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Forums :: Blog World :: Justin Lowe: Spinning Out of Control or All According to Plan?
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Davewn
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: West Des Moines, IA
Joined: 12.16.2015

Dec 5 @ 9:27 AM ET
OMG! THIS - a thousand percent. The thing bugging me the most over the past two years is that they don’t seem to have any plan, other than tweaking and propping up. That’s the heart of why I don’t trust Stan or the rest of management. You nailed it.
- Marlowe


Cost certainty is the Stan Plan- fringe FA signings and trading for lesser players on longer, cheaper deals. Throw in the unrealistic belief that your older, unmovable core players will drink from the fountain of youth in the off season and "bounce back."
Chief4Feathers
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Post-Tank-alyptic World
Joined: 12.23.2010

Dec 5 @ 9:31 AM ET
I wouldn't believe everything you read. Or everything anybody says, either.
- 6628


Uh huh, well again, I’d encourage you to read the article by Powers.
6628
Joined: 08.24.2009

Dec 5 @ 9:32 AM ET
Uh huh, well again, I’d encourage you to read the article by Powers.
- Chief4Feathers



I don't have to.
Rota's Rooter
Chicago Blackhawks
Joined: 06.23.2017

Dec 5 @ 9:32 AM ET
How about Rockys interview on news radio 78.com yesterday, everybody’s wishing in one hand crappin the other thinking they’re going to trade everybody This year And teams are going to help us out.
I am sure they will investigate moves as it comes closer to the deadline. Personally I would like to see them land Artemi Panerin, probably at the strong behest of Patrick Kane which I totally agree with, But not at the risk of doing it now and possibly having to give up a kings ransomto the Jackets but rather just wait till the summer. I am sure Patrick Kane carries a lot of weight in this kids heart.
We know what was said about him wanting to be in the limelight and play on either coast, but when I think it is all said and done he will be a Hawk come next September.
Regarding the upcoming draft in the summer, and I could be looking at this in a completely different angle, but the animosity towards BLACKHAWKS and possibly some downright jealousy because of winning three Stanley cups and seven years, I would not put it past some teams if some of the races are Decided come March to dress crap Lineups when they play the Hawks enabling them to get on a little bit of a roll just enough to take them out of the Jack Hughes derby.
Speaking of past drafts, how is Brady Tkachuk looking now ?He would’ve looked damn good wearing the Indianhead this season, but our bull headed general manager decided to keep both of those picks and draft two small defenseman instead of the next generational big power forward. Spit balling with some of these things here,Once again do you trust Stan Bowman will do the right things this summer? Or do you think it is another case of a duck farting in shallow water!

- wonthecup10

And you know for a fact he didn't try? Buffalo was not going to give up 1st overall that leaves picks 2-5 that they could possibly trade with. If any of those teams was not willing to move their pick what are you going to do? It's like going to the drag strip, "race what you brung".
fattybeef
Joined: 05.04.2010

Dec 5 @ 9:34 AM ET
Panarin, while really really good isn't the best FA available. Getting really skick of people thinking hes a savior.

Id throw money at Skinner or Stone if they're available. Both younger, one a wing who burns the other basically HeMan. Gotta have different ways to beat guys and I think they should go after potential 40 goal players who go more north south then another fancy guy. Either Skinner or Stone with Toews and Saad would be crazy fast or crazy strong and i think there could be something to the Dinglecat Heavy D and Kane combo. Strome is going to be good.

And if you're going you're dump +10 million which Panarin will command if he continues to be over a ppg then get Karlsson who would be a much bigger help and make it easier to shelter and break in the younger players.

You can female dog about Toews and Seabrook all you want but the biggest problem is not being able to identify and develop middle tier defenders. Forsling, Gus, Rutta and Manning have been bad at hockey and should not be in those roles. As 10 minutes a night guys? Maybe. Def not first or second pairing talent there though. Will be interested to see if Keith Henri and Seabs Murphy can carry more of a load and if we see an immediate improvement.

