Lee Stempniak, Torrey Mitchell, Toby Enstrom come on down.
- RickJ

I am waiting until closer to the off-season to find out that enstrom and sbisa got training camp invites if there is no other movement

Sometimes bad contracts are moved at the TDL so a team can make a bigger move, but it usually costs a pretty penny. I've never heard of a team that isn't in contention making a move like that, though, because the price is typically higher. I don't think anyone on LTIR is moved in season, but idk for sure. And even still, most teams knew right around where the cap floor would be and not many were ever going to under, so there wasn't much incentive for them to do anything in a hurry. I'm guessing most teams wanted at least the #27 for take Hossa, if not more. If so, I'm glad nothing was done - the only options in FA that were any good priced themselves too high even with more cap room or asked for way too much term.

Anyway, just for kicks, I looked at some of the most recent moves regarding players on IR who were traded. Vegas was the team taking on a bunch of LTIR players last summer, though they themselves only put them on IR since they didn't need the space.

The most comparable to Hossa was David Clarkson. Vegas got to draft Karlsson and added in a 2017 1st (#24) + 2019 2nd in return for Vegas also taking Clarkson and to not touch Korpisalo or Josh Anderson. Clarkson's cap hit was $5.25m for an additional 3 years but insurance covers all but 20% of his salary, so Vegas only has to pay 1.4m in 2017-18, $950k in 2018-19 and $650k in 2019-20.

Then there was Grabovski who the Islanders gave up a 2017 1st, 2019 2nd, and prospect Jake Bischoff. Salary was $5m but it's unknown if any was paid by insurance or not.

Because of the expansion draft, both these deals happened in June and Datsyuk's happened at the draft because 1st rounds were needed, but some LTIR trades seem to happen later in the season. Like Bolland's.

In 2016, Datsyuk + 2016 1st (#16) + Vitale were traded for 2016 1st (#20) + 2016 2nd (#53). Vitale was included due to needing to send a contract back to Detroit. Datsyuk was paid nothing. Later that summer in August, Bolland + Lawson Crouse (former 11th overall 2015) were traded for a 2017 3rd + conditional 2018 2nd were traded to Arizona. Bolland's cap hit was $5.5m but they only had to pay $1.1m thanks to insurance. 2016 was the season Arizona was desperate to reach the cap floor. Maybe the Sens end up desperate as well toward the end of the summer if Karlsson is move but then Bolland is a decent comparable - that move took a top prospect but got back a couple of picks.
- L_B_R

Honestly those prices are just too steep for a team that's in between.

I'd rather they hold on to Hossa's contract, and if they are a playoff team then you can make deals at the trade deadline, but Bowman has to max out and make sure he has all $5+ mil of LTIR available.

Yes - it seems they understand that a lot needs to go right for them to contend for a Cup this year - rebounds from the core, quality jumps from the youngsters - and that there isn’t a reasonably acquired free agent that would get them there without a lot of other work.

That being the case - no reason to push moving Hossa’s contract if it requires a quality accompanying high quality asset.
- StLBravesFan

I’m fully ok with them not dealing a pick or asset to yours and elbows point. No point to. Not now. They will need all their young assets moving forward

Eugene Melnyk would likely sign off on a Hossa for Bobby Ryan trade in a millisecond. Especially in September when he sees his season ticket sales have topped out at about 5000.
- RickJ

Saad/Toews/Ryan ?

My silly lol is you don't give Schmaltz 7 mil per...... And I'll let Sage jump in on Stamkos and his tax savings in Floridastan.
- Mr Ricochet

My only take on the tax issue this summer is that it seems not to have made much difference in signing the beg UFAs.

Tavares to Toronto, JvR to Philadelphia, Cole and Calvert to Colorado, Kovalchuk to LAK, Johnson back with the Pens, Thornton and Hertl back with SJ - not much excitement going to Florida or Texas or the other low-tax states.

