Crawford would be traded if hawks got darling!
- Scott1977

To who (whom?) - that would (a) want a $6MM goalie who still needs to prove that he isn't permanently damaged, and that (b) Crawford would consent to go to?

And even if they could find a "to who (whom?)" - there is still a for what? Again - a $6MM goalie who still needs to prove he isn't permanently damaged.

We keep trying to trade expensive players that we think have playing issues and thinking someone is going to give top value back.

Propose me a S/C competitive roster that can support 30-33M for only 3 players, and going to the next 5 and your at 60M. thats 60M for 8 players.
- riozzo

Penguins top 4 cap hits = 32M Caps top 4 = 31M Hawks top 4 cap hits - 34M. I believe the Pens won the last 2 cups and the Caps may win this one.

No doubt they need their top salaried players to play better, but I would argue that Seabs and Saad were bigger disappointments this year than Toews in relation to their cap hits.

Did you actually watch Forsberg?

He STINKS!!!

Take the numbers & burn them.

Guy is a BUST!
- Goalie-33

Hawks were a dumpster fire so Forsberg got zero help. His play mirrored the team as they all had their 12 stuck square up their 6. Give him some time in Rockford to settle back in.

So same as last half of last year (no reliable starting or backup goalie) plus one top four D guy, with only $4-5MM left to sign five forwards....

Worse in net, a little better on D, same group of signed forwards with the I-Pass shuffle again for the other five forward slots.

On balance, same or worse results, paying our top six forwards $253,000 per goal scored for a last place finish.
- Return of the Roar

Ok make good solid points yes darling had a horrible year that's not to say if puts the time in in the offseason he can be better this coming season. I m this trade proposal as an example of what maybe the hawks might do just my opinion until moves are made not only with the hawks but around the league trade proposals and rumors will be subject of a lot of discussions.

To who (whom?) - that would (a) want a $6MM goalie who still needs to prove that he isn't permanently damaged, and that (b) Crawford would consent to go to?

And even if they could find a "to who (whom?)" - there is still a for what? Again - a $6MM goalie who still needs to prove he isn't permanently damaged.

We keep trying to trade expensive players that we think have playing issues and thinking someone is going to give top value back.
- StLBravesFan

Doubt Crawford gets traded but 2 teams off the top of my head Islanders and Philly
need a goaltender of Crawford quality. You are correct on Crawford's health needs to prove he is 100% healthy for any trade to happen plus he has a NMT so he can say no to a trade.

Penguins top 4 cap hits = 32M Caps top 4 = 31M Hawks top 4 cap hits - 34M. I believe the Pens won the last 2 cups and the Caps may win this one.

No doubt they need their top salaried players to play better, but I would argue that Seabs and Saad were bigger disappointments this year than Toews in relation to their cap hits.
- TheTrob

You missed my point, tell me what 15 players you sign for a total of 18 - 20M, with 5M of that not available until after season day 1. That is the problem if you add Tavaras

I think the Hawks could get a could return for Toews. I'm not dumping on the guy, but I do feel it's time to make the move if you can get some good return back.
- Hank3Henshaw

What good return? He is your #1 center, on a team/organization that is not deep on centers. Any trade you make needs to return a top center, and either a top 4 D a top 9 forward, or a high pick/prospect. Assume that no team is giving you a 1C, and to get out from under his cap hit you instead "settle" a top 6 forward and a top 4D or pick/prospect, or whatever combination you think of. What team is trading you that? If his perceived value is as low as everyone seems to think, what GM is giving up assets that come close to what you need?

Give me a proposal with any team in the league that is feasible for both teams.

Whether you believe his decline is permanent or not, the eye test this past season for the 8 games he missed shows how HUGE the hole on this team is when he doesn't play

You missed my point, tell me what 15 players you sign for a total of 18 - 20M, with 5M of that not available until after season day 1. That is the problem if you add Tavaras
- riozzo

Right now Hawks have 19 players signed and 7M+ in open cap space and that includes Hossa's cap hit. A little creativity and you can fit Tavares.

