Ryan Wilson: Penguins and Micheal Ferland Penguins and Micheal Ferland

So whats he going to get on the open market? 4 a year? more?

Pens are too hand-caped with sh!t contracts for this.

So whats he going to get on the open market? 4 a year? more?

Pens are too hand-caped with sh!t contracts for this.
- MattStrat

Some team will likely give him at least 4. RW made a pretty valid assessment; he's no great, not terrible, just okay. He can be a wrecking ball out there, which makes him more than the average bottom-6 player, but he'll definitely be overpaid around 4 or so. As he should (from his perspective).

From the last blog.....My money is on Kessel getting moved and Maata, possibly Hornquest.

It would be nice for JJ but I wouldn't bet on it. That would mean JR admitting failure...hes not gonna fall on his sword.

I like Ferland and $4M for him wouldn't be totally unreasonable (that's what we were paying Hags). All depends on trades and how the Pens clear out cap space.

The timing of this blog is absolutely terrible. There are so many other topics that could’ve been hit before this one. We’re over 6 weeks away from free agency rn and the dude is still playing. Why not check in on Penguins at the WHC? Why not discuss your own RFAs and what they might command since that helps dictate available cap space.. I would love to hear what Petts is worth since he propped up Kola, JJ, and Guds since coming over

Wasn’t it reported that management was making the big push for Brass??

If you look at next years crop of UFA forwards relative to this year it is amazingly thin. Teams will jump at the prospect of giving Ferland 5+ to avoid a ramped up trade market. This could be a big reason why an older guy like Zucc might get more than 3-4 years

Ryan Wilson: Penguins and Micheal Ferland
Penguins and Micheal Ferland
- Ryan_Wilson

But have you considered trading away all four stars for better leadership and grit?

If the Pens wind up having $5M to $6M to spend on a UFA, there are far better targets this year than Ferland. Not that I wouldn't mind him here, but they can do better for the money.

Dzingel ($4.5M is my guess)
Nyquist ($5.5M to $6M)
Zucc ($5.5 to $6M)
Hayes ($6M. He could play 3C and have Bjug move to wing in the top six)

Plus, after the success CAR has had, I have to think they'd do their best to keep him.

I like Ferland and $4M for him wouldn't be totally unreasonable (that's what we were paying Hags). All depends on trades and how the Pens clear out cap space.
- MacPatty

Ferland is certainly getting more than $4M. I will be surprised if he gets a penny less than $4.5M.

If the Pens wind up having $5M to $6M to spend on a UFA, there are far better targets this year than Ferland. Not that I wouldn't mind him here, but they can do better for the money.

Dzingel ($4.5M is my guess)
Nyquist ($5.5M to $6M)
Zucc ($5.5 to $6M)
Hayes ($6M. He could play 3C and have Bjug move to wing in the top six)

Plus, after the success CAR has had, I have to think they'd do their best to keep him.
- Rinosaur

I’m ok with this outlook except for Hayes. If we’re paying big money for someone to kill it at 3C and that player historically gets a chunk of their production on PP1 which he likely wouldn’t see in Pitt then I don’t think it makes sense

From Hayes standpoint: why would he go play guaranteed 3C with 16 minutes a night when he can return to the Rangers or head to Dallas, CBJ (when they lose Duchene), etc and get more minutes, better linemates, and likely more PP time. Makes no sense to me at this point in his career. I also think he might get a bit north of 6 and I think Dzingel gets 5, maybe 5.25

I’m ok with this outlook except for Hayes. If we’re paying big money for someone to kill it at 3C and that player historically gets a chunk of their production on PP1 which he likely wouldn’t see in Pitt then I don’t think it makes sense

From Hayes standpoint: why would he go play guaranteed 3C with 16 minutes a night when he can return to the Rangers or head to Dallas, CBJ (when they lose Duchene), etc and get more minutes, better linemates, and likely more PP time. Makes no sense to me at this point in his career. I also think he might get a bit north of 6 and I think Dzingel gets 5, maybe 5.25
- WSCTeton17

I’m just giving comparison options, man.

From Hayes standpoint: why would he go play guaranteed 3C with 16 minutes a night when he can return to the Rangers or head to Dallas, CBJ (when they lose Duchene), etc and get more minutes, better linemates, and likely more PP time. Makes no sense to me at this point in his career. I also think he might get a bit north of 6 and I think Dzingel gets 5, maybe 5.25
- WSCTeton17

Hayes would look great in an Avs sweater, and Phil would look great on his wing.

Hayes would look great in an Avs sweater, and Phil would look great on his wing.
- Za Warudo

And Rantanen would look fantastic on Malkin's wing.