Toews has looked faster and has been scoring at a rate we havent seen in a few years. He is definitely not the problem and for sure a first line center. Him and Bergeron are still the two best jack of all trades centers in the league.
Chief4Feathers
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Post-Tank-alyptic World
Joined: 12.23.2010

Dec 5 @ 9:38 AM ET
I don't have to.
- 6628


I’m sorry you’re feeling like such a d-bag this morning. I hope you get better soon.
6628
Joined: 08.24.2009

Dec 5 @ 9:39 AM ET
Uh huh, well again, I’d encourage you to read the article by Powers.
- Chief4Feathers



I'm not trying to be a Richard, but I don't have to ask any questions or read an article.
Tyler Cameron
Season Ticket Holder
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Toronto, ON
Joined: 10.31.2017

Dec 5 @ 9:44 AM ET
I've been doing a lot of thinking Drinking lately.

Fixed that for you JL.

Great Blog though!

- gnosox1986


That too.
Taylorst1
Chicago Blackhawks
Joined: 07.09.2018

Dec 5 @ 9:44 AM ET
Panarin, while really really good isn't the best FA available. Getting really skick of people thinking hes a savior.

Id throw money at Skinner or Stone if they're available. Both younger, one a wing who burns the other basically HeMan. Gotta have different ways to beat guys and I think they should go after potential 40 goal players who go more north south then another fancy guy. Either Skinner or Stone with Toews and Saad would be crazy fast or crazy strong and i think there could be something to the Dinglecat Heavy D and Kane combo. Strome is going to be good.

And if you're going you're dump +10 million which Panarin will command if he continues to be over a ppg then get Karlsson who would be a much bigger help and make it easier to shelter and break in the younger players.

You can female dog about Toews and Seabrook all you want but the biggest problem is not being able to identify and develop middle tier defenders. Forsling, Gus, Rutta and Manning have been bad at hockey and should not be in those roles. As 10 minutes a night guys? Maybe. Def not first or second pairing talent there though. Will be interested to see if Keith Henri and Seabs Murphy can carry more of a load and if we see an immediate improvement.

Toews has looked faster and has been scoring at a rate we havent seen in a few years. He is definitely not the problem and for sure a first line center. Him and Bergeron are still the two best jack of all trades centers in the league.

- fattybeef



Everything your saying is great, however for that to happen Stan needs to find a magical wand and the determination to move out Keith , Seabrook, anisomov and Gus, manning to have cap space to be a serious player come July 1st. And if history is a lessen Stan won't even due 2 % of what's needed to make this team better or happen.

I'd like to see toews and Crawford , Seabrook and or Keith in a package deal to maybe to Edmonton. For either Hopkins, nurse ,Talbot and drasain...

A young proven center , defenseman and Talbot is just giving us a piece to either flip or resign.
Z3Hawk
Chicago Blackhawks
Joined: 05.04.2017

Dec 5 @ 9:48 AM ET
I do not see the sense in moving any of the 3 players stated.

Gus barely makes minimum salary so where is the cap gain? Actually for the extra year on that contract, he is a bargain and would be unnecessarily easily snapped up.

Anisimov is one of the very few players we have who goes into the tough areas in the offensive zone and the further we get into his contract the less it is out of line. Also as thin as we are at the center position who do we have to replace him? Some may say to go the UFA route, but do you see what centers are going for?

Manning types are on every team. Our forwards are being mugged at the other end while their forwards get 5/6 whacks at the puck in our blue paint when we go with a roster full of soft defencemen. I would retain Manning and welcome Murphy back so we can retake possession of the area in front of our net. I also do not want to see Debrincat or other skilled players have to fight because they have no one backing them.

With the Cap rising to $83M so will players' salaries next year and I do not see these three salaries as out of line. I know changes are necessary, but those changes have to make sense.

