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Forums :: Blog World :: Hank Balling: The All-Star Game is Bad and Gary Bettman Should Feel Bad
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BeadyEyedDouche
Buffalo Sabres
Location: Rustmine Ramsum most exciting Sabres klugdragger since Taro Tsujimoto
Joined: 07.01.2016

Jan 27 @ 4:16 PM ET
Was Fitz permabanned? I think he should be let back in. Place isn't the same without him. Some of your and The Hank's finest work were at his expense.
- Hatboro_Swords

He can always just buy a season ticket and get the ban lifted

He would rather keep sending me 😘😘😘 in my DMs
Slump Buster
Buffalo Sabres
Location: I root for draft picks but not the team, apparently, NY
Joined: 10.24.2006

Jan 27 @ 4:16 PM ET
I think he’s referring to a DeBrincat/Meier situation where the player would have the leverage in contract negotiations if we trade for them before signing them to an extension
- sbroads24


Thank you, you would be correct. Same with when we signed Skinner - he had all of the leverage as a pending UFA and got way more than he should have (presumably because TPegs stepped in).
lacaprup
Buffalo Sabres
Location: NY
Joined: 07.23.2006

Jan 27 @ 4:16 PM ET
Wow, that's a really rosy picture. He is having a very good year. You still didn't answer the question - if here were a UFA today would you pay him 4 x 9 with a full NMC?

You also forget three things:
- he was a complete no-show for more than 2 years here. It started the year he scored 40 and continued into the next year. He was playing with Jack on the first line and wasn't doing anything. We can blame Ralphie for a ton of things but there was no doubt that Skinner was mailing it in most nights. Chicken and egg, I guess.
- A fair amount of his success has to be attributed to playing with two freaks every night.
- He is an absolute disaster defensively.

- Slump Buster


You ask a literally unanswerable question. What does that Sabres roster look like without him? Did we land Owen Power? What's our cap space issue? No one can answer your question. let me ask you, are you ready to qual for $10 million Meier? Who, btw, has never scored 40 and has a whole bunch of minuses.
lacaprup
Buffalo Sabres
Location: NY
Joined: 07.23.2006

Jan 27 @ 4:19 PM ET
Jeff Skinner isn't worth 9 because he's bad defensively. Let's give Timo Meier and his -13 and less points a $10 mil qualifier.
Slump Buster
Buffalo Sabres
Location: I root for draft picks but not the team, apparently, NY
Joined: 10.24.2006

Jan 27 @ 4:21 PM ET
You ask a literally unanswerable question. What does that Sabres roster look like without him? Did we land Owen Power? What's our cap space issue? No one can answer your question. let me ask you, are you ready to qual for $10 million Meier? Who, btw, has never scored 40 and has a whole bunch of minuses.
- lacaprup


let me summarize everything that I've argued for and against today since it seems to have gotten muddled.

- I would LOVE a player like Meier.
- Given the contracts that we will probably have to give out, I'd feel better about getting him if we had more flexibility to get out of a contract or two later.
- If I had to get rid of a contract later, it would be Skinner because of age and value
- I like Skinner
- Jeff Skinner is a very good player that makes 2 mill more per year than he should given his flaws.

and if we must connect all of the dots here, if I had to pick between Skinner and Meier it would be the latter all day long. I can't imagine anyone thinking otherwise.



jochfr
Buffalo Sabres
Location: Nashville , TN
Joined: 07.11.2009

Jan 27 @ 4:21 PM ET
Sh!ttakes day
Slump Buster
Buffalo Sabres
Location: I root for draft picks but not the team, apparently, NY
Joined: 10.24.2006

Jan 27 @ 4:22 PM ET
Jeff Skinner isn't worth 9 because he's bad defensively. Let's give Timo Meier and his -13 and less points a $10 mil qualifier.
- lacaprup


I don't think that plus/minus is what you want to use to measure defensive ability. I do know that I am scared to death when Skinner is out there late in a tie game or in overtime.
IonSabres
Buffalo Sabres
Location: I said that months ago, keep up!, FL
Joined: 03.10.2013

Jan 27 @ 4:24 PM ET
Jeff Skinner isn't worth 9 because he's bad defensively. Let's give Timo Meier and his -13 and less points a $10 mil qualifier.
- lacaprup



Does QoC and QoTm enter the analysis?
lacaprup
Buffalo Sabres
Location: NY
Joined: 07.23.2006

Jan 27 @ 4:24 PM ET
let me summarize everything that I've argued for and against today since it seems to have gotten muddled.

