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Forums :: Vancouver Canucks :: HB Thinktank - Socialism vs. Capitalism: a false dichotomy
Author Message
Pres.cup
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Making the most of the worst situation... Canuck fan 4life , BC
Joined: 12.23.2014

Jan 13 @ 11:00 PM ET
The preceding posts were too scattershot to reply to. I'll merely summarize by saying, brainwashed is in the eye of the beholder.

But believe what you want.... Until they come for you. Or maybe not....

- RealityChecker




My last one had tongue firmly planted in cheek. I would say there’s more brainwashed fanatics on the right then the left.

It's the pigeonhole that you(royal you) put me in that I oppose.
bloatedmosquito
Vancouver Canucks
Location: I’m a dose of reality in this cesspool of glee
Joined: 10.22.2011

Jan 13 @ 11:15 PM ET


My last one had tongue firmly planted in cheek. I would say there’s more brainwashed fanatics on the right then the left.

Is the pigeonhole that you(royal you) put me in that I oppose.

- Pres.cup


TBH, I think many people are tired of hearing about conspiracy theories. It’s been talked about so much that you hear it and just roll your eyes and say ‘whatever’.

If we must break everyone onto right or left groups, it’s definitely the Right who can’t stop talking about the most insane conspiracies.
Pres.cup
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Making the most of the worst situation... Canuck fan 4life , BC
Joined: 12.23.2014

Jan 13 @ 11:56 PM ET
TBH, I think many people are tired of hearing about conspiracy theories. It’s been talked about so much that you hear it and just roll your eyes and say ‘whatever’.

If we must break everyone onto right or left groups, it’s definitely the Left who can’t stop talking about the most insane conspiracies.

- bloatedmosquito


I agree....
bloatedmosquito
Vancouver Canucks
Location: I’m a dose of reality in this cesspool of glee
Joined: 10.22.2011

Jan 14 @ 12:01 AM ET
I agree....
- Pres.cup


Oops... I meant to say the Right is much more into conspiracies. (frank) I give up.
Pres.cup
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Making the most of the worst situation... Canuck fan 4life , BC
Joined: 12.23.2014

Jan 14 @ 12:42 AM ET
Oops... I meant to say the Right is much more into conspiracies. (frank) I give up.
- bloatedmosquito


No take backs, lol
Makita
Referee
Vancouver Canucks
Location: #theonlyrealfan, BC
Joined: 02.16.2007

Jan 14 @ 1:57 AM ET
No take backs, lol
- Pres.cup

https://www.google.ca/url...Vaw0SkCtX7L8ptVKRCvB-88NN
bloatedmosquito
Vancouver Canucks
Location: I’m a dose of reality in this cesspool of glee
Joined: 10.22.2011

Jan 14 @ 2:48 AM ET
No take backs, lol
- Pres.cup


Ya know, I’m looking forward to not hearing about trump and his gripes all the time. I’m sure he’ll be around, but as a private citizen I can tune him and his ilk out easily.

Now everyone can get back to hating Justin.
Marwood
Location: Cumberland, BC
Joined: 03.18.2010

Jan 14 @ 11:08 AM ET
I've never once espoused to be pro Trump, but loving the brainwashed narrative, keep on with the shoehorn, it might fit one day.
- Pres.cup

Yet you defend him at any given opportunity.
Pres.cup
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Making the most of the worst situation... Canuck fan 4life , BC
Joined: 12.23.2014

Jan 14 @ 12:01 PM ET
Ya know, I’m looking forward to not hearing about trump and his gripes all the time. I’m sure he’ll be around, but as a private citizen I can tune him and his ilk out easily.

Now everyone can get back to hating Justin.

- bloatedmosquito


Yes, that's why I hope people don't turn him into a martyr. Then we'll never stop hearing about him.....

Can't talk poop about pretty boy wonder,
Casto's son,
the most moist talking,
hypocrisy walking,
white boy with black face on
Goatee is still rocking.

