Coupled with a 19 exit, I hope so
- riozzo

This continued desire to dump Toews is just ridiculous. Poor numbers or not, he is still your top center by a WIDE margin. The Hawks are not in the same cap hell anymore and you need to separate the player from the cap hit. Propose to me a trade for Toews that doesn't signal a 3-5 year gap until the Hawks return to contending.

Curious what do you think it takes in trade to get Faulk and what kind of contact would de Haan be looking for?
- walleyeb1

For the Faulk trade, I recall the rumor that JJ reported was the Hawks 27th for Faulk. Not sure if that's straight up or if that's just the basis of a trade with other assets being added to either/both sides. Then I saw others propose trades involving Hossa+ other assets going to Carolina.

As for de Haan, Justin or someone else stated the salary to be around $4.5-4.9MM. I believe Faulk makes $4.9.

This continued desire to dump Toews is just ridiculous. Poor numbers or not, he is still your top center by a WIDE margin. The Hawks are not in the same cap hell anymore and you need to separate the player from the cap hit. Propose to me a trade for Toews that doesn't signal a 3-5 year gap until the Hawks return to contending.
- TheTrob

The quandary you cite is exactly why it is going to take 3-5 years no matter what.

If Toews is in fact your best center, that speaks volumes right there. Sorry, but I see no evidence of a meaningful return to productivity from him.

Schmaltz still lacks the physical and face off win prowess to truly be called a 2C. IMHO - he's slotted out of position to his strengths and best slotted as an NHL winger.

Who else do they have? AA, Kampf, and Edjsell...

If they can't dump another $10MM, how can they really establish meaningful effective center depth any sooner than 3-5 years from now? Tavares?? And Toews?? How much will Tavares want? The last thing this team needs is another albatross contract.

They still are in cap hell, though just not as bad. They have a shot at filling a few spots with contracts above league minimum. with an upper limit of $75MM they have about $11.5MM if you give them Hossa's LTIR money. Maybe they get another $2-3MM in new cap money based on the NHLPA escalator. AND, they only have eight forwards under contract.

Honestly, there is no scenario - keeping 19 or trading 19 - that fixes anything sooner than 3-5 years from now, unless they get a good return for Toews and he agrees to go.

This continued desire to dump Toews is just ridiculous. Poor numbers or not, he is still your top center by a WIDE margin. The Hawks are not in the same cap hell anymore and you need to separate the player from the cap hit. Propose to me a trade for Toews that doesn't signal a 3-5 year gap until the Hawks return to contending.
- TheTrob

You make a fair point. But, if you can get rid of a $10.5mil player whose on ice production more closely reflects a $5mil player with signs of further regression being likely,and then sign Tavares for $10mil who is younger and far more productive...it’s a positive move IMO. Probably not happening this summer, but another dismal year from Toews and he may be the Fleury to Seattle’s expansion....

This continued desire to dump Toews is just ridiculous. Poor numbers or not, he is still your top center by a WIDE margin. The Hawks are not in the same cap hell anymore and you need to separate the player from the cap hit. Propose to me a trade for Toews that doesn't signal a 3-5 year gap until the Hawks return to contending.
- TheTrob

Why does there have to be a 3-5 year gap? If Toews is moved it will be as part of a re-tooling of the team. There are no play-off teams this year that seem overwhelmingly solid. All of them have holes. Washington which seems in line to win the Cup at this point does not have 6 Doughtys on D. Same for Vegas. Same for all the play-off teams. Nor did any team in the play-offs have 9 Gretskys at forward.

Simple formula for success. Have good coaching or at least coaching that is not destructive. A good team can even have success if the coach just gets out of the way. In the case of Vegas and Washington their coaches are positives, employing D and F schemes that give the team a chance. Have great goaltending - Fleury and Rinne last year played huge roles in getting their teams to the Final. When they faltered in the Final this exposed their teams. Have your best players be your best players while having your role players chip in.

The Hawks have more than enough of a talent pool right now to be competetive and there will be changes. There are lots of indices that can be looked at to show that the Hawks last year were not far away.