- I would LOVE a player like Meier.
- Given the contracts that we will probably have to give out, I'd feel better about getting him if we had more flexibility to get out of a contract or two later.
- If I had to get rid of a contract later, it would be Skinner because of age and value
- I like Skinner
- Jeff Skinner is a very good player that makes 2 mill more per year than he should given his flaws.

and if we must connect all of the dots here, if I had to pick between Skinner and Meier it would be the latter all day long. I can't imagine anyone thinking otherwise.

- Slump Buster


Why? Are his dashes after every game better than Skinner's pluses? He's four years younger. That's his only advantage.
lacaprup
Buffalo Sabres
Location: NY
Joined: 07.23.2006

Jan 27 @ 4:25 PM ET
I don't think that plus/minus is what you want to use to measure defensive ability. I do know that I am scared to death when Skinner is out there late in a tie game or in overtime.
- Slump Buster


I agree Skinner is bad defensively. SO IS MEIER.
IonSabres
Buffalo Sabres
Location: I said that months ago, keep up!, FL
Joined: 03.10.2013

Jan 27 @ 4:26 PM ET
Freakin 9:00 game tomorrow night. Minga.
Slump Buster
Buffalo Sabres
Location: I root for draft picks but not the team, apparently, NY
Joined: 10.24.2006

Jan 27 @ 4:29 PM ET
I agree Skinner is bad defensively. SO IS MEIER.
- lacaprup


FWIW, from the Athletic's article discussing his value as a trade target:

"Meier is also a shot-creating machine from the wing, a rare non-centre who drives offence regardless of his linemates. He was tied for the NHL lead with 219 shots on goal entering Tuesday night."

"Meier’s defensive metrics are still decent, though, which says a lot considering the quality of team he plays for in San Jose."

The guy drives play, which is everything in the NHL. Skinner (not unlike VO) can flourish when he is in the right spot. And even when he is in that spot it isn't guaranteed to go well (see his last 40ish games with Eichel).


Boss34
Buffalo Sabres
Location: BUFFALO , NY
Joined: 12.03.2015

Jan 27 @ 4:32 PM ET
Yes, sooner or later the Sabres will need to make decisions. You can't keep signing the Olofsson Mitts Girgensons Okposo's to contract extensions without blocking some of your future. Sabres will need to make room or you will have a influx of prospects in Rochester blocking each other because they are being blocked by young players on the Big club with fresh long term contracts. The Botton 6 will be the purge, it's just when and how fast Adams does it.
- Buff36



My uncle ion and I worked out the parimeters for asset allocation.

My allotted 6 million to the 4th line

Okposo 1. 5
Krebs 850,000
Remaining $ to the other 4th liner. Give him 2.8 let's say.

Sure krebs could move up, but a new minimum wage guy can replace him.

How much cheaper can you build a productive 4th nhl line?

IonSabres
Buffalo Sabres
Location: I said that months ago, keep up!, FL
Joined: 03.10.2013

Jan 27 @ 4:32 PM ET
Why? Are his dashes after every game better than Skinner's pluses? He's four years younger. That's his only advantage.
- lacaprup



Have you looked at SJS's roster...they are all freaking "-", literally everyone sans a couple.

I'm not saying Meier is a defensive ace by any means, but when the whole team is -, it loses its' luster in an argument.,
Slump Buster
Buffalo Sabres
Location: I root for draft picks but not the team, apparently, NY
Joined: 10.24.2006

Jan 27 @ 4:33 PM ET
Have you looked at SJS's roster...they are all freaking "-", literally everyone sans a couple.

I'm not saying Meier is a defensive ace by any means, but when the whole team is -, it loses its' luster in an argument.,

- IonSabres


Also, I think it is extremely impressive that he keeps producing regardless of what is going on around him. I saw it posted elsewhere that he gets a lot by shear volume, and that travels well.
DirtyDan
Buffalo Sabres
Location: Why aren't more people interrigent? Rike Me? , ON
Joined: 02.03.2021

Jan 27 @ 4:35 PM ET
Jeff Skinner isn't worth 9 because he's bad defensively. Let's give Timo Meier and his -13 and less points a $10 mil qualifier.
- lacaprup


Fancy stats say this is a non-issue and that the team drags everyone's +/- down... kinda like our team the last 11 years until now....

Skinner who sucks in his own end is +15..