What good return? He is your #1 center, on a team/organization that is not deep on centers. Any trade you make needs to return a top center, and either a top 4 D a top 9 forward, or a high pick/prospect. Assume that no team is giving you a 1C, and to get out from under his cap hit you instead "settle" a top 6 forward and a top 4D or pick/prospect, or whatever combination you think of. What team is trading you that? If his perceived value is as low as everyone seems to think, what GM is giving up assets that come close to what you need?

Give me a proposal with any team in the league that is feasible for both teams.

Whether you believe his decline is permanent or not, the eye test this past season for the 8 games he missed shows how HUGE the hole on this team is when he doesn't play
- TheTrob

You can’t look at the games Toews missed at the end of the season. The Hawks were out of it at that point and totally lacked intensity. Even if they tried to play with intensity it would have been hard to do when the games were meaningless. Toews was an average player last year. More importantly he seemed to lack the strength and grittiness that characterized his earlier career.

Right now Hawks have 19 players signed and 7M+ in open cap space and that includes Hossa's cap hit. A little creativity and you can fit Tavares.
- TheTrob

and when they have to pay 95,8,55,40 next year? Cap hell Tavares does not move any club from bottom feeder to S/C finals.

Right now Hawks have 19 players signed and 7M+ in open cap space and that includes Hossa's cap hit. A little creativity and you can fit Tavares.
- TheTrob

But of the 19 guys signed, only eight are forwards.....still need to sign five more, unless you continue to shuffle the kids from Rockford all year to fill out the roster.

If you accept the premise that NONE of them are top six/top four guys, how does spending almost all of your cap by adding yet another enormous contract in any way fix what ails without moving 2/7/19/20/50/88?

To who (whom?) - that would (a) want a $6MM goalie who still needs to prove that he isn't permanently damaged, and that (b) Crawford would consent to go to?

And even if they could find a "to who (whom?)" - there is still a for what? Again - a $6MM goalie who still needs to prove he isn't permanently damaged.

We keep trying to trade expensive players that we think have playing issues and thinking someone is going to give top value back.
- StLBravesFan

The "we" is the know nothing amateurs who kinda forget the other guy you are trying to trade with might know a thing or two or three...

and when they have to pay 95,8,55,40 next year? Cap hell Tavares does not move any club from bottom feeder to S/C finals.
- riozzo

Sparks will still be Toronto property next year on a one way contract.
- TJYTJY

Thanks for the info on Sparks.

What good return? He is your #1 center, on a team/organization that is not deep on centers. Any trade you make needs to return a top center, and either a top 4 D a top 9 forward, or a high pick/prospect. Assume that no team is giving you a 1C, and to get out from under his cap hit you instead "settle" a top 6 forward and a top 4D or pick/prospect, or whatever combination you think of. What team is trading you that? If his perceived value is as low as everyone seems to think, what GM is giving up assets that come close to what you need?

Give me a proposal with any team in the league that is feasible for both teams.

Whether you believe his decline is permanent or not, the eye test this past season for the 8 games he missed shows how HUGE the hole on this team is when he doesn't play
- TheTrob

An interesting question is this: Is Toews a 1C on other teams, though?

I don't know...personally, I thought he should have been bumped down to 2C as sort of a "wakeup call." Again, not dumping on him, but why is it that he can remain on the top line with little results, when other guys are being bounced up and down for poor play?

I like Toews, I want the guy to bounce back, but it's been a tough three seasons for him. I think if there's a team out there willing to trade for him (and take that contract or most of it) and send something good back, they should do it--before it gets too hard to move him.

I can't even give you any trade scenarios because the league is so wild, we don't even know what teams the Hawks are talking to about what guys and so forth. You also never know that there could be a three-team deal or something in place where the Hawks are looking to trade him and then flip those pieces to another team for a different guy to come back to CHI.

There's just so many variables we as fans don't know.