Got his notes, for his speech,
Says he writes them himself,
We all know that, that's a reach
Background professional,
The man's an elementary teach,
Enough to make a grown man reach,
I mean, make a grown man retch,
I'd say he's good at his job,
But you all know that, that's just a stretch.
Pres.cup
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Making the most of the worst situation... Canuck fan 4life , BC
Joined: 12.23.2014

Jan 14 @ 12:02 PM ET
Yet you defend him at any given opportunity.
- Marwood


Look through all my posts and find one where I defend Trump? Doesn't exist, doesn't fit your narrative though, does it?

See kids, this is what happens when you forget how to think for yourself!
Marwood
Location: Cumberland, BC
Joined: 03.18.2010

Jan 14 @ 12:28 PM ET
Look through all my posts and find one where I defend Trump? Doesn't exist, doesn't fit your narrative though, does it?

See kids, this is what happens when you forget how to think for yourself!

- Pres.cup

My mistake, you support his backer's.
Pres.cup
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Making the most of the worst situation... Canuck fan 4life , BC
Joined: 12.23.2014

Jan 14 @ 12:39 PM ET
My mistake, you support his backer's.
- Marwood


Nope, still not accurate, try again hombre.

This is what happens when you fixate on a narrative, the truth goes out the window.
RealityChecker
Vancouver Canucks
Location: I stay away from the completely crazy rumours on the internet.I will occasionally debunk them-Eklund
Joined: 04.18.2010

Jan 14 @ 1:01 PM ET
Nope, still not accurate, try again hombre.

This is what happens when you fixate on a narrative, the truth goes out the window.

- Pres.cup

you know the guy who constantly says, "i'm not racist but...."

you've had a lot of posts where it's, "i'm not a trump supporter but..."

i know it's important for you to be seen as an independent thinker but when you present the contrarian point that always seem to fit one type of narrative, you might not be what you think you are.

just something for you to think about with your own personal narrative.
Pres.cup
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Making the most of the worst situation... Canuck fan 4life , BC
Joined: 12.23.2014

Jan 14 @ 1:11 PM ET
you know the guy who constantly says, "i'm not racist but...."

you've had a lot of posts where it's, "i'm not a trump supporter but..."

i know it's important for you to be seen as an independent thinker but when you present the contrarian point that always seem to fit one type of narrative, you might not be what you think you are.

just something for you to think about with your own personal narrative.

- RealityChecker


Please, find one part where I support Trump, you can't.

That's the problem with the brainwashed left and the brainwashed right, if you don't agree with them verbatim you must be the enemy and support the enemy...
It's exasperating trying to explain.

I think the overdose pandemic is a big a crisis as Covid-19, more have died but.... they are poor and covid can kill the rich. Must be a Trumpist.

I support the BLM and ACAB but think the capital riots were similar but less actually destructive then the blm riots. Must
Doesn't fit your narrative, must be Trumpist.

I think the actual mortality rate on covid has been obfuscated to make people more compliant with the health orders.
Doesn't fit the narrative, must be a conspiracy theorist.

I don't think the vaccine should be mandatory in any way, statistically for healthy individuals under 50 is less lethal then influenza and feel that using fear tactics to ramp up vaccine acceptance is wrong.
Doesn't fit the narrative, must be an anti vaxer.

Sheesh, liberals are the worst..
Marwood
Location: Cumberland, BC
Joined: 03.18.2010

Jan 14 @ 1:12 PM ET
Nope, still not accurate, try again hombre.

This is what happens when you fixate on a narrative, the truth goes out the window.

- Pres.cup

My mistake again, you are smarter than most people and think for yourself just like the most radical Trump supporters.
RealityChecker
Vancouver Canucks
Location: I stay away from the completely crazy rumours on the internet.I will occasionally debunk them-Eklund
Joined: 04.18.2010

Jan 14 @ 1:24 PM ET
Please, find one part we I support Trump, you can't.
That's the problem with the brainwashed left, if you don't agree with them verbatim you must be the enemy and support the enemy...
It's exasperating trying to explain.

