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Forums :: Blog World :: Justin Lowe: It Takes 250 Games
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BetweenTheDots
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: IL
Joined: 06.13.2015

Mar 19 @ 1:12 PM ET
Regarding Hossa's LTIR, the gm's can look into it all they want it doesn't matter the Hawks are following the rules agreed upon in the cba. Lot of smoke here....
Rota's Rooter
Chicago Blackhawks
Joined: 06.23.2017

Mar 19 @ 1:13 PM ET
"The earliest Sikura could sign with the Hawks would be Sunday or Monday if Northeastern loses on Saturday. But he won't sign anyway, he'll do the smart thing and test free agency.
- walleyeb1




Quotes acting up again. Curious as what exactly you think he'd be testing the FA market for? What could he be looking to get since the entry level contracts are what they are?

It's possible Sikura may not want to be a part of a reboot/rebuild with the Hawks. He seems to like coach Sullivan from the Pens. He may see his future as playing with or behind Malkin and Crosby for the near future.
Z3Hawk
Chicago Blackhawks
Joined: 05.04.2017

Mar 19 @ 1:19 PM ET
Regarding LTIR terms this is a legal issue and as a rule any newly adopted terms would not or should not work retroactively. Consequently, if Hossa’s injury qualified it should continue to be qualified.

The terms governing LTIRs are very poorly drafted. Easy to correct. Cap hits are already averaged. If you averaged actual salary front-loading is done away with. Now the Owners or Players or both might argue for the retention of front-loading but then don’t complain when it actually causes problems like Hossa’s contract does. Hossa’s situation smells terrible because his actual salary to be received fell so low.

Regarding qualifying for the LTIR the terms that are applicable could not be more unnecessarily burdensome. A player may wish to retire for any number of reasons, injury related or not, before the expiry of a contract. That there are terms keeping alive contracts of players who are no longer playing is legally absurd. That a team can actually trade the contracts of players who are no longer playing is also legally absurd.

On another issue it is mind-numbing to me that no Lawyer for the Owners caught the fact that College players could become Free Agents just by staying in school. Unbelievable! How is this even possible?
DarthKane
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: 5.13.4.9
Joined: 02.23.2012

Mar 19 @ 1:20 PM ET
"The earliest Sikura could sign with the Hawks would be Sunday or Monday if Northeastern loses on Saturday. But he won't sign anyway, he'll do the smart thing and test free agency.

DeBrincat has had a stellar season, one of the only bright spots for the Hawks this season. He's 6th in overall rookie points and tied for second with 25 goals (behind only Boeser). This is all while playing 2-3 minutes less per game game than the other top rookies. DeBrincat's only issue has been his lack of consistency, but some of that can be chalked up to Q playing him with guys like Bouma consistently rather than the team's top end talent. If Kane is going to stick with Toews I'd like to see DeBrincat move up to Schmaltz's line."
- DarthKane


Quotes acting up again. Curious as what exactly you think he'd be testing the FA market for? What could he be looking to get since the entry level contracts are what they are?

- walleyeb1


Long term earning potential. Yes, he could burn a year with the Hawks but he's also more likely to end up in the AHL or on the 4th line with scrubs like Bouma. Just look at how Q handled a talent like DeBrincat, why would Sikura want that? Instead he can go to a place like Pittsburgh and play with either Crosby or Malkin, then he'll make far more in his next contract than he would in Chicago.
67hawks
Joined: 08.30.2012

Mar 19 @ 1:20 PM ET
Quotes acting up again. Curious as what exactly you think he'd be testing the FA market for? What could he be looking to get since the entry level contracts are what they are?

It's possible Sikura may not want to be a part of a reboot/rebuild with the Hawks. He seems to like coach Sullivan from the Pens. He may see his future as playing with or behind Malkin and Crosby for the near future.

- Rota's Rooter


If that happens, bury his brother in the ECHL next season.
BetweenTheDots
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: IL
Joined: 06.13.2015

Mar 19 @ 1:20 PM ET
When I reflect on last night's game, if CC was in net we win. 2 5 hole goals should of been stopped. 1st PP goal Toews did a poor job of blocking. The young forwards like Jurco chasing the puck instead of being aware of where Pietro was last night to tie the game. Amazing how the little things are now costing the Hawks games instead of winning them.
breadbag
Location: Edmonton, AB
Joined: 11.30.2015

Mar 19 @ 1:28 PM ET
When I reflect on last night's game, if CC was in net we win. 2 5 hole goals should of been stopped. 1st PP goal Toews did a poor job of blocking. The young forwards like Jurco chasing the puck instead of being aware of where Pietro was last night to tie the game. Amazing how the little things are now costing the Hawks games instead of winning them.
- BetweenTheDots


