically about the 'Yotes stacking a line, you're probably right.

There isn't enough supportive talent (or high end, for that matter) on the team to hope they can roll 2 (let alone 3) lines and be effective night-in night-out. They're going to have to lean on their top guys, together, to victimize 2nd and 3rd pairings.

Meaning... lots of ice time. Which is what it is.

You and I have different definitions for “fact” then because I did stop reading there and it’s a fact. Based off what you’ve seen from Tocchet thus far does he seem like the kind of coach to stack one line permanently or the type to spread the wealth? He certainly didn’t stack Strome very well while he had him, although he was a treat to watch whilst he was here
- WSCTeton17

OK I don't believe you, but sure, just like I'm sure not everyone who owns a pair of Oakleys is a massive dbag, it's possible - though unlikely - there could be an exception.

But you are right, Tocchet probably won't stack the lines because he's not a very up-to-date coach.

As strange as this is for me to say, I actually agree with you here. Stacking a top line gives the Yotes the best chance to win. They should also double shift here and there to give top players some added ice time.
- MJL

I think anyone who has ever seen a Bruins game in the last few years should agree with me.

If you measure the performance of every player in the NHL, the range of about 10% of players is bigger than the last 90%.

Essentially, the best non-first line player and the worst player in the league are barely any different from each other.


Since we know that elite players make all the difference , and since any WOWY chart can show you that pairing them leads to better results, it's common sense to stack your best players together, or it should be.

No matter who you put on your second and third lines, they're likely to come close to even against any team that doesn't have enough first liners to build an elite second line. (So like 5 teams).

Since most teams usually spread the wealth a bit, the Coyotes could make up for not having the BEST first line by having 3 top players on it. If they can win the first line battle half the time, they can be a playoff team.

OK I don't believe you, but sure, just like I'm sure not everyone who owns a pair of Oakleys is a massive dbag, it's possible - though unlikely - there could be an exception.

But you are right, Tocchet probably won't stack the lines because he's not a very up-to-date coach.
- James_Tanner

I know some really attractive women here in the states with Oakleys that are in fact not dbags but if you said men instead of everyone then you’d be mostly right

Kessel has also shown that he doesn’t need an elite center to produce. Don’t you think that a line of Keller, Schmaltz and Kessel would be poor defensively and would be pretty easy to play against?

Hinostroza was on pace for 39 ES points playing primarily with Richardson as his center. Don’t you think it makes at least some sense to pair him with Schmaltz? I also think Soderberg would be a natural fit on the LW here as he could also play down low on the breakout making that line better defensively. That allows you to pair Keller with Dvorak or Stepan, he’s shown chemistry with both and then Phil can be on the RW. Not only does it not sound like the worst lines ever, it looks like something Tocchet would do

Btw you keep talking about Soderberg like he’s junk. I know you’re disappointed that we didn’t get more but it looks like we were swinging and missing at other FAs so Chayka pulled the trigger. Soderberg has had over 30 ES points ever single season except one. Schmaltz was on pace for about 35 as a Coyote. I’m not expecting 20 goals, but I think 40 points playing a responsible game could be expected. 40 would’ve put him at the 4th highest forward pace on the team last year