While it's fun to speculate I would expect Forsberg to get another shot at the back-up role, assuming Crawford is healthy enough to start.

Due to Crawford's injury Forsberg was but in a position he wasn't ready for. I would guess the plan was to have Forsberg serve as back-up for a couple years while gradually increasing his workload. Instead he was forced to start more games than he was ready for.

If Crawford sustains a similar injury this season I would expect the Hawks to trade for a goalie (i.e. a veteran with an expiring contract) but keep Forsberg as the back-up.
- DarthKane

This is the problem, you shove your boat off from shore and it starts taking water 1 mile out......

If they're 1-2 months in and Crow gets dizzy we see the same situation as last yr. Forseberg, if he stinks we have Delia and Glass again and the new Fin Lankinen. The chance to sign a Ward, Lethonen, Hutchinson has passed and they are forced to go with what they have or give up assets for a stop gap.

Hopefully they know about Crow's health before the season starts and proceed as needed.

Luke Johnson has been added to the Blue Team in the Chicago Pro Hockey League.

I really hope this kid has a strong camp in the fall and makes the team. He made some real solid progress this season in Rockford. If the doesn't make the team to start the season I'd expect him to him one of the first call-ups.
- DarthKane

IMO Johnson has a real chance to be a top 1/2 tier 3C in this league. Love his path. 2 yrs USHL, 3 yrs NCAA and 2 full yrs AHL. All things being equal this is a perfect developmental path done slowly and at the players pace not being rushed.

For what it's worth Johnson played a 2 way game at the pivot going all the way back to his USHL days with Lincoln. https://www.eliteprospect...player/94247/luke-johnson

This continued desire to dump Toews is just ridiculous. Poor numbers or not, he is still your top center by a WIDE margin. The Hawks are not in the same cap hell anymore and you need to separate the player from the cap hit. Propose to me a trade for Toews that doesn't signal a 3-5 year gap until the Hawks return to contending.
- TheTrob

Propose me a S/C competitive roster that can support 30-33M for only 3 players, and going to the next 5 and your at 60M. thats 60M for 8 players.

This is the problem, you shove your boat off from shore and it starts taking water 1 mile out......

If they're 1-2 months in and Crow gets dizzy we see the same situation as last yr. Forseberg, if he stinks we have Delia and Glass again and the new Fin Lankinen. The chance to sign a Ward, Lethonen, Hutchinson has passed and they are forced to go with what they have or give up assets for a stop gap.

Hopefully they know about Crow's health before the season starts and proceed as needed.
- Mr Ricochet

The Crow situation was handled terribly last season. Seemed that not a single person in the organization would make the big and necessary decision concerning his potential to play. You can’t have a “hope for the best” approach to goaltending - it is simply too important. Right now the Hawks are in the same situation but at least they have the off-season to address it. Crow either has long-term health or he does not.

Why does there have to be a 3-5 year gap? If Toews is moved it will be as part of a re-tooling of the team. There are no play-off teams this year that seem overwhelmingly solid. All of them have holes. Washington which seems in line to win the Cup at this point does not have 6 Doughtys on D. Same for Vegas. Same for all the play-off teams. Nor did any team in the play-offs have 9 Gretskys at forward.

Simple formula for success. Have good coaching or at least coaching that is not destructive. A good team can even have success if the coach just gets out of the way. In the case of Vegas and Washington their coaches are positives, employing D and F schemes that give the team a chance. Have great goaltending - Fleury and Rinne last year played huge roles in getting their teams to the Final. When they faltered in the Final this exposed their teams. Have your best players be your best players while having your role players chip in.

The Hawks have more than enough of a talent pool right now to be competetive and there will be changes. There are lots of indices that can be looked at to show that the Hawks last year were not far away.
- Z3Hawk

This. In this hard cap world no team is without holes and if they don't have cap problems they soon will.

As you mention good coaching and I would add good GMing in managing the cap just enough and adding the right players to "reasonably" fill what holes you're bound to have like WSH did with Kempny, PITT with Daley, the Hawks with Vermette.

