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Forums :: Blog World :: Justin Lowe: Possible Line Combinations: Defence + Training Camp Notes
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EnzoD
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Denver, CO
Joined: 02.19.2014

Sep 17 @ 1:34 PM ET
Well, that's just false. Kunitz is like Sharp - he was beating age curves but still declining in a gradual manner and then kind fell off two seasons in a row. Sharp was due to injury and Kunitz is just old for a hockey player.

The reality is that Kunitz hasn't been effective as anything but a 3/4 liner, and last year he was replacement level 4th liner. I mean, last season he only scored as much as he did by shooting well over his recent sh%, had less than one shot a game (baffling), and then only one point the entire playoff run for Tampa last season. They had him as their 12/13th forward in terms of TOI for a reason.

There's nothing wrong with this btw. Kunitz has had a good career and he might be useful in a limited lower line role, but to suggest he can be effective on ANY line is just silly. Sometimes grizzled vet just means old. Dude is 38 ffs.

- L_B_R



Exactly. It would be ideal if Hayden could jump up and provide the physicality and net front presence with Toews+Cat on line one.
EnzoD
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Denver, CO
Joined: 02.19.2014

Sep 17 @ 1:35 PM ET
Or how about your clever and hilarious Seabrook trades you post on every thread. Got you're a pathetic liece of sh1t.
- GPHawksfan






Also, I would think this post CLEARLY violates the Hockeybuzz Code of Conduct. Can we get this angry person banned accordingly??
I Am The Breadman
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Richton Park, IL
Joined: 09.16.2018

Sep 17 @ 1:38 PM ET
Exactly. It would be ideal if Hayden could jump up and provide the physicality and net front presence with Toews+Cat on line one.
- EnzoD


I wouldn't be against reuniting Hayden with Toews. He assisted on his first career goal after all. I think it would be nice if they could also pair together on the pk. Kings of the shorthander, when Hossa isn't in a hawks uniform.
BetweenTheDots
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: IL
Joined: 06.13.2015

Sep 17 @ 1:40 PM ET
That's BS Q destroyed Murphy and Forsberg confidence right from the start of the season .Also bounced Vinny all over the place , and had him in the A for no good reason . Carry 8 D to mess with all defense .Pretty much anyone Stan brings in goes directly to Q dog house .. Only one who shouldn't have a future is Q ..IMO ..To me the elephant in the room is behind the bench for far far to long now ..Step up Stan do the right thing ..My weekly rant your welcome GO HAWKS !!!!
- oldduffman


Be that as it may, it still doesn't account for Murphy being slower footed than Seabrook last year, i like his physicality, his shot, but there is no amount of coaching that is going to give him the ability to skate with NHL players. Sometimes a duck is a duck. Admit the mistake and its just time to move on.
GPHawksfan
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: AB
Joined: 01.26.2018

Sep 17 @ 1:41 PM ET



Also, I would think this post CLEARLY violates the Hockeybuzz Code of Conduct. Can we get this angry person banned accordingly??

- EnzoD

Quick! The main page has a rumor that Nurse is available, better get over there and make a hilarious Seabrook proposal, you Logan Paul look alike
EnzoD
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Denver, CO
Joined: 02.19.2014

Sep 17 @ 1:43 PM ET
Be that as it may, it still doesn't account for Murphy being slower footed than Seabrook last year, i like his physicality, his shot, but there is no amount of coaching that is going to give him the ability to skate with NHL players. Sometimes a duck is a duck. Admit the mistake and its just time to move on.
- BetweenTheDots


Connor Murphy also makes more money than Josh Morrisey....

Theo Fox
Chicago Blackhawks
Joined: 06.18.2016

Sep 17 @ 1:48 PM ET
Well, that's just false. Kunitz is like Sharp - he was beating age curves but still declining in a gradual manner and then kind fell off two seasons in a row. Sharp was due to injury and Kunitz is just old for a hockey player.

The reality is that Kunitz hasn't been effective as anything but a 3/4 liner, and last year he was replacement level 4th liner. I mean, last season he only scored as much as he did by shooting well over his recent sh%, had less than one shot a game (baffling), and then only one point the entire playoff run for Tampa last season. They had him as their 12/13th forward in terms of TOI for a reason.

