But at least some of the Rockfishers will have at least some role in Chicago - some/most/all of Kamph, Hayden, Forsling, maybe Ejdsell, maybe Martinsen - nice for them to get some "pressure hockey" at the pro level.
- StLBravesFan

This team needs speed, and guys who play bigger but are not prone to moronic penalties. Probably the reason Hartman was shipped out, and not surprisingly, scratched already in Nashville. People point to 72's "bad playoffs" they should also go back and watch Hartman implode vs Nashville last year. Very surprised Poile took him on seeing it first hand.

IN my perfect world they trade a Toews or Keith, guys on the decline but still valued by other teams, and then you sign Karlsson long term. A team out east getting exposed by lack of D could easily fit Keith in and slot him at top pair or 2nd pair.

And the Hawks would take him back in a minute, for the right price and contract.

Saying the trade was a loss for Chicago isn’t nonsense - I don’t believe it, but it’s a valid viewpoint - the problem is it’s just so incessant.

Let’s just hope our side of that deal comes back strong next next year.
- StLBravesFan

What does that mean “the Hawks would take him back in a minute, for the right price and contract”? The problem is the right price and contract doesn’t exist for him. Hawks would not take him back for his present contract. He presently makes 6M and someone will likely give him more. Panarin is who Panarin is. He is an offensive player who can be shut down and can disappear. I predicted he’d be shut down if the Caps played even slightly smarter and he was. He was also raking on the PP but that production can disappear quickly.

This team needs speed, and guys who play bigger but are not prone to moronic penalties. Probably the reason Hartman was shipped out, and not surprisingly, scratched already in Nashville. People point to 72's "bad playoffs" they should also go back and watch Hartman implode vs Nashville last year. Very surprised Poile took him on seeing it first hand.

IN my perfect world they trade a Toews or Keith, guys on the decline but still valued by other teams, and then you sign Karlsson long term. A team out east getting exposed by lack of D could easily fit Keith in and slot him at top pair or 2nd pair.
- SteveRain

If you're trading older declining players and the plan is to get younger, why would you sign Karlsson to a long term deal. Heals almost thirty already too. Plus he isn't a free agent until next year.

When I think of any club's farm team, I generally categorize that team's player as one of the following:

1) Legit prospects who have the potential to not only earn a spot in the NHL but be able to stick year in and year out as an everyday player.

2) Prospects who may have enough to earn call-ups here and there to fill in for injuries, suspensions, etc. but likely will be back on the farm once the player they are subbing in for is able to return.

3) Prospects who are great AHL players and will likely be career minor leaguers but are experienced enough to bring a winning attitude and work ethic to a farm team.

For #3, I believe that is what Justin is referring to when he talked about adding Clendening and DiDomineco back into the fold: both are really good AHL players but probably not anything more than that yet they know how to compete and win at that level at least.

Then you have guys like Bouma and Franson who have NHL experience but bring great leadership and veteran leadership to a Rockford club that has a bunch of rookies and sophomores not to mention a head coach in his first year coaching in North America.
- AEL_Fox

Same here......and that's why you have to hit on the draft and not mortgage the future in regards to picks for win NOW IF your farm system is depleted. Which when Bowman was going ALL IN a few years back, the system was depleted. Look at goaltender. Outside of Darling, this has been a major issue internally since Crawford was called up.

Look at D.....they had to keep going outside to add "veteran guys" or top 4 guys, and will again have to do so this summer.

I saw Fletcher got canned but he has a helluva farm system he built in Minny. Boston has done a great job reloading.

Pressure is really on Bowman. He has to get creative to add to the team but also restock his farm system so he has tangible assets to trade should he want to.

IMO, this offseason makes or breaks this team for the next 2-3 years. Either he's right and the core guys can get better, ignoring continual slides downward in play and speed, or he's wrong and they continue to eat huge portions of the cap and give him very little back on the ice.

I'm no GM but I'd be looking to dump 1 or 2 veteran "blue chips" to see what kind of return I could get in the trade and where I can allocate those funds this summer.

What does that mean “the Hawks would take him back in a minute, for the right price and contract”? The problem is the right price and contract doesn’t exist for him. Hawks would not take him back for his present contract. He presently makes 6M and someone will likely give him more. Panarin is who Panarin is. He is an offensive player who can be shut down and can disappear. I predicted he’d be shut down if the Caps played even slightly smarter and he was. He was also raking on the PP but that production can disappear quickly.
- Z3Hawk

Any player can be shut down. Kane withered away when Pronger or Hedman knocked him around too. Each player is only as good as their team

He is who he is, that's the reason the Hawks traded him
- BetweenTheDots

Do we need to pull up the games where Saad was a non factor.......over and over and over and over again.

Looks like to me Columbus sold high on Saad, and the Hawks have a very contempt player who shows up here and now.

And Saad;s 200 ft game this year was god awful.....sorry.......we will see how this pans out long term, but the immediate return is Bowman getting fleeced like Ricky Schroeder in draft day........