UPDATE: "a lot of moving parts here, but Hawks are aggressively trying to move Hossa's contract (heard that before) to maybe help out a team that is trying to acquire a big contract."


Heard that above from one of my contacts.

My thinking would be, it's obviously Karlsson, although my guy didn't want to specify anything.

Could something like this work for all parties:

1) CHI trades Hossa, Forsling and Connor Murphy for Zack Smith : OTT gets a RHD at cost certainty that could slide into there top 4. They also get Forsling who could play this year for them... all while having CHI take Z. Smith off their hands whom they've been trying to move.

2) CHI trades picks/prospects to Tampa Bay for Anton Stralman: Stralman is a RHD and a UFA after this year. He's a perfect style to play alongside Duncan Keith. With this move, it frees up $$ for Yzerman to acquire and extend Erik Kalrsson.

Just spitballing here, but this Karlsson acquisition is getting interesting with only a few teams still in the mix.

Tampa really wants to make a move of this magnitude to counter what Toronto did with the Tavares signing.

Ugh.....again if they wanted to move it after the season ended they would have. If you read reports Lebrun powers there were talks. What held it up? No idea. It didn’t happen. If they, Hawks wanted it done, it would have been done. Just like many players before hossa.

It’s most likely not happening now and after getting burnt on the bickell deal it may not happen any time soon. As I don’t see them giving up a pick or decent prospect to make it happen. Could they? Sure. Will they? Highly doubt it.

I just realize it’s a rebuild. Adding Justin Faulk or any sexy name like that right now isn’t catapulting this team into the playoffs.
- SteveRain

Oxymoron!

UPDATE: "a lot of moving parts here, but Hawks are aggressively trying to move Hossa's contract (heard that before) to maybe help out a team that is trying to acquire a big contract."


Heard that above from one of my contacts.

My thinking would be, it's obviously Karlsson, although my guy didn't want to specify anything.

Could something like this work for all parties:

1) CHI trades Hossa, Forsling and Connor Murphy for Zack Smith : OTT gets a RHD at cost certainty that could slide into there top 4. They also get Forsling who could play this year for them... all while having CHI take Z. Smith off their hands whom they've been trying to move.

2) CHI trades picks/prospects to Tampa Bay for Anton Stralman: Stralman is a RHD and a UFA after this year. He's a perfect style to play alongside Duncan Keith. With this move, it frees up $$ for Yzerman to acquire and extend Erik Kalrsson.

Just spitballing here, but this Karlsson acquisition is getting interesting with only a few teams still in the mix.

Tampa really wants to make a move of this magnitude to counter what Toronto did with the Tavares signing.
- Justin Lowe

If we were to make the first trade with the Sens, we would realize a net gain of over $6M in cap space. Why would we spend that on Stralman?

UPDATE: "a lot of moving parts here, but Hawks are aggressively trying to move Hossa's contract (heard that before) to maybe help out a team that is trying to acquire a big contract."


Heard that above from one of my contacts.

My thinking would be, it's obviously Karlsson, although my guy didn't want to specify anything.

Could something like this work for all parties:

1) CHI trades Hossa, Forsling and Connor Murphy for Zack Smith : OTT gets a RHD at cost certainty that could slide into there top 4. They also get Forsling who could play this year for them... all while having CHI take Z. Smith off their hands whom they've been trying to move.

2) CHI trades picks/prospects to Tampa Bay for Anton Stralman: Stralman is a RHD and a UFA after this year. He's a perfect style to play alongside Duncan Keith. With this move, it frees up $$ for Yzerman to acquire and extend Erik Kalrsson.

Just spitballing here, but this Karlsson acquisition is getting interesting with only a few teams still in the mix.

Tampa really wants to make a move of this magnitude to counter what Toronto did with the Tavares signing.
- Justin Lowe

Stralman is EXACTLY what this team needs and would fit like a glove with Keith. And the fact that he’s an expiring contract makes it even more enticing in case the Hawks flame out again and commit to a rebuild next season with organizational and behind the bench changes.

