Is there a lower limit to the # of players that you have to have on the roster?
- vabeachbear

20.

The Oilers will be in trouble with the salary cap sooner than they think. Once McDavid completes his ELC he will ask for the moon and get it. And then all of those $6M deals with Hall, Eberle, RNH and Sekera will force their hand. And that will be before they even become a real good team with Cup possibilities.
- RickJ

Oh Dear! Whatever will they do?

My guess is it was a BS rumor. If Dallas needed a player like Sharp and failed on him why have they not addressed it since? Further, that team is in desperate straights for Defense, no real need for a winger like Sharp.
- kwolf68

When you say that then you are impugning my word. I have told you that I know that offer existed, and I state it again...I know that DAL offered the Hawks that deal as a TAKE IT OR LEAVE IT OFFER, Jim Nill has long since moved on!

and to the other guy who mentioned nurse and draisaitl, same goes..
- HB77

That was me, and I wasn't proposing anything, was asking MH what he thought a package of younger guys he was thinking would justify trading Seabrook.

20.
- TTtime

Hopefully they don't get forced into that.

Exactly, like he would never trade Saad...

What you need to understand Al is that while trading Seabrook might be one of his last options, ITS STILL AN OPTION because something has to give. You don't want to give Sharp, Bickell and Versteeg for a 6 pack of beer? Then you need to become creative, just like he was with Brandon Saad! Bowman has passed on decent deals for Sharp and Versteeg, this much I know, WHY???
- MexicoHawk

For what has he passed on a deal for Versteeg? That just seems crazy if they were able to get him traded for something decent and passed.

Seabrook's asking price is conjecture. No point in using that to debate an argument.
- kwolf68

But that is the entire point to this conversation. If Seabrook will resign with the Hawks for a WORKABLE NUMBER then this entire conversation is a MUTE POINT! If he won't (and we just witnessed a 22 year old player say that they would stay and give the Hawks a HT discount and then do an "about-face") then this question is more than valid and it doesn't matter that you or I "won't even discuss" it...how many options do you think the Hawks have to move their "dead weight" and make it come out smelling like roses???

You know, I havent looked closely at the numbers, but seems to me there's few players looking at salary increases next year other than Seabs. If the Hawks do trade Sharp and Bicks (I'm still hopeful), and Steeg is off the payroll next year whether they trade him now or not, I'm not sure they need to choose one or the other between Seabs and Craw. Maybe they can fit both. Seabs is at $5.8 cap number now. If he gets $7.5m next year, thats only $1.7 to find room for. Steeg is $1m of that. even a little cap increase fits the rest.

I'm likely missing another player that needs a raise next year. I'll look tonight. Just feels like they have a smaller problem next year, and maybe trading Saad this year takes away the need to choose Seabs or Craw next year.
- Cmonalready

You need to subtract the salaries necessary to replace the players you are getting rid of without salary coming back...we simply won't know until these players have been traded what next year will look like, but already it looks like that the Cap could be lowered again.

Hopefully they don't get forced into that.
- vabeachbear

They might have to go with a 21 man roster. RockVegas is 90 miles away. Any injury would become a LTIR type in order to make space.Not ideal but doable.

Don't you think this is going to be the case anyway? I just think everyone should be used to this now, and if they aren't, better get used to it.

With Kane and Toews contracts, I just don't get how you aren't going to have to do this every year.

To your point about Seabs cost going forward, I guess I'm in the camp that if it is a number that they never could pay, I'd still keep him this year and try and win one last cup with him.
- vabeachbear

No, it doesn't need to. I posted something last week that covered this...and its all about cost control know for Bowman...the core get longer term deals to keep their cap hit down, the aging veterans get small money deals and short terms because they have such a great chance at winning a Cup, and the young RFAs are being sent a message that before you become a part of the core (if they deserve it), they MUST accept a bridge deal (2/3 years) so that the Hawks can stay on budget! That's the plan Bowman is moving forward with.

An Anisimov and Dano-like return for Saad. If he can't, he won't do it. He has already talked to teams about Crawford, but Corey is still here...why? Because what they are offering back helps the other team more than it does the Hawks...or didn't you read my original comments on this issue?
- MexicoHawk

When it comes down to making some real painful decisions on key players, I really don't care about Crawford and even less about 34 year old Johnny Oduya. Having to sacrifice them would be short term pain to get out of cap jail and reset a still very good roster.

But with Seabrook you are talking about a key structural member of a championship team. If Toews wasn't the captain tomorrow, Seabrook would be. His value has to be considered in more than just the salary he earns and the length of his contract.