I think the overdose pandemic is a big a crisis as Covid-19, more have died but.... they are poor and covid can kill the rich. Must be a Trumpist.

I support the BLM and ACAB but think the capital riots were similar but less actually destructive then the blm riots. Must
Doesn't fit your narrative, must be Trumpist.

I think the actual mortality rate on covid has been obfuscated to make people more compliant with the health orders.
Doesn't fit the narrative, must be a conspiracy theorist.

I don't think the vaccine should be mandatory in any way, statistically for healthy individuals under 50 is less lethal then influenza and feel that using fear tactics to ramp up vaccine acceptance is wrong.
Doesn't fit the narrative, must be an anti vaxer.

Sheesh, liberals are the worst..

- Pres.cup

lol - you snowflakes really don't like criticism.

anyway, like i've mentioned several times, it's the deflection of trump criticism and/or his supporters' actions used to justify them.

you actually just did it in the post i quoted.

it's this deflection and justification that comes across as trump support. whether you want to admit it or not, that is a form of tacit approval.
Pres.cup
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Making the most of the worst situation... Canuck fan 4life , BC
Joined: 12.23.2014

Jan 14 @ 1:33 PM ET
My mistake again, you are smarter than most people and think for yourself just like the most radical Trump supporters.
- Marwood


Hey look, another "free thinker" spouting the same tired hot takes that he read some other guy saying.
For f's sake, say something original for a change, my 2 year old has more original content then you're espousing these days.

You seem to lack the mental facilities to actually understand and respond to individual points so you must resort to pigeonholing and hyperbole with complete fabrications to try to prove your so called independence by showing how well you confirm.

Good on you, bud, Snowden would be proud.
Pres.cup
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Making the most of the worst situation... Canuck fan 4life , BC
Joined: 12.23.2014

Jan 14 @ 1:47 PM ET
lol - you snowflakes really don't like criticism.

anyway, like i've mentioned several times, it's the deflection of trump criticism and/or his supporters' actions used to justify them.

you actually just did it in the post i quoted.

it's this deflection and justification that comes across as trump support. whether you want to admit it or not, that is a form of tacit approval.

- RealityChecker


Where in the quote did I deflect criticism of Trump?
Do you think the "coup" was more destructive and deadlier then the blm riots? I imagine that's the one you're pointing out to prove how far right that I am.

I'm just not afraid to call out the bullpoop on both sides.

I'm in favor of a human basic income, (frank)ing commie, right!

I'm in favor of complete drug decriminalization, (frank)ing socialist, right?

I'm in favor of personal freedom, (frank)ing right winger, right?

I'm in not in favor of gun control, must be a nazi, right?

The problem is, most people don't fit in a box that supports a narrative so you(again, royal you) fixate on a singularity that might allow your narrative to be correct. In this case, 1 out of 4 points suggests that the capital riots were less destructive then the blm riots, so... Quick, call him a snowflake and try to trigger him into revealing that he's actually a Trump supporter... such a pathetic ploy, weak on actually content and reality. You also failed to follow the facts, I wrote that I supported the blm riots, I've never written that I support the capital riots, just that it wasn't actually a coup and that the blm protest (which I support) was more destructive to illustrate a point that the media is drumming up a narrative of orange man bad(which I've cautioned could make him a martyr).

Again, it's odd to pick one out of 4 points to suggest that, that one thing proves anything... question everything, inform yourself and come to a conclusion that makes sense.

Speaking of deflecting, you never answered the question. Which was more destructive, BLM protests or capital riots?
RealityChecker
Vancouver Canucks
Location: I stay away from the completely crazy rumours on the internet.I will occasionally debunk them-Eklund
Joined: 04.18.2010

Jan 14 @ 2:04 PM ET
Where in the quote did I deflect criticism of Trump?
Do you think the "coup" was more destructive and deadlier then the blm riots? I imagine that's the one you're pointing out to prove how far right that I am.

I

Speaking of deflecting, you never answered the question. Which was more destructive, BLM protests or capital riots?

