skimming through so maybe I don't know the exact context of the argument. Sure they want to play the best players, but it's about building a team. The defense was poorly structured. They had no quality veteran leadership on it. They needed to make that change in order for young guys to develop. It's too bad for players like Haag and Morin, but the guys I'm concerned about developing are Provorov and Sanheim.
- Dkos

I agree that adding veterans can help and support young.players who will be in the lineup. Doesn't change that ice time and opportunity is taken away from younger players. Pros and cons of it.

I agree that adding veterans can help and support young.players who will be in the lineup. Doesn't change that ice ptime and opportunity is taken away from younger players. Pros and cons of it.
- MJL

absolutely. It's give and take with every move.

I would be more concerned if management had slotted in Meyers on the second pair to begin with. I think he will start on the third pair and hopefully earn more minutes. You'd think someone might be on the move, carrying 8 dmen is fine but one is usually a Manning type, Hagg and Morin need to play. I know people are saying what about injuries but what if we are healthy?
- ClaudeFather

yeah it is not perfect for sure but the last 2 years showed us the need to have more than we had. If need be I would get the best deal for Hagg and move him. I don't have an issue with carrying the 8 to begin the season. I do believe the Flyers have a good number of back to back games, not a big help. They also start overseas, that doesn't help.

IF Braun is not a decent 4th D, Fletcher made a mistake, if he is, I like the move. Getting SanHeim and Provy support was job 1.

Whether you like it or not Amac is veteran leadership and to an extent Gudas, they just brought in better defensive partners, they see these guys as a better fit.
- ClaudeFather

Right. Hard for a guy. who could barely stay in the lineup, to be looked at as a leader. Gudas? I admit he played well last year, but I don't see him as the guy you want your young players taking their cues from.

Not sure if anybody here is a tennis fan, but I really feel that the past 15 years have been the best era of tennis ever. I know the era before had Conners/McEnroe/Agassi/Sampras, but Federer/Nalad/Djokovic/Murray are a cut above, and the women's game has never been better. I will be sad when Federer and Nadal are gone, best rivalry I've ever seen, and a very friendly one.
- jmatchett383

US men were so dominant in the early 90's (Chang and Courier in addition to the ones you mentioned). It was definitely a special time to be an American tennis fan. But yeah, Feds/Rafa/Joker are ridiculous... they'd destroy the guys from previous eras.

The women's side is what sets the early 90's apart for me, tho... Graf, Seles, Navritilova, Hingis were all such complete tennis players. Serena is GOAT (by far), but the other WTA players of this era are pretty forgettable.

yeah it is not perfect for sure but the last 2 years showed us the need to have more than we need. If need be I would get the best deal for Hagg and move him. I don't have an issue with carrying the 8 to begin the season. I do believe the Flyers have a good number of back to back games, not a big help. They also start overseas, that doesn't help.

IF Braun is not a decent 4th D, Fletcher made a mistake, if he is, I like the move. Getting SanHeim and Provy support was job 1.
- wcorvette

Yea to begin the season it is not an issue, but Hagg and Morin will need to get ice. time will tell.

I agree that adding veterans can help and support young.players who will be in the lineup. Doesn't change that ice time and opportunity is taken away from younger players. Pros and cons of it.
- MJL

Boo!

So I tried to back read this discussion of the Braun vs “ice time of young d-men” discussion...and I noticed something interesting...

No one said “Ghost,” not once. Is he sitting in the press box for this discussion or are we all trying to be nice and not argue about him anymore?

Only one of eight not mentioned.

Boo!

So I tried to back read this discussion of the Braun vs “ice time of young d-men” discussion...and I noticed something interesting...

No one said “Ghost,” not once. Is he sitting in the press box for this discussion or are we all trying to be nice and not argue about him anymore?

Only one of eight not mentioned.
- NC Flyers Fan

by saying Hagg and Morin sit, Ghost is assumed on the 3rd pair with Myers

Right. Hard for a guy. who could barely stay in the lineup, to be looked at as a leader. Gudas? I admit he played well last year, but I don't see him as the guy you want your young players taking their cues from.
- Dkos

Just because he had poor play or was hurt doesn't make him any less of a leader, he is spoken highly of by every guy in the locker room. He probably prepares like a professional and was a great example for the young guys, Braun and Niskanen are just seen as better fits that's all. Amac was done playing here.

Yea to begin the season it is not an issue, but Hagg and Morin will need to get ice. time will tell.
- ClaudeFather

si

Boo!

So I tried to back read this discussion of the Braun vs “ice time of young d-men” discussion...and I noticed something interesting...

No one said “Ghost,” not once. Is he sitting in the press box for this discussion or are we all trying to be nice and not argue about him anymore?

Only one of eight not mentioned.
- NC Flyers Fan

I have him penciled in on the third pairing with meyers, Braun and Sanheim, Provy ?Niskanen. Don't see Hagg or Morin beating him out so wasn't worth mentioning. And he seems to do his own thing based on the comments from the old D coach, veteran leadership isn't affecting him much unless you are a Chris Pronger.