- 67hawks


It would not matter if Gus played for free as he should not be in the NHL.
nickmo2699
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: IL
Joined: 01.06.2012

Dec 5 @ 10:01 AM ET
Panarin, while really really good isn't the best FA available. Getting really skick of people thinking hes a savior.

Id throw money at Skinner or Stone if they're available. Both younger, one a wing who burns the other basically HeMan. Gotta have different ways to beat guys and I think they should go after potential 40 goal players who go more north south then another fancy guy. Either Skinner or Stone with Toews and Saad would be crazy fast or crazy strong and i think there could be something to the Dinglecat Heavy D and Kane combo. Strome is going to be good.

And if you're going you're dump +10 million which Panarin will command if he continues to be over a ppg then get Karlsson who would be a much bigger help and make it easier to shelter and break in the younger players.

You can female dog about Toews and Seabrook all you want but the biggest problem is not being able to identify and develop middle tier defenders. Forsling, Gus, Rutta and Manning have been bad at hockey and should not be in those roles. As 10 minutes a night guys? Maybe. Def not first or second pairing talent there though. Will be interested to see if Keith Henri and Seabs Murphy can carry more of a load and if we see an immediate improvement.

Toews has looked faster and has been scoring at a rate we havent seen in a few years. He is definitely not the problem and for sure a first line center. Him and Bergeron are still the two best jack of all trades centers in the league.

- fattybeef


So you would rather grab Skinner who is one year younger with documented concussion problems over another goal scorer who has shown he has chemistry with your best asset. The Mark Stone love affair confuses me. He is a big fish in a small pond, we dont need Saad 2.0.

Fatty, you bring up a great point with the failure to develop the mid tier defense. I have never been a Bowman fan, but when you start to look at our system and the players in their given roles, it is clear Bowman isnt in the same league as a Dale Tallon. Outside of Hossa, Tallon drafted that core and did a great job doing so. I understand the hawks sucked so a lot of those picks were higher, but the Versteeg's and Brouwer's, etc. we dont see those in his draft history.
gazza53
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: IL
Joined: 09.15.2017

Dec 5 @ 10:02 AM ET
The plummet from the Hawks' "Golden Age" is tough to watch but it's not unexpected. A team of young guns with outstanding complimentary players glued together by the two way veteran Marian Hossa and other veterans. Right from the first cup the Hawks' started getting weaker, first the top end depth had to be moved, then some of the secondary veterans. When Hossa finally left the glue that held it all together was gone leaving a team with almost no depth,no cap room and five core players all on the downsides of their careers.

The only way to have avoided this freefall was to have started moving core players after the 2015 cup win. I know this for certain because hindsight makes me smarter than Bowman, or Q or McD or Rocky. But without hindsight how many here who are moaning about what the Hawks are today, would have been able to handle the Hawks trading Seabrook for some young prospects or draft picks? What if the rumour of the Sabres and the Hawks having a deal in place if the Sabres had won the lottery pick in McDavid's draft year, for A 26 year old patrick Kane were true? What if Toews were moved as a 26 or 27 year old for an up and coming Mark Scheifele? What if Keith was traded for some young guy? How about Crow? Posters on this site would have been jumping off buildings!

The Glory days are over, the Hawks are unlikely to get better until they get worse. Now we see what the Hawks organization is made of. Big decisions need to be made to rebuild the team. Unlike many fans who were whining and female doging about the Hawks when they were winning, I enjoyed the ride. Maybe that's why I'm not as angry and bitter as many of the fans who didn't enjoy the Blackhawk's Golden Age as much as I did.