You're better than that Paulie
IonSabres
Buffalo Sabres
Location: I said that months ago, keep up!, FL
Joined: 03.10.2013

Jan 27 @ 4:36 PM ET
Also, I think it is extremely impressive that he keeps producing regardless of what is going on around him. I saw it posted elsewhere that he gets a lot by shear volume, and that travels well.
- Slump Buster


As long as he continues to produce at near a 1.0 PPG pace I'd be good. Of course I'd take more, lol.

Skinner - Tage - Tuch
Meier - Cozens - Quinn
Would be a hell of a top 6





lacaprup
Buffalo Sabres
Location: NY
Joined: 07.23.2006

Jan 27 @ 4:37 PM ET
FWIW, from the Athletic's article discussing his value as a trade target:

"Meier is also a shot-creating machine from the wing, a rare non-centre who drives offence regardless of his linemates. He was tied for the NHL lead with 219 shots on goal entering Tuesday night."

"Meier’s defensive metrics are still decent, though, which says a lot considering the quality of team he plays for in San Jose."

The guy drives play, which is everything in the NHL. Skinner (not unlike VO) can flourish when he is in the right spot. And even when he is in that spot it isn't guaranteed to go well (see his last 40ish games with Eichel).

- Slump Buster


12 of his 28 goals are on the PP. That's means he has less 5 on 5 goals than Vic. Does he drive his line less than Vic?

Also, what defensive metrics say he is good? I'd love to see these.
DirtyDan
Buffalo Sabres
Location: Why aren't more people interrigent? Rike Me? , ON
Joined: 02.03.2021

Jan 27 @ 4:37 PM ET
As long as he continues to produce at near a 1.0 PPG pace I'd be good. Of course I'd take more, lol.

Skinner - Tage - Tuch
Meier - Cozens - Quinn
Would be a hell of a top 6

- IonSabres


JJ-Krebs-Olof
Not girgensons-Not girgensons- Not Okposo
lacaprup
Buffalo Sabres
Location: NY
Joined: 07.23.2006

Jan 27 @ 4:38 PM ET
Fancy stats say this is a non-issue and that the team drags everyone's +/- down... kinda like our team the last 11 years until now....

Skinner who sucks in his own end is +15..

You're better than that Paulie

- DirtyDan


The post wasn't meant to imply Skinner is good defensively. Just showing how silly it is to say his contract is bad when people want to qualify Meier with more money.
Slump Buster
Buffalo Sabres
Location: I root for draft picks but not the team, apparently, NY
Joined: 10.24.2006

Jan 27 @ 4:39 PM ET
Fancy stats say this is a non-issue and that the team drags everyone's +/- down... kinda like our team the last 11 years until now....

Skinner who sucks in his own end is +15..

You're better than that Paulie

- DirtyDan


Skinner is on the top line with a couple of freaks that are putting up career numbers in a year where scoring has gone bonkers and the Sabres as a team have an excellent differential. I am sure when you looked up his stats that you also noticed that he hasn't been a plus player since he was a rookie (+3).
DirtyDan
Buffalo Sabres
Location: Why aren't more people interrigent? Rike Me? , ON
Joined: 02.03.2021

Jan 27 @ 4:40 PM ET
Why would Skinner stay on the top line? He's obviously killing us there.
- lacaprup


Don't break up that chemistry..

And I never said Skinner sucks so move him down.. YAll love to put words where they were never used
lacaprup
Buffalo Sabres
Location: NY
Joined: 07.23.2006

Jan 27 @ 4:41 PM ET
Don't break up that chemistry..

And I never said Skinner sucks so move him down.. YAll love to put words where they were never used

- DirtyDan


I meant to quote a different post. I already deleted it.
IonSabres
Buffalo Sabres
Location: I said that months ago, keep up!, FL
Joined: 03.10.2013

Jan 27 @ 4:42 PM ET
JJ-Krebs-Olof
Not girgensons-Not girgensons- Not Okposo

- DirtyDan


Spot on Dan

Although, I do think Olofsson would be a casualty.
But that is where a Kulich, Savoie, Rosen, Rousek can slide in.
Jost is playing well too


DirtyDan
Buffalo Sabres
Location: Why aren't more people interrigent? Rike Me? , ON
Joined: 02.03.2021

Jan 27 @ 4:42 PM ET
The post wasn't meant to imply Skinner is good defensively. Just showing how silly it is to say his contract is bad when people want to qualify Meier with more money.
- lacaprup


But his contract is bad.

Meier brings a lot more to the table than fancy skating and stick work
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