Didn’t think he’d be moved but if EK ends up in Tampa maybe it might make some sense.

Trying to learn something here, but some of you usuals are so snotty on this thread.
- RedFeather

Because based on how long people have been commenting on this site is related to how much knowledge they have. Good luck with an opinion, you'll be called names and shunned.

If we were to make the first trade with the Sens, we would realize a net gain of over $6M in cap space. Why would we spend that on Sralman?
- 67hawks

He explains why they would get Stralman, and Literally the next line down after he mentions Stalman, he says “just spitballing here”.

Is it that you don’t like Stralman? Who would you rather get with that money?

I've said this numerous times but the diluted talent pool due to the cap and having a few too many teams really makes it anyone's Cup. Except for really horrifically run teams like the Oilers, Islanders or senators.

I'm not sure what else they could have done. It's not like any other team got significantly better this off season. They didn't throw any bad money around. Other than de Haan there weren't a whole lot of reasonable deals made.

They're not backed up against the cap, they still have three hall of fame players on the team. Not sure what else they could have done.

He explains why they would get Stralman, and Literally the next line down after he mentions Stalman, he says “just spitballing here”.

Is it that you don’t like Stralman? Who would you rather get with that money?
- Chunk

Added advantage that EK stays in the East too!

UPDATE: "a lot of moving parts here, but Hawks are aggressively trying to move Hossa's contract (heard that before) to maybe help out a team that is trying to acquire a big contract."


Heard that above from one of my contacts.

My thinking would be, it's obviously Karlsson, although my guy didn't want to specify anything.

Could something like this work for all parties:

1) CHI trades Hossa, Forsling and Connor Murphy for Zack Smith : OTT gets a RHD at cost certainty that could slide into there top 4. They also get Forsling who could play this year for them... all while having CHI take Z. Smith off their hands whom they've been trying to move.

2) CHI trades picks/prospects to Tampa Bay for Anton Stralman: Stralman is a RHD and a UFA after this year. He's a perfect style to play alongside Duncan Keith. With this move, it frees up $$ for Yzerman to acquire and extend Erik Kalrsson.

Just spitballing here, but this Karlsson acquisition is getting interesting with only a few teams still in the mix.

Tampa really wants to make a move of this magnitude to counter what Toronto did with the Tavares signing.
- Justin Lowe

This would be an excellent set of moves. Gets rid of Hossa and Murphy, upgrades Murphy big time with Stralman, get some center depth with Smith, and leaves $3.375 to fill in the bottom six with Rockford Guys.

Wonder if Daddy B was called in to talk with Stevie Y to help bail out Stan.....

Genius if it works. If for no other reason than to ice a team that can play a little better, allowing the young guys to get better in Rockford, and what should be more cap space freedom next season.

My only take on the tax issue this summer is that it seems not to have made much difference in signing the beg UFAs.

Tavares to Toronto, JvR to Philadelphia, Cole and Calvert to Colorado, Kovalchuk to LAK, Johnson back with the Pens, Thornton and Hertl back with SJ - not much excitement going to Florida or Texas or the other low-tax states.
- StLBravesFan

Not what I meant. When Stamkos was a FA there was a 396 page debate on what signing in the confederacy would or would not cost/save Stamkos. IIRC you pointed out there wasn't a whole lot of difference, at least not as much as most thought.

At the risk of sparking another debate, it won't come from me though, correct me if I'm wrong.

I've said this numerous times but the diluted talent pool due to the cap and having a few too many teams really makes it anyone's Cup. Except for really horrifically run teams like the Oilers, Islanders or senators.

I'm not sure what else they could have done. It's not like any other team got significantly better this off season. They didn't throw any bad money around. Other than de Haan there weren't a whole lot of reasonable deals made.

They're not backed up against the cap, they still have three hall of fame players on the team. Not sure what else they could have done.
- fattybeef

Yep, pretty much. Outside of Tavares the free agent list seemed as deep as a kiddie pool.