If Nashville wants to show the Roman Josi and Philip Forsberg cards in their hand, Bowman can start thinking from there. Josi is very good and cheap. Give me some other names, otherwise we are theorizing.

I get it, and I totally agree with you. SB must be prepared to do near anything IF it will improve the team and address the cap. Here is where I nuance that...

SB needs to seriously consider just walking away from Bickell, Versteeg, and maybe even Sharp long before considering trading Seabrook and Sharp unless the trade is absolutely guaranteed to be in his favor. Given what Seabrook and even Sharp mean and contribute to this team, I don't believe there is anyone on the Edmonton team that makes the loss of those contributions palatable (except mcdavid).
- fvineze

And I don't disagree with you, but like I said to another blogger, that clearly Stan doesn't agree with this...so then the questions become, "what's he up to and why?"

Yes, very good but Seabs payday isn't increasing six times over. Saad's payday went from just under a million to $6mil.

Seabs would be going from what $5.9 to $7.5...maybe $8mil. It's still only an increase of $2.1 vs $5mil with Saad.
- HawkintheD

That doesn't matter...what matter is that the Hawks CANNOT afford another contract over $6.5 million with the deals that Toews and Kane got...this is the consequence for holding on to them "forever"! If Seabs doesn't want a nice long term deal for $6.5 million a season to remain in Chicago, then he has to be traded or next year it will mean dealing Crawford AND...

How much is Kruger expected to net

The only way Seabrook goes anywhere is if he wants to go...
He's 30 years old and has made good money. His situation for an extension could set up nicely for a max like deal which would tie him in long term with his good buddy Keith who is signed through 2023.

Thus Seabrook takes a little less the first 4 years and makes more money than most 35+ players on the backend of his new deal.

I don't want to slam you but your remarks indicate you have no clue how business is done in the NHL. ...I never said Saad couldn't be traded, and it was not the preferred choice but he had to be traded under the circumstances, otherwise Bowman would have gotten only draft picks in return. Bowman had no leverage with an offer sheet scare...And he has no leverage now and really can't/won't try to create any.

Bowman has two players that are a load to trade, in essence they have little value and where your logic defies hockey or business sense is...

You don't make matters worse by tearing a club apart to trade a Seabrook away for a package of young players....This is still a Cup contending team..It will be marketed that way and people will fill the stands night after night as the register keeps humming....There will be no rebuilding here while so many players are in their prime or have not yet reached it.

Bowman doesn't need to risk tearing the team apart to create value for two players that have little...

The fact is Sharp was never worth a 1st rounder and a choice prospect +...Otherwise he would be gone so that is strike one and either was Bickell strike 2...And Bowman isn't going to strike out and cripple a team only to avoid giving Sharp and Bickell away. If he has to add to their package think IceHogs in the last year of their ELC.

Who cares at this point about Sharp and Bickell's value? They kept both players through last summer to have a better chance to win the Cup and did so...Nothing else to prove.

Now it is time to shed the salary of a 33 yr old player coming off a poor season, and one who has shown throughout his AHL and NHL careers to be very inconsistent.

Every big name player still under contract has a no trade or no movement clause...The only ones that will be traded are Sharp and or Bickell.

If Crawford's or Seabrook's or Kane's or anyone else's agent makes a call to McKenzie, Dreger or a Hawks beat writer or anyone in the media and tells them they were asked to present a list of teams...
Than I will be first in line to say your scenario could happen to some extent.

Until then no more keystrokes from me on this stuff.
- Al

"I don't want to slam you, but your remarks indicate you gave no idea how business is done in the NHL"

Makes me think of a classic Saturday Night Live moment

"Jane, you ignorant slut!"

http://youtu.be/k80nW6AOhTs

How much is Kruger expected to net
- MTL1

My guess a range of $2M to $2.5M per year.

I don't want to slam you but your remarks indicate you have no clue how business is done in the NHL. ...I never said Saad couldn't be traded, and it was not the preferred choice but he had to be traded under the circumstances, otherwise Bowman would have gotten only draft picks in return. Bowman had no leverage with an offer sheet scare...And he has no leverage now and really can't/won't try to create any.

Bowman has two players that are a load to trade, in essence they have little value and where your logic defies hockey or business sense is...

You don't make matters worse by tearing a club apart to trade a Seabrook away for a package of young players....This is still a Cup contending team..It will be marketed that way and people will fill the stands night after night as the register keeps humming....There will be no rebuilding here while so many players are in their prime or have not yet reached it.

Bowman doesn't need to risk tearing the team apart to create value for two players that have little...

The fact is Sharp was never worth a 1st rounder and a choice prospect +...Otherwise he would be gone so that is strike one and either was Bickell strike 2...And Bowman isn't going to strike out and cripple a team only to avoid giving Sharp and Bickell away. If he has to add to their package think IceHogs in the last year of their ELC.