I now consider my self a pessimist on Hawk chances but in the back of my mind I realize a team in this hard cap league can get better fast. Of course a core (monied players taking big cap space) has to be productive.

The Crow situation was handled terribly last season. Seemed that not a single person in the organization would make the big and necessary decision concerning his potential to play. You can’t have a “hope for the best” approach to goaltending - it is simply too important. Right now the Hawks are in the same situation but at least they have the off-season to address it. Crow either has long-term health or he does not.
- Z3Hawk

Right on and IMO it was embarrassing. Your organIzation depth at goaltending is so horrid you have a 32 yr old career minor leaguer in Glass, a 25 yr old 7th rounder with decent success in the AHL but none in the NHL and an ECHL free agent in Delia as well as Berube as your answer if something goes wrong with your #1?

Now if you went in to a season with organIzational depth and had a string of freak injuries to your top 3 guys I understand but if you go in, as you say, with a hope and a prayer your #1 will be healthy all yr that is IMO a firing offense.

You make a fair point. But, if you can get rid of a $10.5mil player whose on ice production more closely reflects a $5mil player with signs of further regression being likely,and then sign Tavares for $10mil who is younger and far more productive...it’s a positive move IMO. Probably not happening this summer, but another dismal year from Toews and he may be the Fleury to Seattle’s expansion....
- EnzoD

It seems he will either get back to 60+ points, a solid 2 way game or they will have to buy him out, no? Do the Hawks have buyout options left should they need it?

The backup goalie in Chicago is like the backup QB in Chicago—a surefire hall of famer, until he plays a few games and everyone comes back to earth.

Forsberg's GAA and save%, while not spectacular, were actually better than some #1's in the league—and playing behind a sub-standard defense. Too early likely to write him off (he also had a handful of stellar games against good teams, facing 40+ shots) and too early to anoint Delia.

But people need things to talk about in the offseason.
- John Jaeckel

The difference here is the starter is good (really good) and other than a few fans who still don't recognize Crawford's ability most people aren't ecstatic that the backup is taking the net vs a long line of backup Bear QB's people were clamoring for til they saw them throw a few passes in an NFL game.

The quandary you cite is exactly why it is going to take 3-5 years no matter what.

If Toews is in fact your best center, that speaks volumes right there. Sorry, but I see no evidence of a meaningful return to productivity from him.

Schmaltz still lacks the physical and face off win prowess to truly be called a 2C. IMHO - he's slotted out of position to his strengths and best slotted as an NHL winger.

Who else do they have? AA, Kampf, and Edjsell...

If they can't dump another $10MM, how can they really establish meaningful effective center depth any sooner than 3-5 years from now? Tavares?? And Toews?? How much will Tavares want? The last thing this team needs is another albatross contract.

They still are in cap hell, though just not as bad. They have a shot at filling a few spots with contracts above league minimum. with an upper limit of $75MM they have about $11.5MM if you give them Hossa's LTIR money. Maybe they get another $2-3MM in new cap money based on the NHLPA escalator. AND, they only have eight forwards under contract.

Honestly, there is no scenario - keeping 19 or trading 19 - that fixes anything sooner than 3-5 years from now, unless they get a good return for Toews and he agrees to go.
- Return of the Roar

Unless Toews has a bounce back year this upcoming season, which IMO is very likely.

This. In this hard cap world no team is without holes and if they don't have cap problems they soon will.

As you mention good coaching and I would add good GMing in managing the cap just enough and adding the right players to "reasonably" fill what holes you're bound to have like WSH did with Kempny, PITT with Daley, the Hawks with Vermette.

I now consider my self a pessimist on Hawk chances but in the back of my mind I realize a team in this hard cap league can get better fast. Of course a core (monied players taking big cap space) has to be productive.
- Mr Ricochet

When you think of last season there was much across the board that seemed embarrassing - a word you perfectly used to describe the goaltending situation. StanBo and Q not only were not on the same page but couldn’t even find the page. Hard to have a positive approach to personnel in this atmosphere. Was hard to watch the on-ice and off-ice chaos. Seems Rocky is very upset which I consider good.