Just because he had poor play or was hurt doesn't make him any less of a leader, he is spoken highly of by every guy in the locker room. He probably prepares like a professional and was a great example for the young guys, Braun and Niskanen are just seen as better fits that's all. Amac was done playing here.
- ClaudeFather

I'd feel a lot more confident with Niskanen as my lineman than Amac.

US men were so dominant in the early 90's (Chang and Courier in addition to the ones you mentioned). It was definitely a special time to be an American tennis fan. But yeah, Feds/Rafa/Joker are ridiculous... they'd destroy the guys from previous eras.

The women's side is what sets that era apart for me, tho... Graf, Seles, Navritilova, Hingis were all such complete tennis players. Serena is GOAT (by far), but the other WTA players of this era are pretty forgettable.
- Tomahawk

It's hard to believe an American man hasn't won a major since 2003 (Andy RodRichard). The three headed European monster that has dominated for the last 10-15 years is going to be gone soon. It would be nice to see a few American men competing for Majors. I know Johnny Mac is passionate about this.

I think Sampras in his prime would be able to compete with the big 3 now. Certainly at Wimbledon his serve and volley game was so great.

Sure it's a good point. Are you telling me that the Flyers couldn't trade Patrick for an older player that is currently better? You want to play the best players. Where does that end?
I love when people bring up MacDonald in a foolish argument. The circumstances of a team change. When the Flyers signed MacDonald, they didn't have a stable of young NHL ready defenseman that they have now. My ideals haven't shifted. You just don't understand it.
- MJL

I talk about current roster and you're talking about trades - not a valid point to this topic of conversation. Damn, you are the one that just doesn't understand and have to argue about crap. But hey, how about that.

I'd feel a lot more confident with Niskanen as my lineman than Amac.
- Dkos

That's why they were brought in, they are seen as good fits with our guys. Not because he has good veteran leadership lol just a plus

by saying Hagg and Morin sit, Ghost is assumed on the 3rd pair with Myers
- wcorvette

Quite the assumption. “Earn it” goes for him too and Sanheim and Provy. We slot them but really couldn’t it turn out very differently? Having both Niskanen and Braun make more options.

Quite the assumption. “Earn it” goes for him too and Sanheim and Provy. We slot them but really couldn’t it turn out very differently? Having both Niskanen and Braun make more options.
- NC Flyers Fan

Not really, do you honestly see Hagg or Morin being a better player next year than Ghost? I don't and if they are they had a hell of a summer.

That's why they were brought in, they are seen as good fits with our guys. Not because he has good veteran leadership lol just a plus
- ClaudeFather

Both Niskanen and Braun are coming off bad seasons. Hoping for bounce back seasons from both of them is probably fools gold. I don't disagree with the premise to add a stabilizing veteran to the backend, I just don't think they needed both of them.

Quite the assumption. “Earn it” goes for him too and Sanheim and Provy. We slot them but really couldn’t it turn out very differently? Having both Niskanen and Braun make more options.
- NC Flyers Fan

agreed, assume is this board, always have to earn it in camp etc

Andy RodRichard

Both Niskanen and Braun are coming off bad seasons. Hoping for bounce back seasons from both of them is probably fools gold. I don't disagree with the premise to add a stabilizing veteran to the backend, I just don't think they needed both of them.
- PLindbergh31

Essentially we have 4 Dmen coming off bad seasons haha Ghost/Provy/Niskanen/Braun, should we be worried?

US men were so dominant in the early 90's (Chang and Courier in addition to the ones you mentioned). It was definitely a special time to be an American tennis fan. But yeah, Feds/Rafa/Joker are ridiculous... they'd destroy the guys from previous eras.

The women's side is what sets the early 90's apart for me, tho... Graf, Seles, Navritilova, Hingis were all such complete tennis players. Serena is GOAT (by far), but the other WTA players of this era are pretty forgettable.
- Tomahawk

I disagree on the women. Henen was great, retired early. I can't think of any way I'd ever forget Sharapova our Bouchard. The thing that I like about the women's game today is how it's not always the same 3-4 players in the finals, you get a lot of rotation.

I have him penciled in on the third pairing with meyers, Braun and Sanheim, Provy ?Niskanen. Don't see Hagg or Morin beating him out so wasn't worth mentioning. And he seems to do his own thing based on the comments from the old D coach, veteran leadership isn't affecting him much unless you are a Chris Pronger.
- ClaudeFather

I think Braun would be more beneficial to Ghost than to Sanheim. I hope by mid point of the season Myers play dictates he gets more minutes and plays with Sanheim.

Essentially we have 4 Dmen coming off bad seasons haha Ghost/Provy/Niskanen/Braun, should we be worried?
- ClaudeFather

I'd be more worried about Ghost and Provy. Niskanen and Braun can reinvent themselves with a fresh start in a new place with a bunch of young talent. Braun is playing for a contract. Both Niskanen and Braun should be energized.

Not really, do you honestly see Hagg or Morin being a better player next year than Ghost? I don't and if they are they had a hell of a summer.
- ClaudeFather

You missed a big part of the assumption is that it’s Sanheim and Provy are playing with Braun or Niskanen and Ghost isn’t in that mix.