Who cares at this point about Sharp and Bickell's value? They kept both players through last summer to have a better chance to win the Cup and did so...Nothing else to prove.

Now it is time to shed the salary of a 33 yr old player coming off a poor season, and one who has shown throughout his AHL and NHL careers to be very inconsistent.

Every big name player still under contract has a no trade or no movement clause...The only ones that will be traded are Sharp and or Bickell.

If Crawford's or Seabrook's or Kane's or anyone else's agent makes a call to McKenzie, Dreger or a Hawks beat writer or anyone in the media and tells them they were asked to present a list of teams...
Than I will be first in line to say your scenario could happen to some extent.

Until then no more keystrokes from me on this stuff.
- Al

Uh, Al I think all of my comments do indicate that I understand both finance and hockey. You are making judgments without understanding the heart of what I am saying...and that is if Seabrook won't sign a WORKABLE EXTENSION, then the Hawks can't afford him without getting rid of Crawford AND another good player and sizeable contract. If he will sign a workable extension, then all of this is a MUTE POINT...or didn't you actually read what I said?

For Bowman to help move Sharp, Bickell and/or Versteeg knowing (which he may or may not know) that he can't afford a Seabrook extension for a return similar to the quality of the Saad deal, then he has proved his genius again. Again, if Seabrook wants to finish his career here with a workable deal, then GREAT, end of story! But Bowman has to think outside of the box to succeed in a league where everyone is gunning for him, and none have sympathy for his position!

That doesn't matter...what matter is that the Hawks CANNOT afford another contract over $6.5 million with the deals that Toews and Kane got...this is the consequence for holding on to them "forever"! If Seabs doesn't want a nice long term deal for $6.5 million a season to remain in Chicago, then he has to be traded or next year it will mean dealing Crawford AND...
- MexicoHawk

Why can't they? You keep comparing this to the Saad situation but you keep ignoring the fact, also mentioned by others, that Saad's new deal was going to be for 5M more. Whereas Seabrook's new deal will be closer 1.5 or so. That is basically a bottom 6 veteran. Which are much easier to replace that a top pairing D-man who also happens to be the heart and soul of the team.

I know you think the return for Saad is great. Maybe it is. But as of right now, neither of the players have ever exceeded Saad;s production in a season.

For what has he passed on a deal for Versteeg? That just seems crazy if they were able to get him traded for something decent and passed.
- Dannyboy

Danny, I promise you that he has..for both a younger forward with a slightly smaller Cap hit and a deal that was simply for a pick. So again, the question is "why"?

How much is Kruger expected to net
- MTL1

Depends on whether he has a good tax guy or not.

No one, including Stan, WANTS to trade 7.

The chances of 7 being traded are still SLIM.

BUT to say that it cannot happen is folly. The chances are SLIM but INCREASING slowly.

As I've posted over the past few days, Seabrook is part of the disaster scenario / Plan Z.

The conventional wisdom was to move 10, 29, 23. If, for any reason, those cannot be achieved, where do you go next? Probably 50. After that? Probably 7.

The other factor is 7's demands for his next deal. Is his agent making similar demands as Giordano's agent? That won't work for the Hawks. Again, the reasonable outcome is 6-7 years with a cap hit between 5.25 and 6.

As I posted last night, any trade with EDM involving 7 would be an absolute blockbuster with multiple pieces going each way.

When it comes down to making some real painful decisions on key players, I really don't care about Crawford and even less about 34 year old Johnny Oduya. Having to sacrifice them would be short term pain to get out of cap jail and reset a still very good roster.

But with Seabrook you are talking about a key structural member of a championship team. If Toews wasn't the captain tomorrow, Seabrook would be. His value has to be considered in more than just the salary he earns and the length of his contract.

If Nashville wants to show the Roman Josi and Philip Forsberg cards in their hand, Bowman can start thinking from there. Josi is very good and cheap. Give me some other names, otherwise we are theorizing.
- RickJ

Indeed, we are only theorizing...but there is a number that all the wonderful and true things you said about Seabrook go right out the window...that's the brutal reality of Salary Cap hockey and having twin team mascots in Toews and Kane!

My guess a range of $2M to $2.5M per year.
- roenick

Let's say it is indeed $2M

Retain 200K on versteeg and move him for a pick ASAP

Gotta get the ball rolling sooner rather than later

But I fear other GMs are playing hardball with SB and will now start looking internally as development camps are open to fill their spots than to deal with the hawks

Depends on whether he has a good tax guy or not.
- TTtime