There's nothing wrong with this btw. Kunitz has had a good career and he might be useful in a limited lower line role, but to suggest he can be effective on ANY line is just silly. Sometimes grizzled vet just means old. Dude is 38 ffs.

- L_B_R

If that's what the advanced stats say, I'm not going to argue against it. Yet I do think Kunitz will be a valuable player this season. I don't like him as a 1st liner but okay for brief spurts. Personally I've penciled him in as the 4th line LW for much of the season.

Btw, what does "replacement level" mean exactly? Not being snarky but you use this term a lot and I just don't have a grasp of the definition (generally I'm not an advanced stats person). From what I can gather, it seems to not be a good a thing if a player is considered replacement level.
BetweenTheDots
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: IL
Joined: 06.13.2015

Sep 17 @ 1:54 PM ET
Connor Murphy also makes more money than Josh Morrisey....
- EnzoD


And the thing is i want him to be good, it could be coaching where he gets caught to far up ice, but at times when he's in great defensive position I've seen way too many times the forward skate alongside the wall and get behind him and go right across the goalies crease. Unless he's really worked on his transitional skating he's really an AHL defenseman.
67hawks
Joined: 08.30.2012

Sep 17 @ 1:55 PM ET
Blackhawks Talk Retweeted

Charlie Roumeliotis‏Verified account @CRoumeliotis · 30m30 minutes ago

#Blackhawks working on power play with 1-3-1 setup.
Unit 1: Toews, Kane, Schmaltz, DeBrincat, Keith.
Unit 2: Saad, Sikura, Ejdsell, Kunitz, Gustafsson.


Here we go again!
We are doomed before we start.
I Am The Breadman
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Richton Park, IL
Joined: 09.16.2018

Sep 17 @ 2:00 PM ET
Blackhawks Talk Retweeted

Charlie Roumeliotis‏Verified account @CRoumeliotis · 30m30 minutes ago

#Blackhawks working on power play with 1-3-1 setup.
Unit 1: Toews, Kane, Schmaltz, DeBrincat, Keith.
Unit 2: Saad, Sikura, Ejdsell, Kunitz, Gustafsson.


Here we go again!
We are doomed before we start.

- 67hawks



No Anisimov, who takes the face off on the 2nd unit? Ejdsell who we like as a winger?
ikeane
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Jacksonville, FL
Joined: 11.04.2005

Sep 17 @ 2:01 PM ET
Saw this:
Some footage of #Blackhawks PP1 unit using the new 1-3-1 Power Play scheme

Schmaltz-Toews-Kane
Keith-DeBrincat

I’m loving the crisp, clean passing. Nothing fancy or cute.pic.twitter.com/muOe4TIR5Y

— ✶ ✶Tony Gianares✶ ✶ (@Certified_TonyG) September 17, 2018


One thing I missed seeing here was SHOOT THE PUCK!
BetweenTheDots
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: IL
Joined: 06.13.2015

Sep 17 @ 2:04 PM ET
I also believe that the core players took the year off last year, maybe even Kane but unlike everyone else Kane could get away with it, he's that kind of talent. So we'll see if not making the playoffs had any affect. I know it did in number 7 he said he couldn't believe he was a healthy scratch last year.

Also this whole gripe of 8 defenseman last year, i can tell you this Q didn't want to do this but at the same time he was probably telling those 6-7 defensemen anytime one of you want to step up the job is yours.
L_B_R
Chicago Blackhawks
Joined: 02.23.2014

Sep 17 @ 2:07 PM ET
If that's what the advanced stats say, I'm not going to argue against it. Yet I do think Kunitz will be a valuable player this season. I don't like him as a 1st liner but okay for brief spurts. Personally I've penciled him in as the 4th line LW for much of the season.

Btw, what does "replacement level" mean exactly? Not being snarky but you use this term a lot and I just don't have a grasp of the definition (generally I'm not an advanced stats person). From what I can gather, it seems to not be a good a thing if a player is considered replacement level.