This team needs speed, and guys who play bigger but are not prone to moronic penalties. Probably the reason Hartman was shipped out, and not surprisingly, scratched already in Nashville. People point to 72's "bad playoffs" they should also go back and watch Hartman implode vs Nashville last year. Very surprised Poile took him on seeing it first hand.

IN my perfect world they trade a Toews or Keith, guys on the decline but still valued by other teams, and then you sign Karlsson long term. A team out east getting exposed by lack of D could easily fit Keith in and slot him at top pair or 2nd pair.
- SteveRain

Karlsson’s health really concerns me. He doesn’t suffer minor injuries - when he gets hurt it always seems it’s something serious. Also he never completely 100% recovered from the Achilles in his own admission.

Any player can be shut down. Kane withered away when Pronger or Hedman knocked him around too. Each player is only as good as their team
- GPHawksfan

He still found a way to beat both of them in the finals though, either by scoring or assisting on gwg's.

If you're trading older declining players and the plan is to get younger, why would you sign Karlsson to a long term deal. Heals almost thirty already too. Plus he isn't a free agent until next year.
- GPHawksfan

He will be 28 next month.....Trade for him, after next year extend him 6 years and he's 36 when his deal runs out. Based on his productivity, i'm guessing he keeps in elite shape and has speed....something Keith has lost and now is a liability.

What does that mean “the Hawks would take him back in a minute, for the right price and contract”? The problem is the right price and contract doesn’t exist for him. Hawks would not take him back for his present contract. He presently makes 6M and someone will likely give him more. Panarin is who Panarin is. He is an offensive player who can be shut down and can disappear. I predicted he’d be shut down if the Caps played even slightly smarter and he was. He was also raking on the PP but that production can disappear quickly.
- Z3Hawk

I would guess - but only guess, no sources, no inside information - that for, say, $6X5years, the Hawks would welcome back a point-per-game, 30+ goal scorer - who, in reality, has been no worse in the recent tournaments against St. Louis and Nashville than any of the supposed play-off tested Hawks like Kane, Toews, etc.

Your PP comment, I think, isn't supported by the facts: he has scored 88 goals in seasons, 64 at even strength (73%) with 107 out of 145 assists at evens (74%).

This is a terrific offensive player who would help any team. Let's not let the angst on this board overcome our appreciation for a point-per-game player in today's NHL.

He will be 28 next month.....Trade for him, after next year extend him 6 years and he's 36 when his deal runs out. Based on his productivity, i'm guessing he keeps in elite shape and has speed....something Keith has lost and now is a liability.
- SteveRain

When Keith was 28 everyone though superman would play into his 50's Now that he has lost a step all is forgotten...

Karlsson’s health really concerns me. He doesn’t suffer minor injuries - when he gets hurt it always seems it’s something serious. Also he never completely 100% recovered from the Achilles in his own admission.
- Z3Hawk

Watch Keith closely when he tries to accelerate. He does a very short push with one leg, so his knee is still jacked up and it's costing him and the hawks. he also takes a large amount of "maintenance days" more so then any other player since hossa retired.

I respect what keith did here, but that ship has sailed. For his cap hit, he is probably easier to trade then Toews, and that's why I would look to dangle him this offseason if I were SB......

hawks have played all of 11 playoff games in the last 3 years.....it's not due to "extra games" like the excuse was in the past.......whatever ails keith isn't going away.

When Keith was 28 everyone though superman would play into his 50's Now that he has lost a step all is forgotten...
- riozzo

Nature of the beast......his game was always speed and able to use his stick to defend given his lack of size. Even in his prime, Keith was back doored on a lot of goals where he lost his man........I'm not a Keith hater.....I just realize what he is now, and with the league cracking down on stick work, only getting faster, and his lack of size, and lack of offense......what are you getting for it?

Any player can be shut down. Kane withered away when Pronger or Hedman knocked him around too. Each player is only as good as their team
- GPHawksfan

Kane never or rarely gets totally shut down. Doesn’t mean he hits the score-sheet every game but game in game out he creates as he possesses the puck so much. Remember what he did when he possessed the puck in OT Game 6. In Philly series was actually 3-5-8. Against TB - very low scoring series - he was 1-2-3 but leading Hawks’ scorer had 4 points.

I would guess - but only guess, no sources, no inside information - that for, say, $6X5years, the Hawks would welcome back a point-per-game, 30+ goal scorer - who, in reality, has been no worse in the recent tournaments against St. Louis and Nashville than any of the supposed play-off tested Hawks like Kane, Toews, etc.

Your PP comment, I think, isn't supported by the facts: he has scored 88 goals in seasons, 64 at even strength (73%) with 107 out of 145 assists at evens (74%).

This is a terrific offensive player who would help any team. Let's not let the angst on this board overcome our appreciation for a point-per-game player in today's NHL.
- StLBravesFan

Agreed. Well said.

Lastly, what drives me nuts is this organization's constant catering to #19. 19 always had Hossa on his wing, albeit 95% of the time, where the Hawks ran kane out with anyone and everyone.....only when did they pair him with a talent similar to his.....he won the hart. Coincidence? I think not.....yet all they are concerned with is how to get "toews going". That's on Toews, and if he can't then you have to accept the fact you signed a border line top 6 player to an asinine deal as his production continues to tank.

