Bad matchup tonight as the Blues were hungry to get a win after their terrible start.

There were a couple positvies tonight but overall, bad defensive laspes in theirnown end and I just feel bad for Corey.

Rutta being benched seems weird. He wasn't any worse than Manning IMO. Or Seabrook for that matter... he had a rough game.

Maybe he's on the move? I've heard more chatter in the last 24 hours about a possible move. So we'll see.
- Justin Lowe

I wouldn't mind trading some of the defensive quantity in the organization for some defensive quality. But I'd guess if Rutta goes it'll be for a draft pick.

Bad matchup tonight as the Blues were hungry to get a win after their terrible start.

There were a couple positvies tonight but overall, bad defensive laspes in theirnown end and I just feel bad for Corey.

Rutta being benched seems weird. He wasn't any worse than Manning IMO. Or Seabrook for that matter... he had a rough game.

Maybe he's on the move? I've heard more chatter in the last 24 hours about a possible move. So we'll see.
- Justin Lowe

And here I thought nothing good could come from this game ... here's hoping.

I wouldn't mind trading some of the defensive quantity in the organization for some defensive quality. But I'd guess if Rutta goes it'll be for a draft pick.
- matt_ahrens

he has some good moments but alot more bad ones

maybe the UC needs a new zamboni...

toews line was contained tonight...no push at all from them..

well mees think ward in tomorrow vs the oil...craw needs a break..

expect a much better game tomorrow and they will win in regulation...
- bogiedoc

No depth.

This is a one line team, and when they get shutdown, games like this will happen.

If McDavid is on the ice against anyone except 2-28 tm, look out.

Kane is a legend. Walks a top 10 Dman in the league in Pietrangelo like he’s an ECHLer. If Toews and Cat can continue to drive offense on line 1, with Schmaltz being a threat on line 3, and Kane being the US GOAT....scoring shouldn’t be an issue this year.

The defense will be an adventure all year as their #2 D is a 19yr old rookie that will have mistakes (see goal 1). With Seabs having nights like tn, Gus defensively challenged and turnover prone, and Manning/Rutta being marginal NHL players...better score 3+ every night.
- EnzoD

25 of 40 goals scored by three players - only 15 by the other 15 skating positions - 12 by the other 9 forward spots - in 11 games.

And AdB and Toews have slowed to a normal pace.

This team will have trouble scoring many nights.

They are a .500 team long term - 6 up 5 down now - good enuf to play well and win a couple, but not deep enough yet to string longer win streaks.

25 of 40 goals scored by three players - only 15 by the other 15 skating positions - 12 by the other 9 forward spots - in 11 games.

And AdB and Toews have slowed to a normal pace.

This team will have trouble scoring many nights.

They are a .500 team long term - 6 up 5 down now - good enuf to play well and win a couple, but not deep enough yet to string longer win streaks.
- StLBravesFan

Yes.

Well missed the game ,I also missed the TB game .I better not miss anymore games . Sounds like a real Halloween horror show by the post here . Scary but HAWKS will win some and lose some ,in this league anymore anyone can beat anybody on any given night .. GO HAWKS

Anyone else notice that shot blocking is not existent this season? One lost ain't all doom and gloom especially when the blues were playing very passionate hockey and got at least 6 powerplays.


Justin,

Any names or teams come up in the rumors? Assuming it's trading a roster D to get a draft pick to bring up forsling.

25 of 40 goals scored by three players - only 15 by the other 15 skating positions - 12 by the other 9 forward spots - in 11 games.

And AdB and Toews have slowed to a normal pace.

This team will have trouble scoring many nights.

They are a .500 team long term - 6 up 5 down now - good enuf to play well and win a couple, but not deep enough yet to string longer win streaks.
- StLBravesFan

Kahun has played well but he's going to be up and down as a rookie. I'm curious what Schmatz could do with ADB and Toews.

Q: every game is different

he says that alot...

and each night you see how true that is: coyotes who couldn't score the first 6-7 games beat the bolts 7-1 and the bolts skated the hawks out of the building last week.

Q: every game is different

he says that alot...

and each night you see how true that is: coyotes who couldn't score the first 6-7 games beat the bolts 7-1 and the bolts skated the hawks out of the building last week.
- bogiedoc

Speaking of different, I saw this stat in Sports Mockery, and, if true, pretty amazing. Wonder how it compares to the former greats whose stats he's chasing or current big name players:

Here’s the breakdown of the line combinations since Patrick Kane’s rookie season in 2007-08. During the regular season only, Kane has played on 2,355 different lines. During the playoffs only, Kane has played on 678 different lines. Overall, he has played on a whopping total of 3,033 different line combinations in the NHL. No, that is not a typo.