- AEL_Fox

This is one of those cases I feel like stats and eye test line up perfectly. I peer-reviewed some tracking for Tampa games and Kunitz was rundown imo. Kunitz is still smart and fundamentally knows what to do, gives good effort obvs, but he's slowed down so much it's hard for him to do the things needed, esp in t6 roles.

As for replacement level, it's all about the value of a player - obviously some players have more value than others - so replacement level is the value of a player that that can perform a role at bare minimum (performance and usually money-wise). This player is below average but can technically do the job. At the NHL level, replacement level is somewhere between a 4th line skater and a career AHLer that gets called up from time to time.

Kunitz skewed more 4th line than AHL last season, but it was still 4th line 12th forward type of guy. Maybe he has great chemistry with another player or has a lightning in a bottle type of season (ala Handzus) but realistically he's replaceable as a 4th line player.
ObeseOprah
Chicago Blackhawks
Joined: 01.17.2014

Sep 17 @ 2:10 PM ET
Blackhawks Talk Retweeted

Charlie Roumeliotis‏Verified account @CRoumeliotis · 30m30 minutes ago

#Blackhawks working on power play with 1-3-1 setup.
Unit 1: Toews, Kane, Schmaltz, DeBrincat, Keith.
Unit 2: Saad, Sikura, Ejdsell, Kunitz, Gustafsson.


Here we go again!
We are doomed before we start.

- 67hawks


Ejdsell is getting PP time over Anisimov, that's odd but if Kunitz is playing the net front spot I get it. If Jokiharju is playing I'd love to see him get a look at 2nd PP QB. Seabrook also could be more valuable than Gustafsson but all of this is rather moot when the first PP typically takes up most of the time.
L_B_R
Chicago Blackhawks
Joined: 02.23.2014

Sep 17 @ 2:16 PM ET
Connor Murphy also makes more money than Josh Morrisey....
- EnzoD

Only because Murphy is signed for longer. If Morrisey had really wanted a long-term deal, he'd be looking at Hanifin/Slavin/Dumoulin contracts. Think he's betting big that he'll be able to be higher than that in two years.

This is why looking at cap hit without context, esp term, can be misleading.
EnzoD
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Denver, CO
Joined: 02.19.2014

Sep 17 @ 2:25 PM ET
Only because Murphy is signed for longer. If Morrisey had really wanted a long-term deal, he'd be looking at Hanifin/Slavin/Dumoulin contracts. Think he's betting big that he'll be able to be higher than that in two years.

This is why looking at cap hit without context, esp term, can be misleading.

- L_B_R


A good point, but Morrisey is younger and just a much better player. IIRC he has been 1 or 2 on WPG in terms of Quality of Competition the last few years.
hpk90
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: North Potomac, MD
Joined: 12.13.2011

Sep 17 @ 2:28 PM ET
Exactly. It would be ideal if Hayden could jump up and provide the physicality and net front presence with Toews+Cat on line one.
- EnzoD


Yes! I think this is exactly what the organization is hoping for; Hayden to step up and be the power forward his size suggests he could be.
BetweenTheDots
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: IL
Joined: 06.13.2015

Sep 17 @ 2:43 PM ET
Lots of chatter about Boqvist coming from camp, things like must watch, nice to hear.
L_B_R
Chicago Blackhawks
Joined: 02.23.2014

Sep 17 @ 2:45 PM ET
A good point, but Morrisey is younger and just a much better player. IIRC he has been 1 or 2 on WPG in terms of Quality of Competition the last few years.
- EnzoD

Morrisey wasn't younger at contract signing, though - Murphy and Morrisey were/are both 23 when they signed their 2nd contracts, Murphy was just 2 years ago. Gotta remember that Murphy was a big fairly mobile defense first 1st rounder that was skating as Yotes #3 the year of his contract - hell, technically he and Morrisey had really similar TOI and comparable usage in that final ELC year. Morrisey's results are better, though, which is why he's more valuable.

So I do agree that Morrisey is better, and that is why he'd be in the $5m range of players if he had gone long-term while Murphy got $3.8m. It's all about term.