And you also have the concussion factor, and I have never seen a "top nhl player" fall down as much as Toews does. It's crazy.

I would guess - but only guess, no sources, no inside information - that for, say, $6X5years, the Hawks would welcome back a point-per-game, 30+ goal scorer - who, in reality, has been no worse in the recent tournaments against St. Louis and Nashville than any of the supposed play-off tested Hawks like Kane, Toews, etc.

Your PP comment, I think, isn't supported by the facts: he has scored 88 goals in seasons, 64 at even strength (73%) with 107 out of 145 assists at evens (74%).

This is a terrific offensive player who would help any team. Let's not let the angst on this board overcome our appreciation for a point-per-game player in today's NHL.
- StLBravesFan

I was talking only about the PP in the play-off series.

I would guess - but only guess, no sources, no inside information - that for, say, $6X5years, the Hawks would welcome back a point-per-game, 30+ goal scorer - who, in reality, has been no worse in the recent tournaments against St. Louis and Nashville than any of the supposed play-off tested Hawks like Kane, Toews, etc.

Your PP comment, I think, isn't supported by the facts: he has scored 88 goals in seasons, 64 at even strength (73%) with 107 out of 145 assists at evens (74%).

This is a terrific offensive player who would help any team. Let's not let the angst on this board overcome our appreciation for a point-per-game player in today's NHL.
- StLBravesFan

He is already at 6M - gotta think someone gonna give him more than 6M.

Agreed. Well said.

Lastly, what drives me nuts is this organization's constant catering to #19. 19 always had Hossa on his wing, albeit 95% of the time, where the Hawks ran kane out with anyone and everyone.....only when did they pair him with a talent similar to his.....he won the hart. Coincidence? I think not.....yet all they are concerned with is how to get "toews going". That's on Toews, and if he can't then you have to accept the fact you signed a border line top 6 player to an asinine deal as his production continues to tank.

And you also have the concussion factor, and I have never seen a "top nhl player" fall down as much as Toews does. It's crazy.
- SteveRain

I beg to differ.
Hossa in his prime is an entire league above Panarin.
Kane has never come close to experiencing the "help" Toews has had with Hossa, even with Panarin on his wing and AA opening up the middle...

Thanks for this.

Now - do you have league-wide stats for the above situations?

(I'm never satisfied....)
- StLBravesFan

The first stats by zone are just on the NHL website with the %. They also have the raw # for the face off numbers by strength, but you gotta do the calculation for % yourself.

He is already at 6M - gotta think someone gonna give him more than 6M.
- Z3Hawk

He's getting 8 at minimum which is exactly why the Hawks traded him. Had they waited the return would have diminished.

He's getting 8 at minimum which is exactly why the Hawks traded him. Had they waited the return would have diminished.
- tyweb69

The already DID diminish...

I beg to differ.
Hossa in his prime is an entire league above Panarin.
Kane has never come close to experiencing the "help" Toews has had with Hossa, even with Panarin on his wing and AA opening up the middle...
- Slofire94

I'm not arguing that....my point was they cater to 19 all day, every day. I give 88 credit....at some point it would grow tiresome and you may think about moving on.

Looking up UFAs
F: Jvr, Tavares, Neal, Kane
D: Green, Cole, Carlson

If bowman stands pat, you will see a mass exodus of fans and season ticket holders when this team duplicates this year's performance. Already hearing about Hawks ticket reps refusing to take no on non renewals and hammering talking points......

He still found a way to beat both of them in the finals though, either by scoring or assisting on gwg's.
- BlazinMike

He didn't beat them by himself. Those teams were better than the Bluejackets team today. I'm not really a Panarin fan, but to say he is worthless isn't true or that Saad is the better player. They wouldn't have been able to afford him anyway so it doesn't much matter.

Kane never or rarely gets totally shut down. Doesn’t mean he hits the score-sheet every game but game in game out he creates as he possesses the puck so much. Remember what he did when he possessed the puck in OT Game 6. In Philly series was actually 3-5-8. Against TB - very low scoring series - he was 1-2-3 but leading Hawks’ scorer had 4 points.

- Z3Hawk

I'm not saying Panarin is better than Kane, but if you're gonna use the argument that Kane wasn't shut down because of point totals then neither was Panarin. He had 7 points in the 6 games. His team just wasn't good enough. Swapping Kane for him wouldn't have advanced Columbus either.

My eyes see all this thusly, through 2015, they had excess talent in comparison to the league AND also a REMARKABLE run of good enough health from their top players. And when they had the injury to Kane, they were able to parlay that into Vermette for the stretch run.
With this success, they:
a.) had to draft late, AND;
b.) jettison top supporting talent to the point they were actually cutting into the bone.

Here's hoping this offseason with their improved draft standing they squeeze into drafting an NHL-ready player (top 4?) and with cap space are also able to bring in an NHL player. With these two tweaks, plus continued growth from the young'uns, perhaps the 'Hawks can viably compete and the load lightens on their big salary guys. Because in today's NHL, by the time you get the big payday, you are in the 2nd half of your career.