Any way you look at it, Patrick Kane is a phenomenal talent who excels despite never having any consistency to work with. (from Dobber’s Frozen Tools website)

That's what happens when you put the puck at the net. The Hawks have passed up more shots than they've taken. Way too much playing for pretty plays again.
And defenseman missing the net all night so no rebounds. BAD night for all.
Move on. Kruger and Kunitz out.....Kampf and Martinsen in.
- Hawkytalk

There was one sequence with the Kane line where they possessed and skated the puck endlessly but nobody including the D would take a freakin’ shot - just lunacy and sadly so much wasted effort. In a similar vein I understand that Gus loves Kane but he passes up great open shots to pass to Kane even if Kane not in a good position. Gotta stop.

Bad matchup tonight as the Blues were hungry to get a win after their terrible start.

There were a couple positvies tonight but overall, bad defensive laspes in theirnown end and I just feel bad for Corey.

Rutta being benched seems weird. He wasn't any worse than Manning IMO. Or Seabrook for that matter... he had a rough game.

Maybe he's on the move? I've heard more chatter in the last 24 hours about a possible move. So we'll see.
- Justin Lowe

I understand the Rutta benching. He makes loads of mistakes and and as a rule doesn’t physically engage at all. Before being benched he had a shift that was quite unbelievable to watch. He made more mistakes in one shift than some D-Men make over many games putting a cherry on top by taking a penalty.

Although Gus is a relatively older player he is still someone who needs to be babysitted. Gus simply does not concentrate on the defensive side of the game - at times he doesn’t pay attention to it at all. This leaves Seabs constantly attempting to do two jobs, his and Gus’s.

No matter how you spin it Crow was not good. I will take responsibilty for this, as I jinxed him saying he was playing like the best goalie in the NHL. I will now go back to only being critical of Crow for the sake of the team.

Kahun has played well but he's going to be up and down as a rookie. I'm curious what Schmatz could do with ADB and Toews.
- matt_ahrens

That's what I've been wondering. I've been thinking about putting Saad up there, but I'm fine with Schmaltz up there as well. He's played with Toews and Adb, just not at the same time. Kahun might do well with Kane or Fortin, depending on the line.

Hey Z3, I'm trying to agree with you, especially because I try to objectively look at the game/players as well. This might be a more subjective matter.

I don't think struggles are easy to guage. To say Crow has struggled more than Fleury. I'm not sure. Concussions, multiple for both. You have to look at the severity and length, but the players definitely know more about that than we do. Quick and Price are hurt every year, it seems, and puts their teams in bad situations a lot. They tend to be why their teams are good, they hide the flaws, but when it comes to the big test, only Quick and Crow shine above every other goalie, in my book. Fleury can be third. For Crow it went beyond concussions, he had a gaping hole on glove side, and shakey playoff starts. He outgrew those, and thinks the game more and is better prepared. I don't think that is enough to say he has struggled more, though.

I have a hard time sympathizing with Crow because he's a self-inflicted injury kind of guy. It took him some time to grow up, stop drinking, stop partying, stop being in bad situations because he has a kid and wife/gf (I'm not sure.) I feel like he knows what he can lose.

I think he's the best and Quick is right behind. Rinne, Rask, Bob, Lunq-head, Holtby, Price ... you can see the effects they have on their team's chances of winning. Rask and Holtby have won, but they definitely had their trials to get there. All goalies get injured, and they seem to have their tough playoff games where they can't settle in or settle down. That list of 6 plus others that didn't fall off of the top of my head I don't think are overrated, they are great regular season preformers, but the big stage changes everything.
- I Am The Breadman

In the play-offs the Kings won two titles without talent-laden teams because of Quick. Same for Vegas last year making the Final without a talent-laden team because of Fleury. In the Hawks two Cup runs with Crow he was an important part but not the part. All goalies struggle or have poor stretches or poor games but some like Price are viewed as more consistent. That is why he has been named the Team Canada starter over and over.

If you bring injuries and absences into the discussion it adds complexity but also confusion - important issues though.

Looking at him playing healthy I pull for Crow but he is a sine wave. His play can change game to game and even within a game. Last night early on I thought “Oops Bad Crow may be playing tonight.”