- paulr


Actually trading Kane back when and keeping Buff/Ladd maybe another piece
would have been the smart move, I've often wondered about this. Do we still
win in 13/15? Having depth seems to matter.
Taylorst1
Chicago Blackhawks
Joined: 07.09.2018

Dec 5 @ 10:03 AM ET
You have beaudin, boquisvt, Carlson, Hillman , dahlen,,,,, that's 5 I named , whom at this point if you add Johki and forsling theirs your defenseman of the future.
nickmo2699
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: IL
Joined: 01.06.2012

Dec 5 @ 10:06 AM ET
Actually trading Kane back when and keeping Buff/Ladd maybe another piece
would have been the smart move, I've often wondered about this. Do we still
win in 13/15? Having depth seems to matter.

- gazza53


NO
Z3Hawk
Chicago Blackhawks
Joined: 05.04.2017

Dec 5 @ 10:08 AM ET
Actually trading Kane back when and keeping Buff/Ladd maybe another piece
would have been the smart move, I've often wondered about this. Do we still
win in 13/15? Having depth seems to matter.

- gazza53


You do not win a single Cup without Kane.
Taylorst1
Chicago Blackhawks
Joined: 07.09.2018

Dec 5 @ 10:11 AM ET
No significant changes will occur until:

1-Full buy in from the the owners that this team is in rebuild mode
2-Replacing Bowman and hire a capable GM
3-Moving on from the some of the core and shedding major salary
4-Replacing Q (done but Colliton is not the long term answer)

Putting out the same product and expecting the same result is delusional.

We went from early exits, to missing the playoffs, to last place in the division and now well on our way to last place in the league...hello!!! McFly, Hello!!!

To fix break glass and see above - 1 to 4

- Hawkster



Well summed up you hit the nail on the head.
scottak
Location: I am serious. And don't call me Shirley!
Joined: 08.06.2010

Dec 5 @ 10:18 AM ET
You have beaudin, boquisvt, Carlson, Hillman , dahlen,,,,, that's 5 I named , whom at this point if you add Johki and forsling theirs your defenseman of the future.
- Taylorst1

If history is our guide, only half of those guys will play significant time in the NHL, and maybe 1, or 2 if you're really lucky, will be impactful career NHLers.

Here are the Blackhawks D men drafts in 02 & 03

2002
Babchuk R1
Keith R2
Wisniewski R5
Kantee R6

2003
Seabrook R1
Barinka R2
Kukkonen R5
Byfuglien R8
Grenzy R9

So 1 HOFer, 2 outstanding All-Star level players and 1 just below All-Star. And 5 guys you never heard of, including on from R1. And these are unusually good drafts.
wonthecup10
Season Ticket Holder
Joined: 02.05.2008

Dec 5 @ 10:21 AM ET
Tkachuk went 4th to Ottawa.

Was there a deal out there to move up to get him? Probably not with Ottawa - who, don’t forget, traded their #1 to Colorado - which they decided to move until next draft which could be #1 overall. Moving two high first round picks would not have been palatible to whatever fan base remains.

- StLBravesFan



You’re probably right on that one, we don’t know what went on behind closed doors, I was just looking at it from something similar to what Ryan Pace did with the Bears, and was StanBowman trying to get aggressive and get into the top three or four pics?
Slofire94
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: CA
Joined: 01.17.2016

Dec 5 @ 10:22 AM ET
You do not win a single Cup without Kane.
- Z3Hawk




Some guys have a "killer instinct" which is what it takes to win and go the extra .01% past the stats/averages/predictions. To consistently win Championships, not presidents trophies, you need a guy like Kane, Keith (in his prime), arguably Toews 2010-2013 too.
You need guys that don't stop even after they've become the best.
Buff showed up out of shape to training camp.
Ladd has regressed into a lump of a cap hit.
If anyone disagrees, you're welcome to click the link below and hop on the band wagon.

https://tinyurl.com/ya7x6d8f

(Note: link isn't technically spam...)
67hawks
Joined: 08.30.2012

Dec 5 @ 10:26 AM ET
[quote=Z3Hawk]
It would not matter if Gus played for free as he should not be in the NHL.