- Pres.cup

let me answer that for you:
in terms of which is more "destructive," it really is how you define the term. the blm protests/riots in the summer were definitely more destructive in the literal sense. they caused much more damage, were of a longer duration, affected more people directly, destroyed more property and caused more economic damage.

on a superficial analysis, the blm protests/riots were much, much more destructive.

but let's look at "destructive" in another more nuanced light. let's look at the destruction that the capitol protest/riot did on a superficial level but also the damage to the institution of government and society as a whole.

you might think it's trivial, but the capitol, is the literal and symbolic centre of the american government. IT WAS ATTACKED. and it was attacked for what it is: the centre of government in an attempt to change the course of government. whether they had any chance of succeeding is moot. there was a plan to do cause damage and/or kidnap/kill politicians.

you might try to discredit the source but here's a couple of stories to show the coordination of what happened:
https://www.nytimes.com/i...capitol-mob-timeline.html
https://www.nytimes.com/2...-riot-graphic-videos.html

the difference between a blm riot and the capitol riot is: 1) the level of coordination; 2) where the violence took place; and 3) their desired goals.

you'll try to "shoehorn" (your favourite term) blm into what i wrote above to equate the two but that would be disingenuous of you at best.

simply put, two similar crimes shouldn't be viewed the same way or necessarily treated the same way. there is a difference between the columbine killers and the gay disco (florida - i can't remember the name of the place) killer.

motive makes a difference.

if you think that the capitol riot wasn't coordinated or was a "one off," i'd remind you that several people were arrested a couple of months ago for a plot to kidnap the governor of michigan.

the group seems eerily similar to those that were at the capitol riot so there seems to be something more going on.

so... to answer your question, the capitol riot was much more destructive to american society and should serve as a warning of what may be coming.
Codes1087
Vancouver Canucks
Joined: 09.24.2014

Jan 14 @ 2:19 PM ET
#Narrative
Marwood
Location: Cumberland, BC
Joined: 03.18.2010

Jan 14 @ 2:25 PM ET
let me answer that for you:
in terms of which is more "destructive," it really is how you define the term. the blm protests/riots in the summer were definitely more destructive in the literal sense. they caused much more damage, were of a longer duration, affected more people directly, destroyed more property and caused more economic damage.

on a superficial analysis, the blm protests/riots were much, much more destructive.

but let's look at "destructive" in another more nuanced light. let's look at the destruction that the capitol protest/riot did on a superficial level but also the damage to the institution of government and society as a whole.

you might think it's trivial, but the capitol, is the literal and symbolic centre of the american government. IT WAS ATTACKED. and it was attacked for what it is: the centre of government in an attempt to change the course of government. whether they had any chance of succeeding is moot. there was a plan to do cause damage and/or kidnap/kill politicians.

you might try to discredit the source but here's a couple of stories to show the coordination of what happened:
https://www.nytimes.com/i...capitol-mob-timeline.html
https://www.nytimes.com/2...-riot-graphic-videos.html

the difference between a blm riot and the capitol riot is: 1) the level of coordination; 2) where the violence took place; and 3) their desired goals.

you'll try to "shoehorn" (your favourite term) blm into what i wrote above to equate the two but that would be disingenuous of you at best.

simply put, two similar crimes shouldn't be viewed the same way or necessarily treated the same way. there is a difference between the columbine killers and the gay disco (florida - i can't remember the name of the place) killer.

motive makes a difference.

if you think that the capitol riot wasn't coordinated or was a "one off," i'd remind you that several people were arrested a couple of months ago for a plot to kidnap the governor of michigan.

the group seems eerily similar to those that were at the capitol riot so there seems to be something more going on.

so... to answer your question, the capitol riot was much more destructive to american society and should serve as a warning of what may be coming.