Even in the recent hot streak when he allowed one goal for three straight games, at least one of the goals was poorly played by Crow. On a break-away he stayed way too deep in his net and the shooter had lots of net to shoot at. Hard to criticize when a goalie is giving up one goal a game but when Crow goes off the rails he fails to cut angles properly, he “loses his net” often and he plays too deep and down leaving lots of the top of the net open." May have been just one goal at the time but if the bad habits sneak in it can lead to him struggling. Edzo talked of Crow “losing his net” last night. However, as I said Crow is a sine wave and I hope he bounces right back.

I recently said that Crow was playing like the best goalie in the NHL - not last night though.

[url]

That's what I've been wondering. I've been thinking about putting Saad up there, but I'm fine with Schmaltz up there as well. He's played with Toews and Adb, just not at the same time. Kahun might do well with Kane or Fortin, depending on the line.
- I Am The Breadman

At some point Kahun has to become more of a threat to score. He has scored only one goal. You can’t play top 6 and be extrapolated to score 7 or 8 goals. The thing that is troubling is he doesn’t seem to be getting scoring attempts at all. Now if he is deferring too much that is another problem.

Kahun has played well but he's going to be up and down as a rookie. I'm curious what Schmatz could do with ADB and Toews.
- matt_ahrens[/quote


It's definitely worth a try, it really doesn't hurt
the 3rd line either, 84-24-62 might be a good
pesty line that could also score.

I understand the Rutta benching. He makes loads of mistakes and and as a rule doesn’t physically engage at all. Before being benched he had a shift that was quite unbelievable to watch. He made more mistakes in one shift than some D-Men make over many games putting a cherry on top by taking a penalty.

Although Gus is a relatively older player he is still someone who needs to be babysitted. Gus simply does not concentrate on the defensive side of the game - at times he doesn’t pay attention to it at all. This leaves Seabs constantly attempting to do two jobs, his and Gus’s.

No matter how you spin it Crow was not good. I will take responsibilty for this, as I jinxed him saying he was playing like the best goalie in the NHL. I will now go back to only being critical of Crow for the sake of the team.
- Z3Hawk

The only problem with sitting Rutta is that this is the first
of a back to back, tonight against the oilers Seabs will look
a step slower and the two Brandons will be who they are.

rutta wasn't the only problem last night, 16 guys had off
nights, 19 if you add the coaches.

Speaking of different, I saw this stat in Sports Mockery, and, if true, pretty amazing. Wonder how it compares to the former greats whose stats he's chasing or current big name players:
- pdx2ord

That could be the most amazing stat in the history of sport

He's only played roughly what 950 games in total?

At some point Kahun has to become more of a threat to score. He has scored only one goal. You can’t play top 6 and be extrapolated to score 7 or 8 goals. The thing that is troubling is he doesn’t seem to be getting scoring attempts at all. Now if he is deferring too much that is another problem.
- Z3Hawk

Agree, I like his speed and stick handling, but the top line might be expecting too much of a rookie who doesn't have a lot of NA ice under his belt. What I've seen after his goal is that he skates around with the puck until it's lost, passes and it's shot by one of the other 2, or its a shot deflected. He doesn't get good scoring chances, but he isnt making them either. I think the third line would be good for him with Johnson and Fortin, and Schmaltz play first wing.

Speaking of different, I saw this stat in Sports Mockery, and, if true, pretty amazing. Wonder how it compares to the former greats whose stats he's chasing or current big name players:
- pdx2ord

Just some questions:

What is a separate line? Does a change of one player indicate a separate line?

Kane is often double-shifted (triple/quadruple) in a struggling game - so even if his line remains intact, he could be on 3/4 separate lines during a game.

How does this compare to other “superstars” over the same period of games?

In the play-offs the Kings won two titles without talent-laden teams because of Quick. Same for Vegas last year making the Final without a talent-laden team because of Fleury. In the Hawks two Cup runs with Crow he was an important part but not the part. All goalies struggle or have poor stretches or poor games but some like Price are viewed as more consistent. That is why he has been named the Team Canada starter over and over.

If you bring injuries and absences into the discussion it adds complexity but also confusion - important issues though.

Looking at him playing healthy I pull for Crow but he is a sine wave. His play can change game to game and even within a game. Last night early on I thought “Oops Bad Crow may be playing tonight.”