A wouldn't expect to see too many of those things while they play meaningless games down the stretch. There were a lot of things last night, starting with Kane's terrible penalty to start the game. He probably doesn't take the penalty if the game mattered.
DarthKane
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: 5.13.4.9
Joined: 02.23.2012

Mar 19 @ 1:30 PM ET
Regarding Hossa's LTIR, the gm's can look into it all they want it doesn't matter the Hawks are following the rules agreed upon in the cba. Lot of smoke here....
- BetweenTheDots



Hossa's contract was legit under the CBA in which it was signed but the league didn't have an issue punishing the Hawks (and other teams) when the new CBA was signed. LTIR is evaluated on an annual basis, the league could easily go back on their word again and not allow the Hawks to place Hossa on LTIR.
bogiedoc
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: VA
Joined: 09.27.2011

Mar 19 @ 1:38 PM ET
When I reflect on last night's game, if CC was in net we win. 2 5 hole goals should of been stopped. 1st PP goal Toews did a poor job of blocking. The young forwards like Jurco chasing the puck instead of being aware of where Pietro was last night to tie the game. Amazing how the little things are now costing the Hawks games instead of winning them.
- BetweenTheDots


they have lost at least 8-10 games they would have won 2-3 years ago...they beat themselves as keith said they are making mistakes all over the ice that are costing them...a failed clear, puck possession issues, TO's, laziness and, poor situational awareness and mediocre goalie play that can't bail them out
Nucker101
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Vancouver, BC
Joined: 09.26.2010

Mar 19 @ 1:39 PM ET
Justin Lowe: It Takes 250 Games
There's a theory that it takes a defenceman in the NHL 250 games to really hit their stride and play a complete, consistent and responsible game.

Sure, people can point to the outliers like Aaron Ekblad and Charlie McAvoy who stepped in as teenagers and played big minutes. However, if you asked fans or media on the Panthers and/or Bruins, they would point out that those guys made (and are still making) mistakes that we yell at Jordan Oesterle for.

- Justin Lowe


What happens between game 249 and 250?
powerenforcer
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Wheeling, IL
Joined: 09.24.2009

Mar 19 @ 1:40 PM ET
Since Mike Fisher retired without officially retiring, couldn't Hossa do the same thing? Announce a retirement without signing retirement papers. Would that fall under the retirement rule?
jhawk59
Chicago Blackhawks
Joined: 02.15.2013

Mar 19 @ 1:40 PM ET
Quotes acting up again. Curious as what exactly you think he'd be testing the FA market for? What could he be looking to get since the entry level contracts are what they are?

It's possible Sikura may not want to be a part of a reboot/rebuild with the Hawks. He seems to like coach Sullivan from the Pens. He may see his future as playing with or behind Malkin and Crosby for the near future.

- Rota's Rooter


He better be careful what he wishes for. How long will he play there before salary cap forces Penguins to trade him. It is not a big salary he adds; rather, it is two other factors to be concerned about if he is looking for assurance to stay on Pittsburgh

One point of less significance is the squeeze - ability to add or subtract players during the year, particularly at trade deadline. Sikura is basicly another one mill contract so it probably forces the Penguins to keep more farm club players on hand at cheap rates. They keep coming up with those - some this year too. They move closer to a 50/50 split with minor league type and cllearly rol e players cultivated from their farm system.

The second point: add up the team salaries. If someone can be moved whom is cap friendly and is looking like a good young talent, Sikura is a leading candidate. And in order to remain in the playoff race each year, the Penguins have history of key players going down injured. To find a fill in on defense may require trading the college boy.
HawkintheD
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Sick Bay, MI
Joined: 02.22.2012

Mar 19 @ 1:44 PM ET
What happens between game 249 and 250?
- Nucker101


Metamorphosis.
DarthKane
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: 5.13.4.9
Joined: 02.23.2012

Mar 19 @ 1:46 PM ET
Since Mike Fisher retired without officially retiring, couldn't Hossa do the same thing? Announce a retirement without signing retirement papers. Would that fall under the retirement rule?
- powerenforcer



Nope, if Hossa (or anyone else with contracts like his) retired then the full cap hit is on the books. Under the old CBA (which the contract was signed under) Hossa could have retired. Under the new CBA it's not an option.

The Hawks have two ways out of this:

1. Continue to put Hossa on LTIR
2. Trade Hossa and hope he doesn't retire (the cap hit would still come back to Chicago).
Z3Hawk
Chicago Blackhawks
Joined: 05.04.2017

Mar 19 @ 1:53 PM ET
The 250 game D-Man Rule is ludicrous. As is the he is too small to play in the NHL Rule. As is the modern D-Man doesn’t have to touch anyone or actually know how to play defence Rule - and so on.

I love to fish and a very challenging fish to catch is the Steelhead. Steelhead are called “The fish of a 1000 casts”. I have had many days where I have been lucky enough to catch many Steelhead. This phrase is not meant literally but is used as an acknowledgment that generally Steelhead are more challenging to hook than other species.