UPDATE: "a lot of moving parts here, but Hawks are aggressively trying to move Hossa's contract (heard that before) to maybe help out a team that is trying to acquire a big contract."


Heard that above from one of my contacts.

My thinking would be, it's obviously Karlsson, although my guy didn't want to specify anything.

Could something like this work for all parties:

1) CHI trades Hossa, Forsling and Connor Murphy for Zack Smith : OTT gets a RHD at cost certainty that could slide into there top 4. They also get Forsling who could play this year for them... all while having CHI take Z. Smith off their hands whom they've been trying to move.

2) CHI trades picks/prospects to Tampa Bay for Anton Stralman: Stralman is a RHD and a UFA after this year. He's a perfect style to play alongside Duncan Keith. With this move, it frees up $$ for Yzerman to acquire and extend Erik Kalrsson.

Just spitballing here, but this Karlsson acquisition is getting interesting with only a few teams still in the mix.

Tampa really wants to make a move of this magnitude to counter what Toronto did with the Tavares signing.
- Justin Lowe

Wow this would be great. I believe Smith has jam. Stralman is just what our D needs for at least this year.

UPDATE: "a lot of moving parts here, but Hawks are aggressively trying to move Hossa's contract (heard that before) to maybe help out a team that is trying to acquire a big contract."


Heard that above from one of my contacts.

My thinking would be, it's obviously Karlsson, although my guy didn't want to specify anything.

Could something like this work for all parties:

1) CHI trades Hossa, Forsling and Connor Murphy for Zack Smith : OTT gets a RHD at cost certainty that could slide into there top 4. They also get Forsling who could play this year for them... all while having CHI take Z. Smith off their hands whom they've been trying to move.

2) CHI trades picks/prospects to Tampa Bay for Anton Stralman: Stralman is a RHD and a UFA after this year. He's a perfect style to play alongside Duncan Keith. With this move, it frees up $$ for Yzerman to acquire and extend Erik Kalrsson.

Just spitballing here, but this Karlsson acquisition is getting interesting with only a few teams still in the mix.

Tampa really wants to make a move of this magnitude to counter what Toronto did with the Tavares signing.
- Justin Lowe

That first trade is a big overpayment to move Hossa imo. Forsling may be what is needed to get Hossa moved but the rest just breaks down. Maybe if it was Pageau instead who is younger, it'd be different but Zack Smith is not worth that. It'd be like having given up Hjammer for Zack Smith? Really?? Moving a young top 4 RD for a 4C is not a good look unless you're making space for someone else that will be a long term solution. Bringing me to Stralman...

I really like Stralman, he's really great, but he's going to want around Seabrook money on his next deal, which will start when he's 33. Even if he only wants 5 years, that's another player locked up for huge dollars until he's 38. The same that complain about big contracts with old players like this?? Unless they think Stralman is the last piece to being a cup contender this season, they're better off keeping Murphy at his cap hit.

Yep, pretty much. Outside of Tavares the free agent list seemed as deep as a kiddie pool.
- 6628

At the end of the day after the kiddies and dogs splashed around, muddy and shallow.

UPDATE: "a lot of moving parts here, but Hawks are aggressively trying to move Hossa's contract (heard that before) to maybe help out a team that is trying to acquire a big contract."


Heard that above from one of my contacts.

My thinking would be, it's obviously Karlsson, although my guy didn't want to specify anything.

Could something like this work for all parties:

1) CHI trades Hossa, Forsling and Connor Murphy for Zack Smith : OTT gets a RHD at cost certainty that could slide into there top 4. They also get Forsling who could play this year for them... all while having CHI take Z. Smith off their hands whom they've been trying to move.

2) CHI trades picks/prospects to Tampa Bay for Anton Stralman: Stralman is a RHD and a UFA after this year. He's a perfect style to play alongside Duncan Keith. With this move, it frees up $$ for Yzerman to acquire and extend Erik Kalrsson.

Just spitballing here, but this Karlsson acquisition is getting interesting with only a few teams still in the mix.

