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Quick Hits: Vigneault on Vet Intangibles, Williams, and More

April 25, 2019, 9:16 AM ET [131 Comments]
Bill Meltzer
Philadelphia Flyers Blogger •NHL.com • RSSArchiveCONTACT
Quick Hits: April 25, 2019

1) During his introductory press conference last week, Flyers head coach Alain Vigneault made an interesting statement in regard to what he considers an ideal mix of players on a team. After talking about young players and vets in their prime, he said that he still sees value in a team carrying at least one older veteran whose statistics (presumably either primary stats or analytics) may not look pretty at this stage of his career but who still brings a significant intangible value in terms of locker room dynamics.

Said Vigneault, "You have to be able to work with your core players, to make them understand the culture that you’re trying to install in your group, what is acceptable, what the standards are, what we’re looking to accomplish. A lot of those [most successful] teams, the third component you have is older veterans that might not be able to perform at the same way that they once did, but bring an intangible that’s really important to the chemistry of a dressing room. If you can work with those players, show them the respect that they deserve through their years in the league, they can be a big asset to a team and an organization."

I suspected that there were would a portion of the fanbase that would immediately jump all over the comments; either to criticize the notion of "intangibles as a primary value" as outdated in today's game or to simply speculate on whom such a player might be in Philly come next season.

What I will say in the first regard is that many NHL players themselves still see value in having an "intangibles" guy within the room; somewhat akin to a late-career Mike Knuble under Bruce Boudreau in Washington and Peter Laviolette in Philly. Personally, I think there first needs to be sufficiently productive group higher on the depth to reap the ancillary benefit, and that group needs to have guys who are pretty solid in the intangibles in their own right. On the Flyers off-seasoning shopping list, top-six forward, upper-lineup defenseman and a goaltender to pair with Carter Hart need to be the three main items.

Ideally, such a player would also still be reasonably productive on the ice, even if no longer at his absolute peak. The current gold standard is Carolina's Justin Williams (who is still putting up 20+ goal seasons and 50 points in the regular season on top of his knack for stepping up in the playoffs, as he did again on the final play of the Canes-Capitals series). The best Flyers example would be the 2011-12 version of Jaromir Jagr.

2) I know that Ron Hextall as GM, in his "second phase" of his long-term building plan (he had not yet reached what he regarded as the third phase -- seeking a final piece or two to a championship contender puzzle -- at the point he was fired), elected to steer away from signing older vets whom he feared would tie up a roster spot and block younger players whom he felt might be ready to either compete for a spot in camp or advance to an in-season recall.

It will be interesting to see how Chuck Fletcher approaches that aspect this off-season. In hindsight, the Flyers probably missed out on some potential added short-term value to the streaky bubble teams they've had in recent years. For instance, I'd rather the Flyers have had Williams on their side rather than against them in that 2016 series against Washington.

3) In regard to the trade way back in 2004 that sent Williams from the Flyers to Carolina for Danny Markov, it turned out to be a bad trade in the long term but it certainly helped the team in the short-term. The Flyers of 2003-04 were deep up front but had needs on the blueline.

Markov was an absolute warrior for the team down the stretch and then had to play very heavy minutes in the playoffs as attrition left the team with only three semi-healthy defenseman, another playing injured (Kim Johnsson, who was injured in the final game of the first-round series against New Jersey and was far less than 100 percent even after his return), winger Sami Kapanen pressed into service as a defenseman, and seventh defenseman Mattias Timander forced to play second-pair type of minutes. Through it all, Markov and fellow late season addition Vladimir Malakhov were very good at a crucial time. He was absolutely an important part of why the Flyers even got so close to the reaching the Cup Final, before ultimately losing a 2-1 seventh game to Tampa in the Eastern Conference Final.

The intent at the time was not for Markov's stay in Philly to be as short as it was. But then there was a full-season lockout and the implementation of a salary cap. The Flyers signed two high-priced veteran UFAs in Derian Hatcher and Mike Rathje. Markov had both injury-issues and off-ice issues at the time, and ended up not coming back after the lockout.

Williams, who still has a residence in New Jersey, has ended up having a lengthy and highly productive NHL career while Markov was out of the NHL after 2006-07. However, if the Flyers had won the 2004 Stanley Cup -- they had a team capable of doing so -- the trade would have been worthwhile regardless of what came afterward. Markov lived up to his end of the bargain that spring. Unfortunately, Eric Desjardins and Marcus Ragnarsson went down, two-time Barry Ashbee Trophy winner Johnsson (who was brilliant in the first round series) was playing at about 50 percent when he came back and both Eric Weinrich and Chris Therien had been traded by the deadline. Joni Pitkänen was a 20-year-old rookie. As gamely as Kapanen played on D and even Timander found ways to step up, the Flyers simply ran out of bodies and energy.
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