I just think that now might be to the time to shake things up a bit and move a core guy like Toews.

and when they have to pay 95,8,55,40 next year? Cap hell Tavares does not move any club from bottom feeder to S/C finals.
- riozzo

I understand your point, but 55 and 95 aren't a given to make the team in the fall yet, 40 might sign a bridge contract longer than 1yr soon and he isn't more than a 4th liner at this point anyway. The only guy who can expect a significant raise at the end of next season is 8. Far from cap hell.

I understand your point, but 55 and 95 aren't a given to make the team in the fall yet, 40 might sign a bridge contract longer than 1yr soon and he isn't more than a 4th liner at this point anyway. The only guy who can expect a significant raise at the end of next season is 8. Far from cap hell.
- stonefire

Big John is a guy I think they should make sure stays around CHI.

Just my opinion.

The "we" is the know nothing amateurs who kinda forget the other guy you are trying to trade with might know a thing or two or three...

- bogiedoc

It also does not help the trade Crawford crowd when Rocky says publicly he is not sure about his status. Because if he is good to go, you keep him until more options present themselves. If he is not good to go, he is not tradeable.

Doubt Crawford gets traded but 2 teams off the top of my head Islanders and Philly
need a goaltender of Crawford quality. You are correct on Crawford's health needs to prove he is 100% healthy for any trade to happen plus he has a NMT so he can say no to a trade.
- Scott1977

Would be crazy if he doesn’t pass the training camp physical!

An interesting question is this: Is Toews a 1C on other teams, though?

I don't know...personally, I thought he should have been bumped down to 2C as sort of a "wakeup call." Again, not dumping on him, but why is it that he can remain on the top line with little results, when other guys are being bounced up and down for poor play?

I like Toews, I want the guy to bounce back, but it's been a tough three seasons for him. I think if there's a team out there willing to trade for him (and take that contract or most of it) and send something good back, they should do it--before it gets too hard to move him.

I can't even give you any trade scenarios because the league is so wild, we don't even know what teams the Hawks are talking to about what guys and so forth. You also never know that there could be a three-team deal or something in place where the Hawks are looking to trade him and then flip those pieces to another team for a different guy to come back to CHI.

There's just so many variables we as fans don't know.

I just think that now might be to the time to shake things up a bit and move a core guy like Toews.
- Hank3Henshaw

Probably yes on the bottom ten to fifteen teams.

Would be crazy if he doesn’t pass the training camp physical!
- walleyeb1

What would be the salary cap implications of that?

The "we" is the know nothing amateurs who kinda forget the other guy you are trying to trade with might know a thing or two or three...

- bogiedoc

I was trying to be inclusive....

Based on what ? It just seems as though he is actually declining. How does he go about reversing that? And if it really has been injury related, he's still gotten older in the mean time. Everyone's healing capacities decline as we age. So seriously, how does he become the dynamic force he once was? When numerous posters here who are far more enlightened than myself seem to think he won't.
- BobP.

Does anyone know if the new Chicago summer pro league is for American players only? Noticed that our guys on the roster are all Americans (maybe naturally because it's the guys who are back home for the summer), but am not as familiar with origins of the others. If not, was hoping Toews would opt in to work on his game.

ETA: Thinking about it, assuming the players are getting paid in some way, having non-US citizens on the team may cause issues with their work visas.

Does anyone know if the new Chicago summer pro league is for American players only? Noticed that our guys on the roster are all Americans (maybe naturally because it's the guys who are back home for the summer), but am not as familiar with origins of the others. If not, was hoping Toews would opt in to work on his game.
- pdx2ord

Poppycock and balderdash PDX.

Toews will get right ONNIT. Me thinks another trip to Machu Pichu is in order along with some psychedelic shrooms. Toews should hop on over to my backyard, I have plenty of crazy looking mushrooms popping up all over near the base of my oaks and hickories.

Poppycock and balderdash PDX.

Toews will get right ONNIT. Me thinks another trip to Machu Pichu is in order along with some psychedelic shrooms. Toews should hop on over to my backyard, I have plenty of crazy looking mushrooms popping up all over near the base of my oaks and hickories.
- savvyone-1

OK, OK, a girl can dream, tho