Short term, Murphy's bridge would have been in the $2 range - $2.5m tops - but Arizona opted to go longer term with a moderately higher cap hit to potentially save in those later years. Sometimes longer deals work best, sometimes they don't. Murphy's value is fine for a #4 - he just needs to be played there. Those longer second deals are why Klingberg's contract is a steal right now. Morrisey wanted a bridge so that he can maximize his next contract, when he'll have arbitration rights. It's risk either way.

1-3 year deals cannot be compared to 5-8 year deals as they are inherently completely different. It's the same how deals pre-2013 cannot be compared to those signed after - context/parameters around the deals are just different.
Theo Fox
Chicago Blackhawks
Joined: 06.18.2016

Sep 17 @ 2:48 PM ET
This is one of those cases I feel like stats and eye test line up perfectly. I peer-reviewed some tracking for Tampa games and Kunitz was rundown imo. Kunitz is still smart and fundamentally knows what to do, gives good effort obvs, but he's slowed down so much it's hard for him to do the things needed, esp in t6 roles.

As for replacement level, it's all about the value of a player - obviously some players have more value than others - so replacement level is the value of a player that that can perform a role at bare minimum (performance and usually money-wise). This player is below average but can technically do the job. At the NHL level, replacement level is somewhere between a 4th line skater and a career AHLer that gets called up from time to time.

Kunitz skewed more 4th line than AHL last season, but it was still 4th line 12th forward type of guy. Maybe he has great chemistry with another player or has a lightning in a bottle type of season (ala Handzus) but realistically he's replaceable as a 4th line player.

- L_B_R

Thanks for the description. Very informative and helpful!
I Am The Breadman
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Richton Park, IL
Joined: 09.16.2018

Sep 17 @ 3:03 PM ET
2 years 3.2 AAV for Nurse to stay in Edm.
breadbag
Location: Edmonton, AB
Joined: 11.30.2015

Sep 17 @ 3:22 PM ET
Agree with this point about improving defensive positioning and defending the area between the bluelines. Make it tough to gain the zone. No easy entries, please. Also, make the other team pay for crashing the net and setting up shop.
- AEL_Fox


I really want to see them protect that middle and down low area much better. So often last year, guys were beat wide or chasing and nobody had the open man in the dangerous area. Oesterle to me, was the worst offender on the blueline for just leaving guys way too much room to operate. It isn't just the D, a lot of the younger forwards weren't especially solid on backchecking either, but I just hope they can give the goalies more support.
breadbag
Location: Edmonton, AB
Joined: 11.30.2015

Sep 17 @ 3:29 PM ET
Blackhawks Talk Retweeted

Charlie Roumeliotis‏Verified account @CRoumeliotis · 30m30 minutes ago

#Blackhawks working on power play with 1-3-1 setup.
Unit 1: Toews, Kane, Schmaltz, DeBrincat, Keith.
Unit 2: Saad, Sikura, Ejdsell, Kunitz, Gustafsson.


Here we go again!
We are doomed before we start.

- 67hawks


I'm surprised Gus isn't on PP Unit 1, he did really well on the PP in the last couple months of the season. I like when they played 1-3-1 and I have a good feeling about that first unit. Those 5 could really cause some movement for the PK.
Tyler Cameron
Season Ticket Holder
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Toronto, ON
Joined: 10.31.2017

Sep 17 @ 3:34 PM ET
Or how about your clever and hilarious Seabrook trades you post on every thread. Got you're a pathetic liece of sh1t.
- GPHawksfan


GP - that's enough. This post has been reported.

Guys and Gals... let's start this season with a little more level headedness and maturity. Once again, I deal with enough of this stuff at home, I don't have the energy to police adults from fighting over hockey.

Please message me directly if you have an issue.
Tyler Cameron
Season Ticket Holder
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Toronto, ON
Joined: 10.31.2017

Sep 17 @ 3:36 PM ET
No Anisimov, who takes the face off on the 2nd unit? Ejdsell who we like as a winger?
- I Am The Breadman


Anisimov was their PPG leader last year. Maybe they are just trying something new because they know what they have in him. He will be back on there at some point is my guess.

Maybe Ejdsell takes the draw on that 2nd unit.
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