Tampa really wants to make a move of this magnitude to counter what Toronto did with the Tavares signing.
- Justin Lowe

Obviously OTT will move Karlsson and as a result there is no more attractive player to get to the floor with anywhere than Hossa. Therefore IMO these two will be a fit.

Stralman a steady vet player, no doubt. But picks and prospects for a 31 yr old who is a UFA in next yr? What's the long game with this kind of player for the Hawks? Sure a 4th or 5th for TB to clear space but trade anything of significance, why?

Not what I meant. When Stamkos was a FA there was a 396 page debate on what signing in the confederacy would or would not cost/save Stamkos. IIRC you pointed out there wasn't a whole lot of difference, at least not as much as most thought.

At the risk of sparking another debate, it won't come from me though, correct me if I'm wrong.
- Mr Ricochet

No, I think you're correct with players somehow getting hit with taxes in each tax-state that they play in - but I still haven't been able to figure out exactly how - it's apparently more complicated than I would have thought.

Of course, the limitation on SALT deductions in the Trump tax law hasn't helped much, but the tax burden is at least somewhat equalized throughout the league.

This would be an excellent set of moves. Gets rid of Hossa and Murphy, upgrades Murphy big time with Stralman, get some center depth with Smith, and leaves $3.375 to fill in the bottom six with Rockford Guys.

Wonder if Daddy B was called in to talk with Stevie Y to help bail out Stan.....

Genius if it works. If for no other reason than to ice a team that can play a little better, allowing the young guys to get better in Rockford, and what should be more cap space freedom next season.
- Return of the Roar

Where do you get $3.375?

5.275 + 3.85 = 9.125
3.25 + 4.5 = 7.75
Difference = 1.375

Even if you add in Forsling (which you shouldn't since he doesn't count against the cap currently) it's $2.25m

No, I think you're correct with players somehow getting hit with taxes in each tax-state that they play in - but I still haven't been able to figure out exactly how - it's apparently more complicated than I would have thought.

Of course, the limitation on SALT deductions in the Trump tax law hasn't helped much, but the tax burden is at least somewhat equalized throughout the league.
- StLBravesFan

I'm not sure how exact it is, but here is TSN's Tavares calculator: https://www.tsn.ca/nhl/tavares-calculator

No, I think you're correct with players somehow getting hit with taxes in each tax-state that they play in - but I still haven't been able to figure out exactly how - it's apparently more complicated than I would have thought.

Of course, the limitation on SALT deductions in the Trump tax law hasn't helped much, but the tax burden is at least somewhat equalized throughout the league.
- StLBravesFan

Forgot about the "Makers Tax" on non-confederate states Trumpanzee has been able to get thru. That wasn't around when Stamkos was a UFA.

That first trade is a big overpayment to move Hossa imo. Forsling may be what is needed to get Hossa moved but the rest just breaks down. Maybe if it was Pageau instead who is younger, it'd be different but Zack Smith is not worth that. It'd be like having given up Hjammer for Zack Smith? Really?? Moving a young top 4 RD for a 4C is not a good look unless you're making space for someone else that will be a long term solution. Bringing me to Stralman...

I really like Stralman, he's really great, but he's going to want around Seabrook money on his next deal, which will start when he's 33. Even if he only wants 5 years, that's another player locked up for huge dollars until he's 38. The same that complain about big contracts with old players like this?? Unless they think Stralman is the last piece to being a cup contender this season, they're better off keeping Murphy at his cap hit.
- L_B_R

Its about cap space and flexibility too. Its about moving Hossa’s deal first and foremost.

They lose Murphy’s three more years for a huge upgrade in Stralman that has an expiring contract. Now they have options: resign him as part of the future, deal him later, or let him go.

They get some center depth - we all would rather have Pageau, but not going to happen as Melnyk wants to move bigger contracts.

And oh yeah - Murphy sucks. Why stay in a nearly $4MM AAV with guy who you still have to coach up to whatever his level is?