Many were saying the same about Kempny.
And Washington again says "Thank You". This asset giveaway with virtually no return by this management needs to stop before this team can dig itself out of this hole.
Taylorst1
Chicago Blackhawks
Joined: 07.09.2018

Dec 5 @ 10:26 AM ET
If Stan told a reporter he was going after Panarin - wouldn’t that be against league rules about interfering with another team’s contracted player?
- StLBravesFan


Their was just a article the other day in second city I believe . That's what Stan said he is all in to get panarin next summer. I'm sure it's not interfering since it's well documented panarin has no intentions on resigning and teams like new york have made it clear he is on their radar.


The whole point is Stan is doing PR work to quiet the negativity that surrounds this team and BS the fans into having hope when its clear thier is no real plan to rebuild it's all nipping at the edges and hoping things work out.
pdx2ord
Season Ticket Holder
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Portland, OR
Joined: 09.02.2015

Dec 5 @ 10:31 AM ET
In addition to his being behind the eight ball when it comes to learning the tricks and tendencies of his NHL opponents and the skills of his own roster, this is the biggest challenge, IMO, to Colliton being able to succeed in the role he was thrust into:

"I have been watching very closely since Jeremy Colliton has taken over. It appears that there is some meddling with his decisions or possible "too many cooks in the kitchen"

If your (and my) read is right about the dynamics on the bench, he'll never get the respect of the veteran players, in particular. Especially those who are well aware of the Barry Smith history. And, unfortunately, unless the team leaders buy in and promote that way of thinking with the whole room, this is a disaster.

That whole PR line, repeated by Stan and McD at least, that Colliton really wanted Barry at his side, is eyeroll worthy.
Hawks_49
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Ottawa, ON
Joined: 04.28.2015

Dec 5 @ 10:32 AM ET


Some guys have a "killer instinct" which is what it takes to win and go the extra .01% past the stats/averages/predictions. To consistently win Championships, not presidents trophies, you need a guy like Kane, Keith (in his prime), arguably Toews 2010-2013 too.
You need guys that don't stop even after they've become the best.
Buff showed up out of shape to training camp.
Ladd has regressed into a lump of a cap hit.
If anyone disagrees, you're welcome to click the link below and hop on the band wagon.

https://tinyurl.com/ya7x6d8f

(Note: link isn't technically spam...)

- Slofire94


I agree with you, but I would extend that Toews run to 2015. He was a beast in the 2014 playoffs and in that Anaheim series in 2015, he was the one who set the tone late in the series.
glennjpawlak22
Joined: 11.26.2013

Dec 5 @ 10:33 AM ET
Jeremy Colliton is mad and he's got a reason to be. This team is not picking up on these tweaks and despite Stan Bowman's comments on Spittin' Chiclets that out of the 11 games that Jeremy has coached the Hawks have had 10 strong showings (form an effort level).

WTF kinda lying BS is this. They are unprepared for the starts of games, they fall behind and have not had a lead in regulation in over 7 games. Some effort shows up after they fall behind when the other team throttles back. STRONG SHOWINGS???


- bogiedoc


Stan Bowman spin machine!!!!
pdx2ord
Season Ticket Holder
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Portland, OR
Joined: 09.02.2015

Dec 5 @ 10:34 AM ET
Their was just a article the other day in second city I believe . That's what Stan said he is all in to get panarin next summer. I'm sure it's not interfering since it's well documented panarin has no intentions on resigning and teams like new york have made it clear he is on their radar.


The whole point is Stan is doing PR work to quiet the negativity that surrounds this team and BS the fans into having hope when its clear thier is no real plan to rebuild it's all nipping at the edges and hoping things work out.

- Taylorst1


I think they get around the interference rules by it being attributed to a "source." At least, that's what Dietz used when he made that assertion about going all in on Panarin. Powers confirmed in a Q&A on The Athletic yesterday that Panarin's camp is definitely listening, FWIW, but that it would come down to money.
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