And Rantanen would look fantastic on Malkin's wing.
- jmatchett383

Only one of these teams has a GM that is idiotically giving away skill for toughness and “pushback.”

It’s not unrealistic to think JR could fall in love with Nikita Zadorov and make him the centerpiece of a Phil trade.

Only one of these teams has a GM that is idiotically giving away skill for toughness and “pushback.”

It’s not unrealistic to think JR could fall in love with Nikita Zadorov and make him the centerpiece of a Phil trade.
- Za Warudo

What skill has he given away in exchange for toughness/pushback? The only one that I can think of is Sprong.

What skill has he given away in exchange for toughness/pushback? The only one that I can think of is Sprong.
- jmatchett383

Sundqvist for Reaves. Sundqvist has turned into a solid 3C/4C option.

And Rantanen would look fantastic on Malkin's wing.
- jmatchett383

Or Makar next to Letang.

I’m just giving comparison options, man.
- Rinosaur

And that’s fine, I’m not preventing you but I also don’t want to make the same mistake again. I don’t think taking a 2C and taking away their PP TOI and their top 6 wingers and making them a 3C is a huge recipe for success. I would much rather see how Bjugstad, Blueger, and McCann do at 3C and find a LW for Malkin that isn’t Bjugstad. I like the idea of Dzingel which is one you first mentioned I recall but I also like the idea of Nyquist

Sundqvist for Reaves. Sundqvist has turned into a solid 3C/4C option.
- j.boyd919

Yes, Sundqvist's 4 career points in 38 NHL games at 24 years old was an insane amount of skill to give up at that time.

Ryan Reaves actually had a higher P/60 last season than Sundqvist (1.0 vs. 0.68). Clearly, Sundqvist has a higher offensive upside, but up until 1+ year after the trade was made, Sundqvist was nothing more than an AHL tweener. Sundqvist had more upside, but hadn't shown it in his 5 years since being drafted.

What skill has he given away in exchange for toughness/pushback? The only one that I can think of is Sprong.
- jmatchett383

Opportunity Cost needs to be considered here.

For example, Connor Sheary’s salary turned into Jack Johnson. Even if you still move Sheary, whom else could have been paid with those funds?

Also, consider the Gudbranson trade. Tanner Pearson wasn’t the second coming of Kevin Stevens, but he wasn’t being paid for his fists like Guddy is. Whom else could have been acquired instead?

Opportunity Cost needs to be considered here.

For example, Connor Sheary’s salary turned into Jack Johnson. Even if you still move Sheary, whom else could have been paid with those funds?

Also, consider the Gudbranson trade. Tanner Pearson wasn’t the second coming of Kevin Stevens, but he wasn’t being paid for his fists like Guddy is. Whom else could have been acquired instead?
- Za Warudo

I'm not disagreeing that signing JJ wasn't as mistake, but it's not like he traded Sheary directly for JJ. Also, Pearson was pretty awful aside from his first game, and Gudbranson was maybe 1/3 decent (not quite half). So if you're gonna use "opportunity cost" and the Gudbranson trade as a sign that GMJR is an idiotic who likes to give away skill for toughness, I'm gonna disagree with you there.

I'm not disagreeing that signing JJ wasn't as mistake, but it's not like he traded Sheary directly for JJ.
- jmatchett383

The Sheary trade was explicitly made to clear cap space for JMFJ, there was zero ambiguity about it then or now.

The Sheary trade was explicitly made to clear cap space for JMFJ, there was zero ambiguity about it then or now.
- Za Warudo

Fair enough. Still, I see that as a single glaring example of an idiotic GM abandoning skill for toughness/pushback. Pearson for Guddy was one slow plodding forward for one other slow plodding defenseman. If anything, I'd say the Hagelin for Pearson panic trade was a bigger example that Pearson for Gudbranson.

Yes, Sundqvist's 4 career points in 38 NHL games at 24 years old was an insane amount of skill to give up at that time.

Ryan Reaves actually had a higher P/60 last season than Sundqvist (1.0 vs. 0.68). Clearly, Sundqvist has a higher offensive upside, but up until 1+ year after the trade was made, Sundqvist was nothing more than an AHL tweener. Sundqvist had more upside, but hadn't shown it in his 5 years since being drafted.
- jmatchett383

It was his age 22 season and he had better production in the AHL than Simon or Blueger. Pretending he had shown no potential is silly.

Add in Kostin for Lauzon and the trade gets even worse.

I’d be fine if we traded Kessel/J.Johnson packaged together and signed Nyquist and Dzingel or Ferland.