Unless Toews has a bounce back year this upcoming season, which IMO is very likely.
- ToewsdNKanefusd

Based on what ? It just seems as though he is actually declining. How does he go about reversing that? And if it really has been injury related, he's still gotten older in the mean time. Everyone's healing capacities decline as we age. So seriously, how does he become the dynamic force he once was? When numerous posters here who are far more enlightened than myself seem to think he won't.

Sparks is playing in this league, too. I could see him getting a PTO this fall.
- AEL_Fox

Sparks will still be Toronto property next year on a one way contract.

For the Faulk trade, I recall the rumor that JJ reported was the Hawks 27th for Faulk. Not sure if that's straight up or if that's just the basis of a trade with other assets being added to either/both sides. Then I saw others propose trades involving Hossa+ other assets going to Carolina.

As for de Haan, Justin or someone else stated the salary to be around $4.5-4.9MM. I believe Faulk makes $4.9.
- AEL_Fox

Justin had a trade proposal of hossa 27th forsling to Carolina for faulk something along those lines.

I propose, just being a arm chair gm so just spitballing until something actually happens.

Hawks trade:
27th 3rd forsling and Duclair/hino and hossa's contract

Carolina trade:
Faulk and darling

This continued desire to dump Toews is just ridiculous. Poor numbers or not, he is still your top center by a WIDE margin. The Hawks are not in the same cap hell anymore and you need to separate the player from the cap hit. Propose to me a trade for Toews that doesn't signal a 3-5 year gap until the Hawks return to contending.
- TheTrob

I think the Hawks could get a could return for Toews. I'm not dumping on the guy, but I do feel it's time to make the move if you can get some good return back.

Justin had a trade proposal of hossa 27th forsling to Carolina for faulk something along those lines.

I propose, just being a arm chair gm so just spitballing until something actually happens.

Hawks trade:
27th 3rd forsling and Duclair/hino and hossa's contract

Carolina trade:
Faulk and darling
- Scott1977

And there goes 80% of their cap space for one D guy and a $4MM backup goalie, with five forwards left to sign just to have a full roster. So then it is last year’s team again plus one top four D guy.

Justin had a trade proposal of hossa 27th forsling to Carolina for faulk something along those lines.

I propose, just being a arm chair gm so just spitballing until something actually happens.

Hawks trade:
27th 3rd forsling and Duclair/hino and hossa's contract

Carolina trade:
Faulk and darling
- Scott1977

No, Darling is broken. Until he shows he can perform again there shouldn't be any talk of trading for him.

Also, you're losing about $1.7mil cap space so it kind of defeats the whole purpose of getting rid of Hossa's contract doesn't it?

And there goes 80% of their cap space for one D guy and a $4MM backup goalie, with five forwards left to sign just to have a full roster. So then it is last year’s team again plus one top four D guy.
- Return of the Roar

Crawford would be traded if hawks got darling!

Crawford would be traded if hawks got darling!
- Scott1977

So same as last half of last year (no reliable starting or backup goalie) plus one top four D guy, with only $4-5MM left to sign five forwards....

Worse in net, a little better on D, same group of signed forwards with the I-Pass shuffle again for the other five forward slots.

On balance, same or worse results, paying our top six forwards $253,000 per goal scored for a last place finish.

Did you actually watch Forsberg?

He STINKS!!!

Take the numbers & burn them.

Guy is a BUST!

So same as last half of last year (no reliable starting or backup goalie) plus one top four D guy, with only $4-5MM left to sign five forwards....

Worse in net, a little better on D, same group of signed forwards with the I-Pass shuffle again for the other five forward slots.

On balance, same or worse results.
- Return of the Roar

I really hope the Hawks don't try and bring Darling back.

I said it yesterday...I'm tired of this trend of brining ex-players back. Not to mention, I think Darling potentially showed his true ability last year in CAR. not saying he can't bounce back, but I don't want the Hawks to take a chance finding out.

I don't think Crow will be back, but if they can strengthen the blueline, then we can get a guy that doesn't need to stand on his head every night. Hawks can get a reliable guy that can make the save to keep them in it. Would love to get Hutton back and then put Forsberg as the backup.