- RealityChecker

You are so gullible and easily led, Snowden would be proud of you.
Pres.cup
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Making the most of the worst situation... Canuck fan 4life , BC
Joined: 12.23.2014

Jan 14 @ 2:31 PM ET
You are so gullible and easily led, Snowden would be proud of you.
- Marwood


Naw, he's only proud of you, reality at least takes the time and effort to research and state an opinion which isn't just a regurgitated catch phrase, lol.
Pres.cup
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Making the most of the worst situation... Canuck fan 4life , BC
Joined: 12.23.2014

Jan 14 @ 2:43 PM ET
let me answer that for you:
in terms of which is more "destructive," it really is how you define the term. the blm protests/riots in the summer were definitely more destructive in the literal sense. they caused much more damage, were of a longer duration, affected more people directly, destroyed more property and caused more economic damage.

on a superficial analysis, the blm protests/riots were much, much more destructive.

but let's look at "destructive" in another more nuanced light. let's look at the destruction that the capitol protest/riot did on a superficial level but also the damage to the institution of government and society as a whole.

you might think it's trivial, but the capitol, is the literal and symbolic centre of the american government. IT WAS ATTACKED. and it was attacked for what it is: the centre of government in an attempt to change the course of government. whether they had any chance of succeeding is moot. there was a plan to do cause damage and/or kidnap/kill politicians.

you might try to discredit the source but here's a couple of stories to show the coordination of what happened:
https://www.nytimes.com/i...capitol-mob-timeline.html
https://www.nytimes.com/2...-riot-graphic-videos.html

the difference between a blm riot and the capitol riot is: 1) the level of coordination; 2) where the violence took place; and 3) their desired goals.

you'll try to "shoehorn" (your favourite term) blm into what i wrote above to equate the two but that would be disingenuous of you at best.

simply put, two similar crimes shouldn't be viewed the same way or necessarily treated the same way. there is a difference between the columbine killers and the gay disco (florida - i can't remember the name of the place) killer.

motive makes a difference.

if you think that the capitol riot wasn't coordinated or was a "one off," i'd remind you that several people were arrested a couple of months ago for a plot to kidnap the governor of michigan.

the group seems eerily similar to those that were at the capitol riot so there seems to be something more going on.

so... to answer your question, the capitol riot was much more destructive to american society and should serve as a warning of what may be coming.

- RealityChecker


I don't completely disagree with you.

I will point out that if the response had been anywhere near as strong against the Maga crowd as they were against the blm crowd, the capital would never have gained access to the building. Who's to blame for that? Several cops joined the crowd.
ACAB for sure. I'm not sure who bears that responsibility, actually I do, it's the Washington Governor who failed to mobilize an appropriate response.

As far as country wide, the Washington governor didn't protect the senate, allowing the rioters to gain access.
Personally I think the blm were good, I support them, I don't support the Maga rioters, just a bunch of spoiled brats.
I do find it hypocritical, what with the lack of response allowing access into the buildings.

The blm riots caused billions of damage and hundreds of lives. It also took over government buildings, court houses and such.

The only reason the Maga riots got into the buildings was a police failure to actually stop them which has resulted in media hysteria and censorship, rightful or wrong.

Therefore I'll say that it's the lack of response which is more dangerous. I'm not saying false flag, but some things were allowed to happen, the cops let them in instead of fighting them off.

The media doesn't want that though because orange man bad sells right now more then ACAB.

it's far more complicated and to assume one side or the other is wholly responsible is both ignorant and dangerous for the same reason that assuming I'm one side or another is prejudicial and ignorant.
Marwood
Location: Cumberland, BC
Joined: 03.18.2010

Jan 14 @ 2:46 PM ET
Naw, he's only proud of you, reality at least takes the time and effort to research and state an opinion which isn't just a regurgitated catch phrase, lol.
- Pres.cup

That's because you argue for the sake of arguing. I also recognize I won't chance your stance nor you mine.
Pres.cup
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Making the most of the worst situation... Canuck fan 4life , BC
Joined: 12.23.2014

Jan 14 @ 2:50 PM ET
That's because you argue for the sake of arguing. I also recognize I won't chance your stance nor you mine.
- Marwood



Our stances on most things are more closely aligned then you would think.
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