Even in the recent hot streak when he allowed one goal for three straight games, at least one of the goals was poorly played by Crow. On a break-away he stayed way too deep in his net and the shooter had lots of net to shoot at. Hard to criticize when a goalie is giving up one goal a game but when Crow goes off the rails he fails to cut angles properly, he “loses his net” often and he plays too deep and down leaving lots of the top of the net open." May have been just one goal at the time but if the bad habits sneak in it can lead to him struggling. Edzo talked of Crow “losing his net” last night. However, as I said Crow is a sine wave and I hope he bounces right back.

I recently said that Crow was playing like the best goalie in the NHL - not last night though.


- Z3Hawk[url]

I like your synopsis of Crow being up and down and some other goalies. I agree.

I wonder how much of the recent play of Crow will always be Crow? It's the mental side he has always struggled with. It's also his team that puts him in the bad situation. If there is a breakaway, Crow is deep in the net. The team played poorly last night, and Crow had several noticeable mistakes. A lot of pk'ing and Crow couldn't stop them all. Crow wouldn't have been good the TB game (it was a back-to-back) but also the team in front of the net minder was bad. Crow will always be my guy, but I think it's a chain reaction (while still in the early phases of coming back from not playing for 10 months) if the team is bad, Crow will be too. Even when Crow would steal a win, there were flaws in his game.

Speaking of different, I saw this stat in Sports Mockery, and, if true, pretty amazing. Wonder how it compares to the former greats whose stats he's chasing or current big name players:
- pdx2ord

Mind blowing stat, would like to know if 1 player changed makes it a whole separate line? (StLBravesFan question as well.) Wonder how many different separate lines Toews has played on?

This message has been brought to you by the Q blender. It works on fruits and veggies AND hockey players.

In the play-offs the Kings won two titles without talent-laden teams because of Quick. Same for Vegas last year making the Final without a talent-laden team because of Fleury. In the Hawks two Cup runs with Crow he was an important part but not the part. All goalies struggle or have poor stretches or poor games but some like Price are viewed as more consistent. That is why he has been named the Team Canada starter over and over.

If you bring injuries and absences into the discussion it adds complexity but also confusion - important issues though.

Looking at him playing healthy I pull for Crow but he is a sine wave. His play can change game to game and even within a game. Last night early on I thought “Oops Bad Crow may be playing tonight.”

Even in the recent hot streak when he allowed one goal for three straight games, at least one of the goals was poorly played by Crow. On a break-away he stayed way too deep in his net and the shooter had lots of net to shoot at. Hard to criticize when a goalie is giving up one goal a game but when Crow goes off the rails he fails to cut angles properly, he “loses his net” often and he plays too deep and down leaving lots of the top of the net open." May have been just one goal at the time but if the bad habits sneak in it can lead to him struggling. Edzo talked of Crow “losing his net” last night. However, as I said Crow is a sine wave and I hope he bounces right back.

I recently said that Crow was playing like the best goalie in the NHL - not last night though.


- Z3Hawk[url]

you are entertaining to banter with because you are so wrong

Quick in 2014 was not that great..he and crow had similar stats in the CF as the pucks were going in and similar stats for the entire 2014 playoffs. So Quick carried a non talent laden team with williams winning the con smythe and the likes of kopitar, carter, doughty, gaborick etc..

craw = sine wave a guy who easily is the MVP and rock of the team from 2103 through his injury last year; and should have won the CS in 2013..

i dont know what is with cory deniers like you but the facts and record don't support it

you are entertaining to banter with because you are so wrong

Quick in 2014 was not that great..he and crow had similar stats in the CF as the pucks were going in and similar stats for the entire 2014 playoffs. So Quick carried a non talent laden team with williams winning the con smythe and the likes of kopitar, carter, doughty, gaborick etc..

craw = sine wave a guy who easily is the MVP and rock of the team from 2103 through his injury last year; and should have won the CS in 2013..

i dont know what is with cory deniers like you but the facts and record don't support it
- bogiedoc

I agree that LA was a very talented team and Quick was a great goaltender. Best hockey I've ever seen, and I'm still bitter about the defeat.
You only talk about Playoff Crow, not regular season. Crow had shakey Playoff games as well as lights out Playoff games.

Crow is one of the best, but looking at regular season games really helps one see the up and down play of Crow. Normally, in the Playoff years, towards the end of the season is where the hawks string together a lot of losses, and Crow got pulled in several of them, and then come into the Playoffs kicking ass.