D-Men who have the necessary attributes can be very effective as young players, especially when properly coached. In the same manner D-Men who do not have the necessary attributes may never be effective regardless of how many games they play.

If a D-Man is already on the other side of 25 and seems to have no idea how to take the body of an opposing player and no idea where to be in his D-Zone 1000 games isn’t going to help. You must analyze each D-Man individually.
Rota's Rooter
Chicago Blackhawks
Joined: 06.23.2017

Mar 19 @ 1:56 PM ET
Since Mike Fisher retired without officially retiring, couldn't Hossa do the same thing? Announce a retirement without signing retirement papers. Would that fall under the retirement rule?
- powerenforcer

Apples and grapes. Fisher's contract ended last season so there was no salary cap hit for Nashville. Any team could have signed him he was a UFA.
Colbyboy
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Summerside , PEI
Joined: 12.14.2013

Mar 19 @ 1:59 PM ET
I think for Sikura - Tavares and others Florida is looking a viable option

A good young team that is getting better
- no pressure-
- no state tax
- good young coach
-solid owner with $$$$
-solid GM
BINGO!
Carolina Hurricanes
Location: I'll always remember the last words my grandfather ever told me. He said, "A Truck!", SK
Joined: 09.21.2009

Mar 19 @ 2:00 PM ET
I don't think the Hawks have anything to worry about. Medically unfit to play is medically unfit to play. The one I find interesting is Lupul who claimed he was healthy enough to play one day, but then later "changed his story".
- breadbag


Yeah I think the biggest one they want to look at is Soshnikov, who was on IR, then went down for a conditioning stint, and immediately went back on IR upon his return to the Leafs, so that they didn't have to make any roster moves...

Toronto has been exploiting LTIR a lot with Lupul, Horton, Robidas.... Some other teams are a bit upset about it.
Nucker101
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Vancouver, BC
Joined: 09.26.2010

Mar 19 @ 2:01 PM ET
Metamorphosis.
- HawkintheD

Nucker101
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Vancouver, BC
Joined: 09.26.2010

Mar 19 @ 2:02 PM ET
Yeah I think the biggest one they want to look at is Soshnikov, who was on IR, then went down for a conditioning stint, and immediately went back on IR upon his return to the Leafs, so that they didn't have to make any roster moves...

Toronto has been exploiting LTIR a lot with Lupul, Horton, Robidas.... Some other teams are a bit upset about it.

- BINGO!


I heard that the Canes are only offering minimum wage for the new GM job.



I’ve applied.



It’s time to move on from McDonald’s
bogiedoc
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: VA
Joined: 09.27.2011

Mar 19 @ 2:03 PM ET
Since Mike Fisher retired without officially retiring, couldn't Hossa do the same thing? Announce a retirement without signing retirement papers. Would that fall under the retirement rule?
- powerenforcer


no...fisher didn't have a contract...hossa does with recapture penalties..
BINGO!
Carolina Hurricanes
Location: I'll always remember the last words my grandfather ever told me. He said, "A Truck!", SK
Joined: 09.21.2009

Mar 19 @ 2:05 PM ET
Since Mike Fisher retired without officially retiring, couldn't Hossa do the same thing? Announce a retirement without signing retirement papers. Would that fall under the retirement rule?
- powerenforcer


Fisher wasn't under contract when he "Retired"

He was a UFA.
BINGO!
Carolina Hurricanes
Location: I'll always remember the last words my grandfather ever told me. He said, "A Truck!", SK
Joined: 09.21.2009

Mar 19 @ 2:06 PM ET
I heard that the Canes are only offering minimum wage for the new GM job.



I’ve applied.



It’s time to move on from McDonald’s

- Nucker101



I wish you luck!
powerenforcer
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Wheeling, IL
Joined: 09.24.2009

Mar 19 @ 2:06 PM ET
Nope, if Hossa (or anyone else with contracts like his) retired then the full cap hit is on the books. Under the old CBA (which the contract was signed under) Hossa could have retired. Under the new CBA it's not an option.

The Hawks have two ways out of this:

1. Continue to put Hossa on LTIR
2. Trade Hossa and hope he doesn't retire (the cap hit would still come back to Chicago).

- DarthKane


But what is the "legal" retirement? Is there a loophole that satates "only if a player signs retirement paper"? Bettman is not that smart! We all know it.
powerenforcer
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Wheeling, IL
Joined: 09.24.2009

Mar 19 @ 2:07 PM ET
Apples and grapes. Fisher's contract ended last season so there was no salary cap hit for Nashville. Any team could have signed him he was a UFA.
- Rota's Rooter


Not true - NAshville had exclusive rights to sign him, since he did not sign retirement papers. That is my point, he didn't retire!
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